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Old 04-02-2007, 09:46 AM   #106
rickf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by East Coast
What would one do with those deflectors cut it off and insert the round end flush with the window and the thin end as close to the inside of the window pointed up and out?

Looking at those cf air deflectors, why not put a 3" pvc plumbing elbow somewhere unobtrusive but into the wind in the lower fairing pointed up in the general direction of the windshield. Closer to the windshield would be better, but we still want to look profeshional.


Only an Adventure rider would buy a $15,000.00 Austrian Masterpiece and run to Home Depot for his aerodynamic mods!

The reason I'm in this thread is that I'm considering adding the big Katoom to the stable but I was worried I'd be the only CHEEP BASTID riding one, no worries now.
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Oh no, Robby's still a pendejo, but he's OUR pendejo!

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Old 04-02-2007, 10:22 AM   #107
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Awesome, carbon fiber Vacume Accessories. AND just in time for my wifes birthday next week.


DW
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Old 04-02-2007, 02:57 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RumRunner
Awesome, carbon fiber Vacume Accessories. AND just in time for my wifes birthday next week.


DW
You've gotta know some race engineer saw that attached to a vacuum and thought "Hey.................."
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Old 04-04-2007, 01:31 PM   #109
East Coast
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Interesting Window Mod.

I came across an interesting window mod elsewhere on this site. I realize its not on an ORANGE bike but the problems are the same. KW's solution looks good to me but check out the lin and see what you "Austrians" think.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...ght=windscreen













Quote:
Originally Posted by Killer Whale KTM
GoNow,
Your solution looks good.I did a very similar job. I now use a C bailys 15 in with an enlargened (bent in ) naca duct with a deflector on the inside to channel the air above my head. It works great !!
Although there are different ways to skin this cat,......I think from my experience and the NUMOROUS posts on the subject, the 2 most effective fixes are 1) let some air through a duct to break up the "dirty" air behind the screen and 2) direct air over your head.
Hope this helps someone !
Killer Whale KTM


I can't sem to get the picture up but here's the link to KW's mod on page 2.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/attac...1&d=1173300270
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Old 04-05-2007, 02:29 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codys
Any more pics from side or front and farther away. Looks pretty clean what you did.
Thank's for the compliment here's another...
Name:  1st April 001.jpg
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Old 04-07-2007, 10:06 AM   #111
Swashplate
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NACA duct update

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swashplate
I am 5-10, XD, stepped/gel seat on a 05 model, tried the TT thing-no good for me. I just did the 2 NACA duct thing last night. That was pretty easy, but have not taken it out for spin yet.

update---

I took her out on the freeway with the 2 NACA duct thing. I belive it works just great. The peak on my XD does not vibrate anymore and it seems like there is smoother airflow as well as less buffeting and noise. Now that is at 65-75 indicated with no cars or truck around, so the air is smooth. Too bad I don't have access to a wind tunnel as that would be the ideal enviroment to test all this stuff.

here is the template I used...

http://kurtisthomas.com/nacaduct.htm

i put a PDF and PPT files there. right click to "save as"
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Old 04-07-2007, 11:06 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swashplate
update---

I took her out on the freeway with the 2 NACA duct thing. I belive it works just great. The peak on my XD does not vibrate anymore and it seems like there is smoother airflow as well as less buffeting and noise. Now that is at 65-75 indicated with no cars or truck around, so the air is smooth. Too bad I don't have access to a wind tunnel as that would be the ideal enviroment to test all this stuff.

here is the template I used...

http://kurtisthomas.com/nacaduct.htm

i put a PDF and PPT files there. right click to "save as"
Hi Kurt
I have just ordered 2 Ducts, Thanks for the template that will save me the hassle. How did you stick the ducts to the screen?
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Old 04-07-2007, 12:37 PM   #113
Swashplate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edster191
Hi Kurt
I have just ordered 2 Ducts, Thanks for the template that will save me the hassle. How did you stick the ducts to the screen?
clear silicone. it will take some bending of the ducts to get them to conform to the arc of the screen. i used a little propane torch to get them to bend. i mean a little! carbon fiber is bad shit if inhaled if you heat it up too much and it burns!!
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Old 04-07-2007, 05:33 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sakurama
This has been discussed endlessly for a few years. Try a search on NACA ducts. Or you can check my old post here or a page I put up on our site here.

Basically this is what you want to do:

This solves the problem.
This mod looks great and the one I'd like to try, once I hopefully get my 990S in 6-8 weeks. The CeeBaileys WideTall worked well for my '02 Tiger but I don't think they look as good on the KTM950/990.

About helmets; by far the quietest helmet I've tried -- to deal with the Tigers awful stock windscreen turbulence -- has been the Shoei X11. The special spoiler on the rear makes a HUGE difference in noise and vibration and where my Arai used to chatter teeth, the Shoei X11 is totally smooth. May not look the Dakar part, but an awesome all-around helmet.

Before I discovered the Shoei X11 I tried Rumble Strips and they helped a bit http://www.rumble-strips.com
Not too sexy, but they did help.

.
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Old 05-23-2007, 12:39 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoNOW
Better wind protection and buffeting:

This is what i'm about to try. I got a message that my second original screen has arrived. I'll post results later this week.
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Old 05-23-2007, 10:32 AM   #116
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I was reading a KLR thread and saw this:

http://www.rumble-strips.com/

I'm not sure if they would help with the buffeting or not, the logic seems sound from the website and for $14 it can't hurt to try I suppose.

I might go to walmart today and see if I can find something to attach to the helmet (hate waiting for stuff to be mailed to try it out... ). It can probably be tested with a strip of weather tape (gah , embarassing though).
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Old 05-27-2007, 08:28 PM   #117
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I think you guys have the right idea- the core issue is the top of the windscreen is too far away from the riders helmet, allowing the vortex coming over and around the screen to collapse into the helmet area. If you have seen a picture of that air, it is apparent that the vortex widens also, it looks just like a tornado spout, with the small end at the top of the screen.
My wife had a similar problem with her strom. After two small screen attempts, I finally cut off the bottom half of an old plexifairing we had laying around. Worked like a dream. The top of the screen was just below eye level. There was some slight wind coming in the tank area though, into the low pressure behind the screen. One of the really nice features of the strom was the exposed mounting brackets for the screen, so the screen to fairng fit was somewhat irrelevant.
The air jet idea (accelerating the air in front or behind the screen in a controled fashion so the air itself acts like a screen, may help for the critical few inches of hieght nessesary. A general venting to help fill the vacuum behind the screen would also help, as the higher pressure air wants to collapse into that area.
The lack of attention given this by the manufacturers is disheartening. Wind tunnel time is very expensive but I would think there must be a cheaper solution than a 500mph + tunnel. This complaint about buffeting is one of the most common issues to come up in forums.
Another idea to keep the top of the fairing closer to the rider is what Ducati did with the multistrada, pivoting the top half of the screen with the bars. It seems the main reason for the distance to the screen on most bike is the bar clearance.
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Old 05-28-2007, 02:05 AM   #118
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Tried the extra original screen mod.
This really works. I can even wear my MX helmet for longer trips.
That's the only pic at the moment I have, it's almost the same as GoNow mod.

(The #45 shoe on the right side is the best mod i ever had - no need for touratech stand extension - i can park my ride even on sand now :P)
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Old 05-28-2007, 05:21 AM   #119
Ricardo Kuhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rad
Gordy, I know this is a bit late, but just holes may not equalize the air pressure. I have seen others use a NACA duct style pattern cut to help the air flow. Ricky did that a few years ago and posted about it.

Here is a stock photo of an after market NACA duct. I have seen tiny ones around someplace.

Wow those are pretty nice, not exactlly cheap, but pretty nice.
Carbon Tricks

I made my "Naca's" FOR THE 950 about one month before I got my first ADVenture in 2004, but i was confident on the result since I have made similar modifications with great improvements since 1996 on my GS's

Here are the first attemp one on my GS with the bicycle rack.



I think is very Important to have a
"Bouncing Wall" for the Air to be Redirect and also speed Up for better effects, so I made another experiment ussing a "Sub-Screen" a old helmet shield, a heat gun and some bicycle chainring bolts.




the Back side, showing the very basic shape of the "kicker wall" screen.



then it came this Two Little Holes that start a whole series of very interesting discussion, when i modified a GS Screen for a very dear friend in about 2001.



Here is a Whole gallery about the "Naca" making process (my own Version, not exactlly NASA Proper).

This is My first KTM screen on early 2004 when i got my first 950 from Boegangles.

I think i was to shy.


Not having the Motorcycle to really measure things did not help, the holes end up a little to low (somehow touching the edge of the dash) to small and also to far apart.


But after all i did not look so bad


I also experiment with a "Kicker box" like on a skateboard ramp to lift and presurize the air upwards and improve the mixture with the air coming above the screen, plus the box will contain the roll chart and other electronic crap, but it was just a waste of space, the angle of viewing for the instruments was all wrong so I abort the mission.





For this new bike i just got two days ago


I'm going to try a little more radical and hopefully more efficient also.

I'm going to try to use the space next to the headlight, located under the horizontal dashboard, that is somehow empty and useless otherwise Making to "TRiangles" (As "Naca" shape as possible, but assimetrical).


But before that I need to studied deeper and see if it can be done with out cutting half the bike (headlight support is kind of weak).

The goal of this is to have the "Kicker" area were does not take any space (Under the dash board) as oppose to above the dashboard were the space for instrument and just for basic visibility is premium, plus hopefully the screen will be even less presurize since the air pick up is at the bottom.

Basically if everything works out, the only thing you will see from the riding position is a pair of 1/2 inch deep by 1.5 wide slots at the very frontal edge of the dashboard and from the windscreen side a pair of "Naca's" but this time next to the headlight as opose to Above the headlight..

Be sure I tell you more when I start the work and hopefully finish it.

So why not Taller..!?!?

As much as I like GoNow aproach, I do intent to ride this "Pre-Crash" 950 in the dirt a lot, and many times before I see my self landing from a jump going a little to far forward (Totally my fault, but it happends), so the last thing I need is a even taller windscreen to cut my nose and/or hit my helmet, so anything taller is just out of the question at least for my own needs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fnckr
Not to go against the common wisdom but the NACA ducts at the front don't seem to be real NACA ducts. They're just a hole with an airstream redirecting wall.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NACA_duct

I don't even think a true NACA duct works here or is even necessary. I'm talking about harnessing the "ram effect" of the air stream to compress air and have it flow faster out of the rear sides, and possibly top, of the windshield to counteract the negative pressure immediately behind the windshield.

The hood is necessary to help gather a large volume of air.

BTW, I found that bending polycarbonate requires some complex techniques. So that's out. I'll see if I can rough something together from something found online.
Fnckr YOu are totally right, Naca's are made to pick up "SUrface Air" not to be right on the leading edge of the Airfoil and I confess maybe I'm gilty of re-name them wrong, since the early discussion on the GS List (1998 or so) when I start to call them "Naca" (just for the shape not the intented use) and everybody follows soon after and keep ussing the same name even if they serve a diferent porpuse.

Circles, Slots, squares, whatever....

I agree again any other shape may work, in fact circular holes are just fine, exept a well made "Naca" will have a "Venturi" effect that will attomize the water droplets so they don't get to your helmet when other cut out shapes will not offer that feature.
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Old 05-28-2007, 10:26 AM   #120
Gordy
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Ricky,

I'm sure glad you got another 950, maybe now you can get this issue solved.

The 950 totally rocks but my ears are still ringing from yesterday again.

Yes.......even with earplugs, street helmet, cut off screen.......... blah.....blah........ blah........
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