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Old 07-19-2009, 07:11 PM   #1516
mulgathumper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfgang55
Is it true...the bike cannot be lowered?

I'm 5'4" & don't need a nose bleed bike but really like the stats on this 450.
It is not true. You can easily lower the bike
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Old 07-19-2009, 07:31 PM   #1517
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mulgathumper
It is not true. You can easily lower the bike

May you should grow some more. One foot on the ground is enough
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Old 07-20-2009, 03:19 AM   #1518
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwiAdventure
May you should grow some more. One foot on the ground is enough
Well if that's the case...
What's.. long..hard and f*cks Kiwis??

3rd grade
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Old 07-20-2009, 07:07 AM   #1519
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mulgathumper
It is not true. You can easily lower the bike
We lowered a G450X almost 2.5",......................the result was NOT GOOD and we raised it back up to oem height. The countershaft needs to be above the rear axle to maintain any traction, as soon as the swing arm is beyond parallel to the ground or countershaft is below the rear axle any and all benefits of the design are out the window!! So that means any lowing of the bike's ride height is not a good solution unless you're just piddling along on fire roads and not needing proper behavior out of it for enduro riding.

What I am noticing is the bike is very sensitive to sag/overall ride height. If it's too soft it feels good but the rear will let loose when you push it (which is typically at the inopportune time mind you) So the bike needs to be sprung and pre-loaded correctly to keep consistant traction where as linkage systems are not as sensitive to traction in regards to ride height or swing arm pitch, but the handling is.
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Old 07-20-2009, 03:40 PM   #1520
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bmw's fly!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-20-2009, 03:42 PM   #1521
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and fall....
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Old 07-20-2009, 05:26 PM   #1522
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW Atlanta
We lowered a G450X almost 2.5",......................the result was NOT GOOD and we raised it back up to oem height. The countershaft needs to be above the rear axle to maintain any traction, as soon as the swing arm is beyond parallel to the ground or countershaft is below the rear axle any and all benefits of the design are out the window!! So that means any lowing of the bike's ride height is not a good solution unless you're just piddling along on fire roads and not needing proper behavior out of it for enduro riding.

What I am noticing is the bike is very sensitive to sag/overall ride height. If it's too soft it feels good but the rear will let loose when you push it (which is typically at the inopportune time mind you) So the bike needs to be sprung and pre-loaded correctly to keep consistant traction where as linkage systems are not as sensitive to traction in regards to ride height or swing arm pitch, but the handling is.
Maybe the handling was degraded by lowering the bike for YOU,.. but how tall are you? Handling dynamics will be different for a heavy tall guy, compared to a short light guy. The traction is no different, as the swingarm is still below the horizontal FOR MY WEIGHT (70kg)
I have had to lower all the bikes that I have owned over the last 20 years or so, because I don't like falling over when you stop at a gate, and don't feel comfortable or confident if I can't easily hold the bike up without having my ass crack in the middle of the seat. I have achieved lowering on previous bikes by various means (lower seats/lowering links/professional fork work etc).
On the G450X,by backing off the preload on the shock, and lifting the forks up in the triple clamps, the bike became very comfortable for ME and actually made the bike turn quicker. I find the handling great ... and would rate it no worse than a WR450. The suspension will bottom out on very big jumps, but again, this happened on my WR450 also.
Maybe a heavy short guy will have trouble with the setup...I don't know.

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Old 07-20-2009, 07:51 PM   #1523
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mulgathumper
Maybe the handling was degraded by lowering the bike for YOU,.. but how tall are you? Handling dynamics will be different for a heavy tall guy, compared to a short light guy. The traction is no different, as the swingarm is still below the horizontal FOR MY WEIGHT (70kg)
I have had to lower all the bikes that I have owned over the last 20 years or so, because I don't like falling over when you stop at a gate, and don't fell comfortable or confident if I can't easily hold the bike up without having my ass crack in the middle of the seat. I have achieved lowering on previous bikes by various means (lower seats/lowering links/professional fork work etc).
On the G450X,by backing off the preload on the shock, and lifting the forks up in the triple clamps, the bike became very comfortable for ME and actually made the bike turn quicker. I find the handling great ... and would rate it no worse than a WR450. The suspension will bottom out on very big jumps, but again, this happened on my WR450 also.
Maybe a heavy short guy will have trouble with the setup...I don't know.
That's not really lowering the bike. We actually rebuilt the shock to limit travel and have a static ride height suitable for a 5'6" rider at 160lbs. We then took the front forks apart and mechanically limited the travel and installed softer springs. Overall result was scary for both the intended rider and everyone who dared try it from our staff.

With your adjustments you probably netted 1" of lowering at best which is not that drastic and reasonable, but 1" isn't much when you're talking that high of a bike to begin with.
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Old 07-20-2009, 07:52 PM   #1524
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mulgathumper
Maybe the handling was degraded by lowering the bike for YOU,.. but how tall are you? Handling dynamics will be different for a heavy tall guy, compared to a short light guy. The traction is no different, as the swingarm is still below the horizontal FOR MY WEIGHT (70kg)
I have had to lower all the bikes that I have owned over the last 20 years or so, because I don't like falling over when you stop at a gate, and don't fell comfortable or confident if I can't easily hold the bike up without having my ass crack in the middle of the seat. I have achieved lowering on previous bikes by various means (lower seats/lowering links/professional fork work etc).
On the G450X,by backing off the preload on the shock, and lifting the forks up in the triple clamps, the bike became very comfortable for ME and actually made the bike turn quicker. I find the handling great ... and would rate it no worse than a WR450. The suspension will bottom out on very big jumps, but again, this happened on my WR450 also.
Maybe a heavy short guy will have trouble with the setup...I don't know.
You will find some of the world top dirt riders have there bikes ajusted the same as you have done lower the bike down the front forks
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Old 07-20-2009, 08:48 PM   #1525
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW Atlanta
That's not really lowering the bike. We actually rebuilt the shock to limit travel and have a static ride height suitable for a 5'6" rider at 160lbs. We then took the front forks apart and mechanically limited the travel and installed softer springs. Overall result was scary for both the intended rider and everyone who dared try it from our staff.

With your adjustments you probably netted 1" of lowering at best which is not that drastic and reasonable, but 1" isn't much when you're talking that high of a bike to begin with.
I posted this picture of my forks a while ago

As you see, it is slipped up in the clamps 50mm.

The static sag on the shock is adjusted to 55mm (a lot more than stock), which gives an overall lowering of a bit over 2 inches. (which is a fair amount)
Suits me well, and handles great

Motorfiets.... Great Pics!!

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Old 07-21-2009, 05:21 AM   #1526
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Originally Posted by mulgathumper
Motorfiets.... Great Pics!!
thank you sir.... great on the rear wheel too!
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Old 07-21-2009, 05:24 AM   #1527
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horrible run-up area for this table top... not even a real track... so nothing was made to transition... but oh well!
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Old 07-21-2009, 07:39 AM   #1528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mulgathumper
I posted this picture of my forks a while ago

As you see, it is slipped up in the clamps 50mm.

The static sag on the shock is adjusted to 55mm (a lot more than stock), which gives an overall lowering of a bit over 2 inches. (which is a fair amount)
Suits me well, and handles great

Motorfiets.... Great Pics!!

You do realize that that you have 30mm of clearance on your front tire at full compression of the front forks with stock travel and forks caps flush with the triple?????? This means if you ever really land a hard one your front tire is going to come to an abrupt stop on your fender and it wont be pretty as your forks want to go 20mm further then your front fender is going to allow with your forks up 50mm in the triple.

Sorry Mulga,.....we both love the G450X but there is no way in hell you could get me to ride your bike with the forks slid up that far,..........it's flat out dangerous given the right circumstances. (I can bottom out the travel with stock set up just on braking alone on the street)
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Old 07-21-2009, 03:00 PM   #1529
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Originally Posted by BMW Atlanta
You do realize that that you have 30mm of clearance on your front tire at full compression of the front forks with stock travel and forks caps flush with the triple?????? This means if you ever really land a hard one your front tire is going to come to an abrupt stop on your fender and it wont be pretty as your forks want to go 20mm further then your front fender is going to allow with your forks up 50mm in the triple.

Sorry Mulga,.....we both love the G450X but there is no way in hell you could get me to ride your bike with the forks slid up that far,..........it's flat out dangerous given the right circumstances. (I can bottom out the travel with stock set up just on braking alone on the street)
No.. I didn't realize that it only had 30mm clearance on the forks. Thanks for the info!
But that being the case, I obviously have not bottomed out the forks yet
because:
a) I haven't had a journey over the bars yet, due to landing a jump or bottoming the fork (but I have had a trip over the bars).

b) There are no telltale signs of black tyre marks on the underside of the front guard (or fender as you Yanks call them) which would be left if the fork bottomed out as you describe. (I went and checked after reading your disturbing post)

Again I reiterate...it is a function of rider weight and the compression setting of the fork. There is NO WAY my fork approaches bottoming even under hard braking when doing a front wheelie. I have the compression wound out 10 clicks.

I made a typo in my previous post regarding the shock sag. The total static sag is 75mm (not 55mm as I posted). I forgot about the 40mm initial sag.

Just the same, I might get a 30mm spacer put into the forks to limit 30mm of travel.

Hey talking about "flat out dangerous"......That could be you on any bike irrespective of setup!

By your posts, I have double the riding time on the G450X than you have. (I'm approaching 80 hours). If this setup was dangerous, I would surely have come to grief by now.

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Old 07-21-2009, 05:36 PM   #1530
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Have you gone through a set of plastics or a rear subframe yet? I've put 30 hours on the bike this month alone and now at just under 1900 miles (I was out of commission for 7 months after shoulder surgery) So I'm just under 50 hours and will be at 80 within the month at this rate, however this isn't my only offroad bike as I have to love on my HP2, HSQ and KTM too. Was supposed to rack up another 5 hours tomorrow, but rear subframe is toast from fatigue (evidently 8lbs of spare fuel tank bolted through the rear fender immediately behind the seat is not a good idea)

My mechanic came up with the front end clearances. It's easy to do though, take the front fork caps loose and then push the front tire all the way up to the bottom out spacer in the forks. See if your tire will indeed hit the fender. 50mm is an awful lot to be sliding up, 10-25mm is common enough though.
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