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Old 05-22-2007, 10:39 AM   #1
WageSlave OP
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It's a sad day in my garage...

... my '03 KTM 640 ADV is in the ICU. The final estimate from 3Brothers Racing to get the bike back on the road is $2,400.00 (that's major scratch for me... I work full time for Saddleback Church, its a great job but noone who works there is there for the salary). The piston rings self destructed. Fortunately there's no secondary damage, but the service department recommends replacing the valves, bearings, and timing chain in addition to repairing the piston and new gaskets. Parts alone add up to $1,400.00 according to their shop manager.

I know I can get the replacement parts for less myself, a 15% discount on KTM parts comes in handy. What I don't know is if I can put the engine back together myself. This is a call out to Creeper, Passmore, Surfphoto, Meat Popsicle, and the rest of ya'll who have more experience with this sort of thing than I do. I'm no slouch with a torque wrench, I've got DustJunkie on my side for help as well.

Should I tackle this and put her back together myself or is it time to face the music and part her out for sale? If it weren't for the piston rings she'd be in incredible shape, I've really taken good care of her.

I'll be picking her up this afternoon; the various pieces of her that is.

It is truely a sad day in my garage!



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Old 05-22-2007, 10:44 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WageSlave
I know I can get the replacement parts for less myself, a 15% discount on KTM parts comes in handy. What I don't know is if I can put the engine back together myself. This is a call out to Creeper, Passmore, Surfphoto, Meat Popsicle, and the rest of ya'll who have more experience with this sort of thing than I do. I'm no slouch with a torque wrench, I've got DustJunkie on my side for help as well.

Should I tackle this and put her back together myself or is it time to face the music and part her out for sale? If it weren't for the piston rings she'd be in incredible shape, I've really taken good care of her.

I'll be picking her up this afternoon; the various pieces of her that is.

It is truely a sad day in my garage!
Yes you can and should... I'd be happy to walk you thru the process.
I have a head, valves, springs and such if you need them.
If the head needs rebuilding (which I find hard to believe... mileage?) I'll rebuild it for you... cheap.

Cam chain... why?

Addendum: Almost missed it... repairing the piston?
They want to replace a bunch of shit that had no collateral damage... but they want to repair the piston. WTFIT?

Back to you WS
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Old 05-22-2007, 10:50 AM   #3
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Thank you Creeper, that's the encouragement I needed to hear!

I'm definitely picking the bike up today. She'll be home this evening. I have the full repair manual on disk as well so I can refer to it for the engine reassembly. Having your expertise to call on is greatly appreciated, as well as the expertise of the other members here.

She's got about 6K miles on her, 7K tops. I can't recall at the moment, she's been out of commission for a few months while I was trying to save up the cash to get her into the shop.

The estimate most likely included replacing the piston, rather than repairing it. I was spinning a bit at the $2,400.00 quote as the rest was explained.
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WageSlave screwed with this post 05-22-2007 at 10:57 AM
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Old 05-22-2007, 11:02 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WageSlave
I have the full repair manual on disk as well so I can refer to it for the engine reassembly.
Time to read all things pertaining to the top-end. Make notes of everything you don't understand or seems a bit odd. Those questions can be answered as the job comes up.

When you go to pick up your shit... have the service manager, or more likely a tech explain to you exactly why they want to replace what they want to replace.
Take notes or tape the conversation... you won't remember this shit later.
Did they offer an explanation of why the rings failed? This is not a very common occurrence.

The most difficult thing for you will be (unless you have the equipment) measuring things.

Bolting and un-bolting is no biggie. Patience, cleanliness and "exactitudeness" is the cornerstone of this job. (Yes... it's a word )

Take photos of everything that is suspect.

If you need all the bits thay say you do... then all you're saving is the labor, which can stll account for at least half the jobs value. And... if you do it yourself, you get smarter in the process.

Press on...
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Old 05-22-2007, 11:04 AM   #5
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Just another example in a long line of Creeper being THEE MAN!
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Old 05-22-2007, 11:05 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by husky123
Just another example in a long line of Creeper being THEE MAN!
Shut up you... or I'll recall your seat.
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Old 05-22-2007, 11:07 AM   #7
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for a couple hundred $$ you can get some pretty good quality measuring tools (vernier's, micrometer, bore gauge) not tools you would use everyday, but it's not like they will go bad, just have to learn how to use them properly
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Old 05-22-2007, 11:12 AM   #8
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I'm taking notes!

Dustjunkie quite likely has every tool that I don't, including precision measuring tools. I also have a close friend who is a machinist, I can rely on him for any such precision measuring tool(s) that I may not have immediate access to.

This will be interesting, but I like challenges. Nothing gets done right unless we do it ourselves, or so I've heard.

There was no explanation as to what may have caused the rings to break up. Fortunately there was no additional damage (no scoring of the cylinder, etc.).
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WageSlave screwed with this post 05-22-2007 at 11:34 AM
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Old 05-22-2007, 01:42 PM   #9
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You should definitely tackle this, worse case scenario you speed up the parting out process. In all seriousness this should not be that difficult, you'll likely surprise yourself. PM Laramie LC4, he has taken his apart a few times and knows his way around that engine.
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Old 05-22-2007, 03:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WageSlave

She's got about 6K miles on her, 7K tops. I can't recall at the moment, she's been out of commission for a few months while I was trying to save up the cash to get her into the shop.
Is there more to this story.... I absolutely lust after KTMs and a LC4 in particular so please tell me that this was operator error, brain fart or something.... I wish I could help. No experience with the LC4 but pretty good with a wrench but I am in Indiana. Good luck with the project.
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Old 05-22-2007, 03:59 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WageSlave
The final estimate from 3Brothers Racing to get the bike back on the road is $2,400.00

you can get a whole KLR for that!









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Old 05-22-2007, 04:02 PM   #12
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Any idea *why* the rings grenaded?



Sorta sounds like a case of detonation wherein the piston and rings took an asswhoopin'. The bore would be suspect too. On the other hand, if your crank bearings died, you had an oiling problem that caused all of this.

The spooky thing is it sounds very close to what happened to my '03, and it turned out to be a bad case half that precluded one of the Eaton pumps from doing anything productive. The thing ran for 3k before it blew up.

My other '03 that came from the West Coast suffered a ring failure also, but KTM fixed that one under warranty and wouldn't come clean on what they found.

Please keep us infomed of the findings as you're not the only one to have issues with the LC4 motor, and your experience, albeit sucky, might help the next poor slob.

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Old 05-22-2007, 04:09 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by gaspipe
Any idea *why* the rings grenades?
What... never heard of "ring monsters"?

OK... it's a pizza, but it is round and being eaten.
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Old 05-22-2007, 04:31 PM   #14
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I just got done doing the same thing to mine, i have extra gaskets etc.

Yours for the cause.

Give me a call (pmd the number to you)
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Old 05-22-2007, 04:31 PM   #15
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What... never heard of "ring monsters"?

OK... it's a pizza, but it is round and being eaten.
Pac Man Fever.
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