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Old 05-27-2015, 12:57 PM   #1
steve o 77 OP
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XR650R won't idle and billows black smoke/sweet gunshot sounds

Hey guys, I've been searching all over for a solution to this.

It all started when I decided to soak the carb in pinesol due to the previous owner letting it sit for a long time. The bike ran ok but the idle was erratic.

Anyway I fully tore the carb down and soaked everything overnight. The next day after carefully re-assembling it the bike was extremely hard to start (needed about 1/4 throttle to get her going) and wouldn't idle at all. It also rolled some serious coal.

So I immediately diagnose that as the pilot circuit being clogged up. So I pull the carb back apart and intensely clean every port with carb cleaner/compressed air, making sure every orifice flows air. I even pulled the pilot screw out and cleaned in there. I also cleaned and inspected the automatic pilot rubber diaphragm thingy for holes, all was good. The bike still won't run run and is just waaaaay too rich when I keep it running with 1/4 throttle.

Anyone have any ideas? During the carb clean I also pulled the stator cover to see what stator I have (stock) and adjusted the valves. The intake valves were .001" tight and the exhaust were fine. I doubt either of those could be the culprit.

Anyway I would appreciate some insight! I'm really close to just ordering a TM40 :

Also some detailes on the bike. Bone stock 2005 other than being uncorked running the 68s pilot, stock neede on 3rd clip, and 175 main.
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Old 05-27-2015, 01:04 PM   #2
mcma111
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Sounds like a plugged pilot jet. Can you SEE through the pilot jet hole???
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Old 05-27-2015, 02:00 PM   #3
steve o 77 OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcma111 View Post
Sounds like a plugged pilot jet. Can you SEE through the pilot jet hole???
Yes sir, pilot is good, as are the orfices around it. I'm almost wondering if it could be something electrical.
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Old 05-27-2015, 02:43 PM   #4
justlookin
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I see you are in Columbus - I have a brand new original carb that you can try if you don't get yours figured out - at least that would tell you for sure if carb or electric. I put the Mikuni on before I ever rode mine in 2007. I am in Florida on vacation at the moment but I will be back in Ohio first part of next week.
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Old 05-27-2015, 02:51 PM   #5
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Sounds like the choke is on or the air cleaner might be plugged. Float level to high. just some ideas to check. You might want to disconnect the air cleaner and see if its better. Might want to check for critter nest in the intake and exhaust. If that's all good it's probably a carby problem for sure.
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Old 05-27-2015, 02:54 PM   #6
steve o 77 OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justlookin View Post
I see you are in Columbus - I have a brand new original carb that you can try if you don't get yours figured out - at least that would tell you for sure if carb or electric. I put the Mikuni on before I ever rode mine in 2007. I am in Florida on vacation at the moment but I will be back in Ohio first part of next week.
Thanks for the tips guys.

Float is at 18mm with the little spring loaded pin not compressed.

Justlookin, I'll let you know if I don't get it figured out by then. Thanks for the offer!
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Old 05-27-2015, 05:57 PM   #7
adam728
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Black smoke means way, way rich. A plugged pilot would be lean.

Float height might be good, but that doesn't mean the needle and seat aren't leaking. I'd put my money on a flooding carb.
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Old 05-27-2015, 08:00 PM   #8
XFanMan
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Is this a new bike for you? I ask because you mention the previous owner letting it sit. The choke in the up (horizontal) position is on. Vertical is off. Common mistake for new owners. Carry on if you already know this
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Old 05-27-2015, 09:28 PM   #9
MCVL
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How many turns on the fuel screw? Did you also clean it? You might need to adjust it
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Old Yesterday, 06:51 AM   #10
grigby
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I had the same problem after cleaning the carb, check the "needle jet", I believe it may have fallen out, see attached photo.
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Old Yesterday, 06:52 AM   #11
steve o 77 OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam728 View Post
Black smoke means way, way rich. A plugged pilot would be lean.

Float height might be good, but that doesn't mean the needle and seat aren't leaking. I'd put my money on a flooding carb.
Hmm, good point. I didn't really clean the needle seat. The needle valve itself looks great but maybe the seat is effed up with pine sol gunk now. I'll check this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by XFanMan View Post
Is this a new bike for you? I ask because you mention the previous owner letting it sit. The choke in the up (horizontal) position is on. Vertical is off. Common mistake for new owners. Carry on if you already know this
Haha I was extremely confused when I first bought the bike. Before the cleaning it would start right up with the choke on, then I would immediately turn the choke off after it fired and let it idle to warm up. same procedure now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MCVL View Post
How many turns on the fuel screw? Did you also clean it? You might need to adjust it
1.75 turns out and yes I pulled it and cleaned the crap out of it. It's the same setting the bike had before the cleaning.

I'm going to try the needle seat cleaning when I get home and maybe try messing with the fuel screw. I'll update with results.
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Old Yesterday, 07:16 AM   #12
grigby
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Sorry, to be clear. I believe you reassembled the carb without the Needle Jet installed. It's most likely in your cleaning container or dropped on the floor during cleaning. The Needle jet Holder can be screwed in without the Needle jet. To confirm, look in the bore while lifting the throttle slide, there should be a brass jet at the base where the jet needle lifts out of the carb base. I'm sure you will see that it's missing.
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Old Yesterday, 10:27 AM   #13
steve o 77 OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigby View Post
Sorry, to be clear. I believe you reassembled the carb without the Needle Jet installed. It's most likely in your cleaning container or dropped on the floor during cleaning. The Needle jet Holder can be screwed in without the Needle jet. To confirm, look in the bore while lifting the throttle slide, there should be a brass jet at the base where the jet needle lifts out of the carb base. I'm sure you will see that it's missing.
Holy crap. I think this is it! I'll take a look when I get home from work.
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Old Yesterday, 04:22 PM   #14
steve o 77 OP
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Well that's the problem...



Now to search everywhere for the missing needle jet. Might have to break down and buy one, looks like they're almost $30 at bikebandit!
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Old Yesterday, 04:26 PM   #15
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That thing would be impossible to diagnose by the average man. I bet more than one bike was given up on with such a problem.
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