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Old 01-27-2012, 08:43 PM   #421
Poolside
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Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post

Can you tell us do-it-yourselfers what this magic, non-professional, fairly stiff rubbery goo is, for those of us that don't care what upper level management thinks is too un-famous to use, even though it's perfect for the application?
The 1-part product DaBit is talking about sounds like a vinyl-silicone caulking compound. In the paint department at the hardware store.


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During working hours I design electronics. Also for industrial, marine and railway applications. This means that sometimes heavy or tall components on the circuit borards need additional fixing to withstand vibration and shock.

Now, I cannot use this stuff professionally since the brand name is associated with do-it-yourself which makes the stuff 'not professional', and there is no decent datasheet which makes it even more 'not professional'.
Loctite makes something called Tak Pak electronic assembly adhesive. It's a CA (aka super glue) product, and there's a pre-treat surface cure accelerant available. But it's mainly to hold things like connectors and large components in place until they are soldered. Tak Pak is brittle and the part will snap off easily, but holds just fine for assembly processes.

For a flexible material with a faster cure there are 2-part silicones and 2-part urethanes that cure very quickly. In all different viscosities, and thixotropic paste.


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Old 01-28-2012, 12:35 AM   #422
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Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post

Can you tell us do-it-yourselfers what this magic, non-professional, fairly stiff rubbery goo is, for those of us that don't care what upper level management thinks is too un-famous to use, even though it's perfect for the application?
It is called Bison Polymax, which is a 'all in 1' product (glue, seal, etc.) based on 'modified silicone polymers'. Available in almost every hardware store here in The Netherlands.
Since Bison is a Dutch manufacturer and the MS polymer based stuff is available from many other manufacturers it is probably not worth searching for exact this product.

However, it works very well. The 'glueing' properties are excellent and it is just rubbery enough but not as soft as a regular silicone caulk.

Quote:
Loctite makes something called Tak Pak electronic assembly adhesive. It's a CA (aka super glue) product, and there's a pre-treat surface cure accelerant available.
I do not need a glue for assembly, I need extra reinforcement after assembly is complete. When PCB surface area is limited and temperatures are low, I am forced to use for example tall capacitors with a small diameter. These things are fairly heavy and are often only fixed using two mounting pins. The correct solution would be to use less tall and wider ccapacitors with three or more connections, but oh well, engineering is all about balances and tradeoffs.

I do not prefer a CA base. Too brittle, and CA-based adhesives tend to fume and deposit white stuff around the bond. In my opinion a little flex is good.

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For a flexible material with a faster cure there are 2-part silicones and 2-part urethanes that cure very quickly. In all different viscosities, and thixotropic paste.
Yes, but which one would be the best compromise between ease of use, bond strength, curing time, temperature range, etc.? A single component product would be preferred since it is often required to glue just one component during touchup or rework.

Still no call from Loctite Belgium/Netherlands. I think they don't need another customer :(
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Old 01-28-2012, 12:56 AM   #423
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Regarding your "Which would be best?" question, you're asking me which bond strength, curing time, temperature range that you want?

Loctite makes a two-part Hysol Epoxy Adhesive, one type is flexible, and the product comes in a twin-syringe package.


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Old 01-28-2012, 06:25 AM   #424
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Guys The MS Polymers are what is called a modified silane-think of it as a flexible adhesive that can bond substrates like granite, wood, metal, fiberglass, lots of different kinds of plastics, glass (especially tough because it's technically a liquid believe it or not) and many other substrates. If you didn't know any different, based on its flexibility, you'd think an MS Polymer is an RTV silicone. Well, it's not. During the curing process MS Polymers don't out gas acetic acid gas like an acetoxy--cure silicone RTV. MS Polymers do not stand up to fuels, oils, ethylene glycols, etc., like oxime cure silicone RTV's do (referenced earlier in this thread) They typically have a much lower upper temperature resistance (right at 200F) compared to acetoxy cure and oxime cure RTV silicones. Another nifty quality MS-Polymers have over all RTV silicones is that they can be painted. You can't paint over RTV's.

We have a customer who is using an MS Polymer to bond the outer body skins of an armored military vehicle-so it's pretty strong-for a one part product.

The Tac Pac is a wire tacking instant adhesive. Instant Adhesives (cyanoacrylate) for the most part are pretty brittle and have a limited cure-through gap capability. Cleavage and peel forces are a CA's weak spot. Wire tacking is when you route a wire on an integrated circuit board to follow a certain path, or have to tack a wire on the board to keep it from moving about. It's cool- you position the wire on a board, place a drop of the CA on the wire, then you do a quick spray of an accelerator. Normally CA's take a full 24 hours to cure, but once the accelerator hits the uncured CA, it cures as fast as you can spit.

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Old 01-28-2012, 11:53 AM   #425
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaBit View Post
It is called Bison Polymax, which is a 'all in 1' product (glue, seal, etc.) based on 'modified silicone polymers'. Available in almost every hardware store here in The Netherlands.
Since Bison is a Dutch manufacturer and the MS polymer based stuff is available from many other manufacturers it is probably not worth searching for exact this product.

However, it works very well. The 'glueing' properties are excellent and it is just rubbery enough but not as soft as a regular silicone caulk.
Thank you.
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Old 01-28-2012, 06:00 PM   #426
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hey Dirty, any chance you guys sell the red stuff in indo? broke a stud on the bike yesterday and a combination of tension and friction are the only things holding the new one in place at the moment.
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Old 01-29-2012, 07:47 AM   #427
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hey Dirty, any chance you guys sell the red stuff in indo? broke a stud on the bike yesterday and a combination of tension and friction are the only things holding the new one in place at the moment.
Indo? Indonesia or Australia? "Red stuff" are you talking about a threadlocker?

I know we sell most all of the stuff in either place, but let me know where you are so I can offer up a part number.

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Old 01-30-2012, 04:10 PM   #428
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Originally Posted by dirty_sanchez View Post
Indo? Indonesia or Australia? "Red stuff" are you talking about a threadlocker?

I know we sell most all of the stuff in either place, but let me know where you are so I can offer up a part number.

Dirty
yeah sorry, Indonesia and red stuff threadlocker
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Old 02-08-2012, 12:13 PM   #429
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what's the loctite product for oil pan sealing compound? i have a set of case halves that are leaking oil (2 stroke - not pressurized...) - i'd rather not split right now and fix - once i get in there, i will probably find a bunch of NLA parts i need to replace. is there something that works that is not impossible to remove later - when i actually tear it apart? something i can just smear on the seam that will stop a drip, that i can clean off later?


loctite 5900? easy removal later???
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Old 02-08-2012, 04:33 PM   #430
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yeah sorry, Indonesia and red stuff threadlocker
Worldwide availability products with part numbers your local authorized distributor can look up are?

pn. 1330583 263, a General Purpose High Strength Primerless Red threadlocker, good for 300F
pn. 27240 272, a High temp High Strength Red threadlocker, good for 450F

Try this link for local stockists for Indonesia:

http://www.loctite.sg/cps/rde/xchg/h...6_SEA_HTML.htm

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Old 02-08-2012, 04:42 PM   #431
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what's the loctite product for oil pan sealing compound? i have a set of case halves that are leaking oil (2 stroke - not pressurized...) - i'd rather not split right now and fix - once i get in there, i will probably find a bunch of NLA parts i need to replace. is there something that works that is not impossible to remove later - when i actually tear it apart? something i can just smear on the seam that will stop a drip, that i can clean off later?


loctite 5900? easy removal later???
Not many folks are going to stock 5900. It's a great choice, but you're going to have an easier time finding:

pn. 59830 598 Black, 70ml tube, Excellent Oil Resistance, Non-Corrosive, and good to 625F
pn. 40479 Instant Gasket, 190ml Aerosol Can, Increased Oil Resistance, Non-Corrosive, , good to 500F

About 6 years back I was in the same boat as you with the Chain Saw. It's an old Homelite/Sears and just about as fast as I'd fill it up with gas, the gas would leak out of the seam where the case halfs mated. I emptied the tank, wiped off the grunge and cleaned as much of the bottom of the case off with contact cleaner, let dry, then drew a bead of 598 the entire length of the case seam as I could reach.

I let it sit upside down undisturbed overnight, filled her up, fired her up, and she still doesn't leak a bit of gas after 6 years.

As a reminder-any RTV that has a vinegar smell won't stand up to fuels, oils, coolant, etc. Vinegar smelling RTV's outgas acetic acid gas and can corrode enclosed electrical components. Both RTV's I suggested above don't have the vinegar smell (or any smell at all) and are considered Oxime Cure Non-Corrosive RTV's

I'd go the 598 route.

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Old 02-08-2012, 05:38 PM   #432
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gonna try 598 - solvent for it? on second thought isn't 598 just black rtv? is there a perhaps better product i can use???
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Old 02-08-2012, 06:23 PM   #433
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Hey Dirty, this may have been answered here before, but I didn't see it. What's the best product for cases on the old british motors? I have a TRW250 I'm rebuilding and don't want it to leak oil.
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Old 02-08-2012, 06:38 PM   #434
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Hey Dirty, this may have been answered here before, but I didn't see it. What's the best product for cases on the old british motors? I have a TRW250 I'm rebuilding and don't want it to leak oil.
I personally use 515. It seals perfectly, and I build Brit engines that don't leak a drop.
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Old 02-08-2012, 07:07 PM   #435
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I gotta Q for DS. We are using loctite for some high speed steel bushings into aluminum. The aluminum is worn. We tried red 272 loctite and a few bushings made their way out of place. We have some 620 green stuff and I tried that. I used the primer first on both surfaces too (glass bottle with top brush).

What should work best? Another suggestion?
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