ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Thumpers
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-19-2012, 08:24 AM   #3136
kwakbiker
Studly Adventurer
 
kwakbiker's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Birmingham,UK
Oddometer: 603
Id go with new carb to head boots as well, see if the rubber is peeling away from the ally where they bolt to the head
__________________
2007 Versys

More fun being upright
kwakbiker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2012, 08:53 AM   #3137
StuartL
n00b
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Location: West Berkshire, UK
Oddometer: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwakbiker View Post
Id go with new carb to head boots as well, see if the rubber is peeling away from the ally where they bolt to the head
I had this problem recently, although I caught it before any real problems showed themselves. I just re-sealed the boots to the ally with some high temp silicone sealant. It has held on the one (40 mile) trip I've taken the bike out since then.

The surgery was pretty easy, I cleaned up the ally and rubber thoroughly, chucked them through the dishwasher, cleaned and dried them, applied the silicone liberally, clamped it up, wiped off excess and left it 24 hours.
StuartL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2012, 09:06 AM   #3138
SkidMarx
Beastly Adventurer
 
SkidMarx's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Ortonville, MI
Oddometer: 1,571
Quote:
Originally Posted by StuartL View Post
I had this problem recently, although I caught it before any real problems showed themselves. I just re-sealed the boots to the ally with some high temp silicone sealant. It has held on the one (40 mile) trip I've taken the bike out since then.

The surgery was pretty easy, I cleaned up the ally and rubber thoroughly, chucked them through the dishwasher, cleaned and dried them, applied the silicone liberally, clamped it up, wiped off excess and left it 24 hours.
FWIW, This will only work as a temp fix if it's already leaking. Many people have tried this including me (a few times), but none have lasted. Once the corrosion gets between the Aluminium and rubber, you can't stop it from causing devulcanization.

By doing it before it started leaking, you likely bought yourself some time, but that's all.
__________________
'90 XT350
'08 WR250R
GLDS
SkidMarx is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2012, 09:20 AM   #3139
Coots
That's what she said
 
Coots's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: Spokane, WA
Oddometer: 155
1+ on carb boots

Best price I have found on the carb boots is boats.net also check your air filter, if it is like mine (stock) it does not take much to starve.

Just wondering what mods people have done to take out that worthless stock filter and use a Unifilter.
__________________
Coots Jr is just a younger me!

03 DL1000 "Bumble Bee"
91 XT600
03 SV650S SOLD
Coots is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2012, 12:34 PM   #3140
Grreatdog
Beastly Adventurer
 
Grreatdog's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Annapolis, MD
Oddometer: 9,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indiesol View Post
.....Obviously I'll check the fuel valve as well, but this will be the first time I've taken the carbs apart on this bike. Any tips or tricks? Any chance I can avoid having to sync these things? I sometimes have a hard time with that part. I seem to remember reading somewhere in this thread about carefully removing the link between the two carbs? Can anyone expand on that a bit ? Thanks.
Nothing to the sync. It is just a cable adjustment at the linkage. Unless you really change that it won't make much difference.

As for taking them apart, there is a small rubber hose that connects the float bowl to the secondary. If the carbs are on your workbench you will see it. But if you try to pull the float with the carbs on the bike you might not see it and end up bending the float out of adjustment.

Which brings up the most important point: be careful not to bend the float out of adjustment. It is almost impossible to readjust. I am not not exaggerating, it really is almost impossible to adjust the float height. You need a special tool and it is done with the carb assembled and on the bike.

All that said, did you unscrew the gas cap when it started acting up? I know the Clarke tank has a normal vent hose so venting shouldn't be an issue at the cap. But early XT350's had a TSB about bad carb vent tube routing that would cause stalling. It acted exactly like you described.

The Clarke tank should also prevent the most common cause of clogging which is tank rust. But pull the fuel tap out anyway and check the screens to make sure they aren't clogged with goo, dirt or rust. Even though the Clarke won't rust you may have picked up bad gas somewhere.

As for the boots, test before you replace. Spray carb cleaner around them with the bike running. If the idle doesn't change look elsewhere for your problem. Yes, they need to be replaced eventually. But my point is to find this problem by doing the easy stuff before opening up the carbs.
__________________
640E, MXC200, XT200

Grreatdog screwed with this post 11-19-2012 at 12:43 PM
Grreatdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2012, 07:08 PM   #3141
kaisan
n00b
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Oddometer: 3
HELP bike not starting

Just got a new xt350 for my son for Christmas.I traded a boat for it.The guy said it needed a carb kit.I took his word for it.
Didnt start when I got it.
Got the carb kit istalled.Tried to start it(good compression,fat spark,air filter off.I just get a pop or backfire out the exaust once in a while.No change if I drop some gas in the head??
Please give me some ideas,?timing off,rings??Im lost.
Thanks Jim
kaisan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 02:31 AM   #3142
Lenz1
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jul 2010
Location: Queensland Australia
Oddometer: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grreatdog View Post
Nothing to the sync. It is just a cable adjustment at the linkage. Unless you really change that it won't make much difference.

As for taking them apart, there is a small rubber hose that connects the float bowl to the secondary. If the carbs are on your workbench you will see it. But if you try to pull the float with the carbs on the bike you might not see it and end up bending the float out of adjustment.

Which brings up the most important point: be careful not to bend the float out of adjustment. It is almost impossible to readjust. I am not not exaggerating, it really is almost impossible to adjust the float height. You need a special tool and it is done with the carb assembled and on the bike.

All that said, did you unscrew the gas cap when it started acting up? I know the Clarke tank has a normal vent hose so venting shouldn't be an issue at the cap. But early XT350's had a TSB about bad carb vent tube routing that would cause stalling. It acted exactly like you described.

The Clarke tank should also prevent the most common cause of clogging which is tank rust. But pull the fuel tap out anyway and check the screens to make sure they aren't clogged with goo, dirt or rust. Even though the Clarke won't rust you may have picked up bad gas somewhere.

As for the boots, test before you replace. Spray carb cleaner around them with the bike running. If the idle doesn't change look elsewhere for your problem. Yes, they need to be replaced eventually. But my point is to find this problem by doing the easy stuff before opening up the carbs.

GD whats the big difficulty in setting the float heights ?

I just pulled the primary off, removed the bowl, tipped the carbie upside down and carefully fixed it in an approx level position. A vise is fine if you're careful what is being gripped ie only grip non critical casting protusions.

The manual says to adjust at the central "tang" that touches the end of the needle/seat but a central adjustment approach does not correct easily for floats that are at different heights :

The carbie should be inverted to lightly close the needle/seat.

Leave the central tang alone and adjust each float height individually by using two needle nose pliers and bending the float plate at the outer 90 arm of the plate. To do this, use one clamp / pliers to hold the float plate steady at a point central of the 90 then the other pliers to very carefully bend the outer leg of the float plate to adjust the float ht. The correct distance is 26mm +/- 2.5mm from the top of the now inverted float to the metal face that mates with the bowl. Best tool for the measuring is a digital caliper using the central slide protusion.

Since the secondary doesn't have a float then it's just one side to mess with as far as float level.

The reason for adjusting the floats individually is to ensure they both end up at the correct height - attempting to take out any dislevellment between the two floats with a central adjustment would require minute twist of the central tang - too hard.

Fuel level also is easy with a clear plastic hose off the bowl drain port. Carbie on the engine, carbie level front to back. Adjust the central tang for correct fuel level after the float height adjustment.

Simple is good

Lenz1 screwed with this post 11-25-2012 at 02:35 AM Reason: edit
Lenz1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 07:17 AM   #3143
kwakbiker
Studly Adventurer
 
kwakbiker's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Birmingham,UK
Oddometer: 603
Whats the condition of the rubbers from the carb to the head, common failing point and causes issues
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaisan View Post
Just got a new xt350 for my son for Christmas.I traded a boat for it.The guy said it needed a carb kit.I took his word for it.
Didnt start when I got it.
Got the carb kit istalled.Tried to start it(good compression,fat spark,air filter off.I just get a pop or backfire out the exaust once in a while.No change if I drop some gas in the head??
Please give me some ideas,?timing off,rings??Im lost.
Thanks Jim
__________________
2007 Versys

More fun being upright
kwakbiker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 08:39 AM   #3144
Grreatdog
Beastly Adventurer
 
Grreatdog's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Annapolis, MD
Oddometer: 9,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lenz1 View Post
GD whats the big difficulty in setting the float heights ?
If you think setting the float height with the bike level, the carbs installed and assembled using a clear plastic hose is simple then you a lot more patience than I do.

Every time you make a float height adjustment you have to pull the float bowl off, do a litle bending, reassemble the carb, put the tube back on, remeasure, disassemble again, adjust again, reassemble again, test with the tube again, repeat until you get it right by closing in on the right setting by pure guess work.

To me, anything that requires such a healthy dose of pure dumb luck to get right is not simple. My two KTM's, my Honda, my Kawasakis and my other Yamaha are and were all simple workbench measurements. No tubes, no guesswork and no working with the carbs installed. That is simple. The YDIS way is just plain stupid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaisan View Post
Just got a new xt350 for my son for Christmas.I traded a boat for it.The guy said it needed a carb kit.I took his word for it.
Didnt start when I got it.
Got the carb kit istalled.Tried to start it(good compression,fat spark,air filter off.I just get a pop or backfire out the exaust once in a while.No change if I drop some gas in the head??
Please give me some ideas,?timing off,rings??Im lost.
Thanks Jim
Don't use raw gas. Besdies being dangerous it is a good way to hydrolock the piston. There is almost no squish space for liquid in there. Do yourself a favor and buy a can of starting fluid. You are going to need it with that YDIS carb. Just whiff is all it takes.

I have said this several times in this thread. a gummed up YDIS carb is very hard for a home mechanic to clean without an ultrasonic cleaner. After mine was stolen and left in some woods for a year I got it to what I thought was surgical clean and it wouldn't run.

I took it to a shop and a few hours in the ultrasonic tank cleared it up.
__________________
640E, MXC200, XT200

Grreatdog screwed with this post 11-25-2012 at 08:46 AM
Grreatdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 09:54 AM   #3145
kaisan
n00b
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Oddometer: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwakbiker View Post
Whats the condition of the rubbers from the carb to the head, common failing point and causes issues
Yah brand new carb rubbers,Plug is wet with gas,but just doesnt want to fire.Even took the exaust off figured it was pluged.
What else could I check?
kaisan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 10:04 AM   #3146
StuartL
n00b
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Location: West Berkshire, UK
Oddometer: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaisan View Post
Yah brand new carb rubbers,Plug is wet with gas,but just doesnt want to fire.Even took the exaust off figured it was pluged.
What else could I check?
Are you getting air?
StuartL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 01:22 PM   #3147
LanaTheGreat
Adventurer
 
LanaTheGreat's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2011
Location: Durban, South Africa
Oddometer: 23
Attachments

I just spent an hour of my life trying to upload a picture of the XT350 toolkit, just to see at the bottom that I cannot post attachments. Any reason for this? Mods?
LanaTheGreat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 01:59 PM   #3148
kaisan
n00b
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Oddometer: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by StuartL View Post
Are you getting air?
Tried with the filter out.
When I kick it I just get the odd loud bang out the exhaust.
kaisan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2012, 04:23 PM   #3149
Grreatdog
Beastly Adventurer
 
Grreatdog's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Annapolis, MD
Oddometer: 9,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by LanaTheGreat View Post
I just spent an hour of my life trying to upload a picture of the XT350 toolkit, just to see at the bottom that I cannot post attachments. Any reason for this? Mods?
Use a hosting site.
__________________
640E, MXC200, XT200
Grreatdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2012, 02:01 AM   #3150
Lenz1
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jul 2010
Location: Queensland Australia
Oddometer: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grreatdog View Post
..............Every time you make a float height adjustment you have to pull the float bowl off, do a litle bending, reassemble the carb, put the tube back on, remeasure, disassemble again, adjust again, reassemble again, test with the tube again, repeat until you get it right by closing in on the right setting by pure guess work.

To me, anything that requires such a healthy dose of pure dumb luck to get right is not simple. My two KTM's, my Honda, my Kawasakis and my other Yamaha are and were all simple workbench measurements. No tubes, no guesswork and no working with the carbs installed. That is simple. The YDIS way is just plain stupid.......
GD - the float height adjustment is absolutely a workbench measurement procedure.

The manual advises the primary carbie be removed from the engine and inverted with the bowl removed prior to checking / adjustment of the float height (hard to measure the float heights without the bowl off) The implied outcome from the manual is that setting the float height correctly will produce the required fuel height of 6mm +/- 0.5mm below the metal face of the carbie body.

My take on this is the fuel height measurement is a prior test to see if there is a problem either with the needle/seat not sealing (slow flooding ?) or the floats are not at the correct height. Just adjust the floats individually on the bench as I described a little earlier, get them spot on and unless you've got a faulty seal at the needle /seat the fuel level will be correct.

So the question must be asked - what is the reason or trigger for a float height adjustment ? In my case I didn't bother with a fuel height measurement prior to molesting the float height because the carbie was in bits anyway for cleaning after a 5 year shed storage of the bike - in fact the whole fucking bike has been in bits and re-assembled - but more betta ....

Lenz1 screwed with this post 11-26-2012 at 02:07 AM Reason: edit
Lenz1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 09:15 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014