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Old 12-10-2007, 05:21 PM   #46
Putts OP
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BTW Good Till, what's the "Till" bit? My name is Tyll. Do we have something in common?

Crapping my own thread, I suppose. Who gives a fuck? Who's gonna tell the boss on me?

Fuck'em!
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Old 12-10-2007, 05:47 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodTill
Putts

I have a set of ER6i and have used them for a bit. My issue is that I do a lot of long distance riding and the ER6i would come dislodged from my ear on the road. So now I have music in my left ear and a unconfortable thing in my right ear and 200 more miles left in the tank.

I went for helmet speakers ( Autocom ) and they just suck. No sound quality at all. I even wired in a CMOY amp to try to get them to sound better. I think those Autocom are a high impedance type cause the amp had a realy bad time with them. It works so much better with the ER6i's

My question is what is a good speaker to put in my helmet?

I would like high effeciant say 90db and keep the impedance reasonable.

I would not mind buying a good set of phones and butchering them into my helmet.

Check out under my screen name.

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Old 12-10-2007, 06:02 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodTill
Check out under my screen name.

.... duh ....
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Old 12-10-2007, 08:09 PM   #49
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Ok, so here's my two cents - be gentle it's my first post.

When riding I always ride with plugs of some kind, usually drug store foamies since they're cheap and redily available. If I'm taking a longer ride I'll sometimes consider the option of headphones. My first attemp at this was a pair of Sony buds that were semi-in ear (years ago) and it was a partial success. My largest complaint was the lack of passive noise attenuation. I feel this is a critical point since I'm not interested in losing my hearing. Along with motorcycling music is a big passion of mine. So I started hunting around the web and wouldn't you know it, I stumbled on our boy Tyll's site. Being the quesitonably sane individual I am I decided that of course it only made sense to buy the Etymotic ER4Ps. At the time they were one of the few high-end IEM's available. What a difference a few years makes, now I'd have choices galore! Anyway, personally I'm able to get enough insertion to get proper seal and the body of the IEM doesn't protrude so far to be problematic but this does somewhat depend on which helmet I'm using. My current Arai works very well with the Etys although removal of the helmet at the end of a ride is a bit of a chore to do without feeling like I'm raping my ears a bit. I keep kicking around the idea of custom molded IEMs but man that price tag is a big pill to swallow and with options like the the QJays it seems like money poorly spent.

More than anything what I do like about riding with IEMs is that if I come upon a situation where I don't feel that listening to music is appropriate I can simply pause whatever player I'm using (usually an old 3rd gen Ipod) and I've still got enough passive noise attenuation to keep me sane. I don't know about the rest of you but I find that cutting down on external stress like wind noise very much helps keep me fresh while I ride. Another tip that I'd offer is to set your listening volume before you start the bike. That should leave you with a pretty safe listening level unless you're bound and determined to listen loud. One last thing, I use a wired remote on my Ipod, fastened to the outside of my tankbag so that if necessary I can make volume adjustments, pause music, etc. on the fly with as little fuss as possible. There's no doubt that having music playing is an added distraction to an activity that already demands one's attention so I like having options available fast.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that given the current wealth of choices that folks have I see no reason to be stuck with helmet speakers or the like unless you're using a comm system that requires them. And even if you are I'd strongly suggest trying to find a way around them. I can't imagine the volume level that is required to overcome road noise and make conversation intelligible. And my brother develops noise cancelling technology for the gov't so I've had a bit of exposure to that side of things as well. Without custom headsets or helmets I don't see that tech making a big play in this realm. The noise type strikes me as too variable and I guess I just prefer the passive approach.

And off topic, I'm sure some of you are starting to realize what kind of member you've got here in putts. In full disclosure, I'm a friend of Tyll's from the world of headphones. I'm not on the manufacturing or sales side, just consumption.

Great site you've got here. I'm looking forward to hanging out a bit, offering what little advice I can and learning a great deal more.

Nate
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Old 12-10-2007, 08:23 PM   #50
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Nate! My Man! Love ya baby!

What a pleasure it is to see Nate here. I won't drag him into a bunch of explaination about how this guy is basically the mold from which all good audio DIYers are built, but I will say that he's the only guy that I'll sell sub-assemblies of my gear at cost to hack around with... access to my engineer too if he wouldn't be such a nice guy that he woudn't impose. (You impose any time, mate. Mi casa su casa.)

But c'mon Nate, find us some picture of your fine DIY gear! Maybe even the one with my name on it. How embarrasing would that be!

Welcome, old man. I gonna fucking ride out there just for the fuck of it one day. I'll visit my daughter in NY first, but you're next on the list!

edit - and don't let him fool you about being a n00b. First post my ass. This guy was my sounding board in an on-line revolution. He's been around the block. You see him elsewhere on this board, give him a pile of shit. Just not in this thread, cuz I love him and I'll kill you.
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Putts screwed with this post 12-10-2007 at 08:37 PM
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Old 12-11-2007, 07:14 AM   #51
n_maher
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Wicked

Quote:
Originally Posted by Putts
But c'mon Nate, find us some picture of your fine DIY gear! Maybe even the one with my name on it. How embarrasing would that be!
Ok, ok, fine. You guys think that moto-fanaticism is rough here's a little tour of the wonderful world/sickness of DIY electronics...

It's starts with something like this.

Single opamp gain stage headphone amp. About as simple as the come.

Then you say, "I bet if I buffered the output it'd get better" and you build something like this:

Someone already posted a PIMETA in this thread and this is what they look like up close.

Then you say, "Pfffft, chip buffers are weak" and move on to this:


That adds a discrete output stage, class A biasing throughout and even a separate tracking linear regulated power supply. Oh lord, it's getting bad, make it stop, make it stop.

Second to last stage of the sickness, you realize that what headphones really need to sound good is an all discrete, FET output speaker amp.



It'd be all well and good if it ended there, but of course it doesn't. Cause see you met this guy a while ago (who could that be??) and he keeps preaching that what you really need is headphones that are driven by a balanced source and amp. It's getting cold, so very cold in here....

So you build a balanced source, using one of the Devil's dac modules.



And before you know it you've got an audio rig that costs as much as your bike does! And what's worse, the journey's not over because now that you've got the balanced source you're back to square one when it comes to amps. Shit.

The hilarious part is that I've completely ignored the wonderful world of high end cabling. I refuse to go there now, I'm spent.

So look out folks, there are other equally troubling and expensive hobbies out there. But if you're a music lover like me there's nothing quite like curling up at the end of a long day in your own little sanctuary.
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Old 12-11-2007, 07:55 AM   #52
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What a fascinating thread. I am a budding audiophile for the home. My last project was building one of Seigfried Linkwitz's speaker projects, the Phoenix. A tri-amped open baffle monitor design that sounds, incredible, for lack of a more appropriate word. Click if you are interested

In search of better audio and noise canceling on the bike, I ended up having a set of those custom ear plugs made up when I was at the Daytona bike week. They are from a company Now Hear This. I have no idea what monitors she used on the inside, but they are pretty decent sounding.

I second the suggestion of using a lube on the IEM's. I use something slightly different, but works the same. I use a small dab of Anti-Bacterial first aid ointment (clear gel). As I have a problem with ear infections anyway, kills two birds with one stone.

Now, for the modification part. The guys I ride with all use bike to bike communication. We use the system from MotoComm. Bar none, it is the best system out there and I have tried them all. They make adapters for most of the motorolla type "Talkabout" radios. For $60 ish bucks, you get the cabling for whatever radio you currently have, a PTT button for your handle bar, and a helmet kit with mic and speakers. I threw away the speakers and just wired in a 1/8" stereo jack to plug in my IEMs. Now I can listen to music and have a couple of miles range talking with my buddies.

When my custom IEMs wear out (and they are getting close) I think the Q-jays will be the ticket as a replacement. How are they for noise canceling compared to the custom IEMs?
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Old 12-11-2007, 09:04 AM   #53
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How does the wiring hold up in the wind on the O-jays? The reason I ask is that I picked up a set of the Sure's last year and within 300 miles the audio was intermittently dropping out. It appeared that the problem was at the junction where the wires divide to the buds. I had to cut the junction and rewire it and reinforce it with some shrink wrap. They've been OK since but I have the same problem as others do in that I can't wear them under a helmet for more than a day or two before they start becoming painful.
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Old 12-11-2007, 09:58 AM   #54
n_maher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonS
How does the wiring hold up in the wind on the O-jays? The reason I ask is that I picked up a set of the Sure's last year and within 300 miles the audio was intermittently dropping out. It appeared that the problem was at the junction where the wires divide to the buds. I had to cut the junction and rewire it and reinforce it with some shrink wrap. They've been OK since but I have the same problem as others do in that I can't wear them under a helmet for more than a day or two before they start becoming painful.
I've been using my ER4P's on and off for 4 years on the bike, mowing the yard, snow blowing the driveway, etc. and I have yet to develop a cable fault so I'd chalk the Shure failure up to a random occurance. One thing that I'd recommend is runnng the wire down through your jacket and out at the waistline. At least that's what I do and it seems to keep things out of harms way for the most part.

And if comfort is a real issue I'd look into having some molds made or trying some different tip sizes to see if that helps. For a while I thought that the Ety tri-flanges were good enough but ultimately found that the medium foam tips souded better, isolated more and were much more comfortable in the long run.
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Old 12-11-2007, 10:29 AM   #55
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Hey, Nate. Did you notice the new baby blue Ety tri-flange ear tips in my pic above? They work much better than the old ones.

Nice porn of your gear BTW.

Say, what's it say on the faceplate of that bottom one?

(Fuck, now I'm getting shamelessly promotional. Jcolombo, you might have to start thinking about banning me once we see the front of that thing.)
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Old 12-11-2007, 10:53 AM   #56
n_maher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Putts
Say, what's it say on the faceplate of that bottom one?


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Old 12-11-2007, 11:50 AM   #57
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Thx Putts for all the great info
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Old 12-11-2007, 11:51 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thinc2
Thx Putts for all the great info
+1 - never would have heard about the q-jays without this thread

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Old 12-11-2007, 12:59 PM   #59
Putts OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n_maher


There it is, my name on the front of a DIY showpiece. Quite an honor, Nate. (BTW, I mostly asked because I hadn't see it yet and didn't want to dig through the dog pile on the other boards.) I can only hope that we continue to do a job good enough to warrent attention in your fine work.

BTW folks, if Nate says something here, even if it contradicts me, you might as well reckon it's right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thinc2
Thx Putts for all the great info
Quote:
Originally Posted by djpaulie
+1 - never would have heard about the q-jays without this thread
Your welcome, the pleasure is mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonS
How does the wiring hold up in the wind on the O-jays?
'Fraid the jury is going to have to be out on that one. they haven't been out for much more than a month yet. They need to be built small and flexable, so the fact that the cables are thin etc could as likely be good engineering as cost cutting.

(goes to investigate)

Jays (that's the company name) has two other products: the D-Jay and J-Jay. We do get some J-Jays back (they're pretty cheap $49) for quality issues, but it seems to be an acceptably small percentage. The D-Jay is somewhat more reliable evidently. The most reliable cans are the Shures, Mike (our service manager) says he doesn't think we've ever gotten one back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch
My last project was building one of Seigfried Linkwitz's speaker projects, the Phoenix.
Nate and I are mear mortals, Linkwitz is a God.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch
Now Hear This. I have no idea what monitors she used on the inside, but they are pretty decent sounding.
Sorry, I've never heard of them. But they better be a little careful with the name, there's and speaker company with the name NHT and it stands for Now Hear This.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch
I use a small dab of Anti-Bacterial first aid ointment (clear gel). As I have a problem with ear infections anyway, kills two birds with one stone.
Got to admit I'm a bit fugly on this count, I just lick mine. Pretty sure it's really not the right way to go, and often just wet my fingers under the tap and manually moisten the tips. Just that the otherway tastes so goooood! Yumm.

Quote:
How are they for noise canceling compared to the custom IEMs?
Just as good.
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Old 12-11-2007, 02:00 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Putts
Nate and I are mear mortals, Linkwitz is a God.
I agree. What has blown me away dealing with S.L. is how accessable he is to all of us building his projects. A true enthusiast. He freely gives out his designs so we can build them ourselves. The shear volume of information on his website boggles my pea brain. But every time I had a very stupid question that I could not find a work around, I would email him and he would be very quick and complete in a reply to me with any information I needed.

And the sound......




And I always did wonder about the NHT name for the IEMs I bought. I should call her some day to figure out what monitors she used.
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