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Old 01-12-2010, 04:01 PM   #11551
NSFW OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oni
Shouldn't that have been a fix it ticket?

You had one but it was broken/ripped unknown to your knowledge and then fixed promptly once you learned of it
Maybe take it down to CHP and have them verify working spark arrestor, then bring that and the ripped screen to court. Bet it will be dismissed.

this should work for you since you already used up all your bad lucks...
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:13 PM   #11552
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I might also say that you suspect the probe actually broke the screen and that you have contacted the manufacturer for a replacement under warranty.........
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:27 PM   #11553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h8chains
this should work for you since you already used up all your bad lucks...
Even if you did not have a sparky. All you have to do is print out all the different types of sparky's on the market. Disc, inserts, and screens. So their being some many different sparky's on the market. Can the cop prove to the judge that 1. He knows how many different kind there is? 2. How to test each on that its working properly. Then you show the judge him a pic of your exhaust with a SA stamped on it. You trying to show doubt that the police officer can't know about all sparky's. But that does not matter because your going to show the judge your pic of the working sparky. Ben
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:32 PM   #11554
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Originally Posted by xymotic
FWIW, I got a letter from the court. Bail is $212

Was sposed to go to court tomorrow, but I got a 60 day delay on it.

I can have a trial by affidavit or schedule a real trial. Any opinions on which is better?

I am just going to make a couple points.

1) They gave me the ticket a mile before the actual park, where there is a notice saying you need the arrestor. I'm going to assert that you should not get a speeding ticket a mile before a school zone sign because the officer felt you 'were gonna' break the law.

2) they gave me a ticket for "no spark arrestor"
I actually did have one, but it was broken. (ripped)

Anybody else got any creative ideas to help me get out of it?
If you do a Trial by Declaration, you need to write your rebuttal well and have all of the correct regulation references, etc to maximize your chance of getting the ticket dismissed. It'll be your written declaration of the facts and supporting documentation (evidence) against the Officers.

If you go this route, you will need to prepare a spot on and well documented pkg with pre and post repair photos of the spark arrestor, maps of approx location, etc.

I've done both, but prefer a real trial, as the officer has a 50/50 chance of not showing. I've won a few cases that way.

BUT, if the Officer shows, you need to make a good case and be respectful of the Officer. Bring photos (Exihbits) and a map of where you were stopped, and prepare a nice speech on what was wrong with your bike and that you had NO intentions of breaking the law, that it was a case of equipment failure and that it was fixed (receipts, pre and post repair photos, etc).

I think you have a good case and should fight it, but be sure to post the bail and select which option you want to pursue. If you're with AAA, they have a legal services section that you can call and speak to an attorney to get additional advice and guidance about your case.

Good luck.
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:34 PM   #11555
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Fantasic advice Earl, I will check on the AAA thing.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Earl999
If you do a Trial by Declaration, you need to write your rebuttal well and have all of the correct regulation references, etc to maximize your chance of getting the ticket dismissed. It'll be your written declaration of the facts and supporting documentation (evidence) against the Officers.

If you go this route, you will need to prepare a spot on and well documented pkg with pre and post repair photos of the spark arrestor, maps of approx location, etc.

I've done both, but prefer a real trial, as the officer has a 50/50 chance of not showing. I've won a few cases that way.

BUT, if the Officer shows, you need to make a good case and be respectful of the Officer. Bring photos (Exihbits) and a map of where you were stopped, and prepare a nice speech on what was wrong with your bike and that you had NO intentions of breaking the law, that it was a case of equipment failure and that it was fixed (receipts, pre and post repair photos, etc).

I think you have a good case and should fight it, but be sure to post the bail and select which option you want to pursue. If you're with AAA, they have a legal services section that you can call and speak to an attorney to get additional advice and guidance about your case.

Good luck.
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:36 PM   #11556
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben99r1
Even if you did not have a sparky. All you have to do is print out all the different types of sparky's on the market. Disc, inserts, and screens. So their being some many different sparky's on the market. Can the cop prove to the judge that 1. He knows how many different kind there is? 2. How to test each on that its working properly. Then you show the judge him a pic of your exhaust with a SA stamped on it. You trying to show doubt that the police officer can't know about all sparky's. But that does not matter because your going to show the judge your pic of the working sparky. Ben
Yeah, until the judge asks me a direct question. I'd rather point out that they fail to prove their case than me having to make something up...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
Baja Blitz Yard sale
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:45 PM   #11557
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Ok, what do you guys think of this argument:

(a) Notwithstanding Section 4442 of the Public Resources
Code, and except for vehicles with mufflers as provided in Article 2
(commencing with Section 27150) of Chapter 5 of Division 12, no
person shall use, operate, or allow to be used or operated, any
off-highway motor vehicle, as defined in Section 38006, on any
forest-covered land, brush-covered land, or grass-covered land unless
the vehicle is equipped with a spark arrester maintained in
effective working order.


I was on a street-legal bike on a signed, named street, a 30' wide graded gravel road. I was not on brush covered land, or a trail. So should not even be required to have one...

yay, nay???
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
Baja Blitz Yard sale
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Old 01-12-2010, 04:57 PM   #11558
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic


Fantasic advice Earl, I will check on the AAA thing.
No problem.

AAA has lots of services that members need to take advantage of!
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Old 01-12-2010, 05:00 PM   #11559
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Earl999
No problem.

AAA has lots of services that members need to take advantage of!
Yeah I just got their free credit monitoring. They do lots of stuff but I routinely forget to ask them
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
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Old 01-12-2010, 05:01 PM   #11560
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You will lose.

I would not try and "fight" you don't need to (only piss the judge off) don't try and teach them the law either (they know it better then you do). From what I remember you pipe is legal and is an approved spark arrestor. It just so happened that it went bad and was defective. You fixed the problem and here is the proof that it was fixed. It's that simple. As long as you back all that up the case will be dismissed.

I'm always surprised that people over complicate these issues. It would be different if you were trying to get away with something but in your case the spark arrestor failed and you fixed it end of story. I will bet you lunch the ticket will be dismissed.
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Old 01-12-2010, 05:45 PM   #11561
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sito
You will lose.

I would not try and "fight" you don't need to (only piss the judge off) don't try and teach them the law either (they know it better then you do). From what I remember you pipe is legal and is an approved spark arrestor. It just so happened that it went bad and was defective. You fixed the problem and here is the proof that it was fixed. It's that simple. As long as you back all that up the case will be dismissed.

I'm always surprised that people over complicate these issues. It would be different if you were trying to get away with something but in your case the spark arrestor failed and you fixed it end of story. I will bet you lunch the ticket will be dismissed.
Semantics, fight it means you aren't giving up and just taking the ticket, but attempting to explain your case and see if the judge agrees.

As I stated earlier, be respectful and make your case, it's your day in court, or written case if the Trial by Declaration route is taken.

You win if the ticket is dismissed, it's you against the Officer and who makes the better case with the facts, evidence and documentation.
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Old 01-12-2010, 07:03 PM   #11562
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Earl999
Semantics, fight it means you aren't giving up and just taking the ticket, but attempting to explain your case and see if the judge agrees.

As I stated earlier, be respectful and make your case, it's your day in court, or written case if the Trial by Declaration route is taken.

You win if the ticket is dismissed, it's you against the Officer and who makes the better case with the facts, evidence and documentation.
But it's like I said it's not a fight. He didn't do anything wrong a part on his bike failed and need to be fixed. It would be another matter if he was trying to get away with something but thats not the case here. A mechanical part can fail and need to be fixed that is not a crime. Having a strait pipe that was never legal then you have a problem. Written declaration are reviewed by morons they will reject this just because they have no idea what they are talking about or looking at. (not a lot of these will come across their desks.

He has a great case because his pipe is legal.
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Old 01-12-2010, 08:03 PM   #11563
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Originally Posted by sito
But it's like I said it's not a fight. He didn't do anything wrong a part on his bike failed and need to be fixed. It would be another matter if he was trying to get away with something but thats not the case here. A mechanical part can fail and need to be fixed that is not a crime. Having a strait pipe that was never legal then you have a problem. Written declaration are reviewed by morons they will reject this just because they have no idea what they are talking about or looking at. (not a lot of these will come across their desks.

He has a great case because his pipe is legal.
It doesn't matter what WE think or debate, the bottom line is for Xymotic to get legal advice from the experts at AAA legal services and go from there.

I think he has a good case, I've argued lesser cases and won on technicalities like speedometer calibration dates, so you never know until you try.
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Old 01-12-2010, 08:51 PM   #11564
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Sorry for the OTishness. I started a new thread: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...0#post11868880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
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Old 01-12-2010, 09:22 PM   #11565
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic
Sorry for the OTishness. I started a new thread: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...0#post11868880

on a slow and boring mid week...no such thing as ot.

good luck on fighting the ticket.
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