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Old 12-07-2012, 07:19 PM   #1171
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faustinoeldelbarrio View Post
The only things that occur to me right now is that i have a worn emulsion tube, or an incorrect float height ( not really probable since about a year ago i changed the float valve and checked the height about 3 months ago and everything seemed to be in place).
Recheck the condition of the float needle. If there is a witness line evident where the tip has been contacting the seat, it is either leaking, or will begin leaking soon, and should be replaced.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerbuck View Post
Float - Parallel with gasket surface
The mixture tends to be rich toward the lower rpm at all openings with the BST40 on LC4's (the 400 may be excepted, I don't know) even when everything is perfect and unmolested. Setting the float height at 16.7 instead of 14.7mm helps.
Quote:
In trying a 47.5 pilot on both of my 640s I found it too rich and ended up going back to the 45, this is at sea level... You may want to try a smaller pilot for your application...
Dyno testing I've done corroborates this.
Quote:
A worn needle jet/emulsion tube will very much cause your bike to run like crap... A big noticeable performance increase comes with the replacement of the worn parts... You may want to check the wear indicators on the slide and slide guide to see if they are also worn...
Indeed. If the slide guide has worn more than .010" (0.25mm), i.e. the indentations in the bottom corners adjacent to the bore (not to be confused with the round indentations) are less than .010" (0.25mm) deep, and/or the slide exhibits vertical grooving on the downstream side, it is pretty much guaranteed that the emulsion tube is worn out. To that end, see http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=298, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=299, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=300, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=301, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=305, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=302, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=304 and http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=303.

A clipped slide spring also causes the mixture at low rpm at all openings to be richer, so if your spring has been clipped, I would replace it.

Regards,

Derek
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Old 12-08-2012, 02:04 PM   #1172
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Guys,
I have been searching here and there but I didn't really found the ultimate answer: what would be the recommended setup for akrapovic slip on muffler and the BSt40?
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Old 12-08-2012, 06:01 PM   #1173
faustinoeldelbarrio
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So.... good news and bad news...

Changed the slide and put the needle in the middle point (turns out that at some point i had put it on the 4th notch from top which actually made it richer... felt really dumb when i found the clip in that position). The old and new slides measures exactly the same in every dimmension, however i left the new one since it has undrilled holes and will hopefully add some kms to te emulsion tube before it wears out.
The bike ran great ! only one issue left: still bogs at WOT at 4.5 - 5 rpm, but maybe it's a flota problem

Now the bad news:
I took off today for a 400 km trip I have done at least 5 times, I know the road, the weather was great until some idiot in a pickup decided to make a U turn without looking who was behind...
the result:
several bruises but no fractures... broke the gas tank, the turning light, fender, rear fender, hands saver and scratched the akra. The blue jeans, gloves and protective jacket ended up really bad (they literally saved my ass).
The police has the bike, the company that owns the pickuo won't pay unless I sue them, and I can't take away my bike until we have all an agreement. Best of all all the paper work has to be done where the accident took place 2 hours an 100km away from home...

let this be a reminder to you all:
ALWAYS USE PROTECTIVE GEAR, no matter if it's to hot, if u think u look "dumb", or even if you don't have lots of money, is the best investment a motorcycle rider can make. I'll upload pics of the jacket so we all can have an idea of what would be my shoulder right now if i were using a t shirt.
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Old 12-08-2012, 07:53 PM   #1174
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Faust, if you have insurance, your company should step in for you.

Sorry for the hurt to you and the machine.

Adjust the float when you are able.
bill
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Old 12-13-2012, 05:00 PM   #1175
BluesCruiser
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I opened up the float bowl on mine and found this little thing rattling around in the bottom...


I went through this thread and found Sumi's post from way back and I am wondering if it is the plunger for the needle valve? I never took the floats out but maybe it could have dropped out? Maybe?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumi View Post
Derek, thank you for your replies..

This is how my weight looks like:


I was refering to the red circled area - now I know it's called "plunger"?

So this has to be "out" of the weight, when adjusting the float height if I understand correctly.

Thank you once again!
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Old 12-13-2012, 05:15 PM   #1176
laramie LC4 OP
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is it hollow?

i seriously doubt that is part of the needle. the float tab sit's up against that piece while installed. if it fell out, that means the whole needle and tab should also be in the float bowl and the bike definitely would not run. it's also a very small piece.

you need to pull the carb and take a look. i'm sure motolab will be here before long and may have a better idea. i'm sure he will be glad to sell you the "part."

option 2) it may not be from the carb at all and the last owner was an idiot?

sorry i'm not more help.

laramie
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Old 12-13-2012, 05:57 PM   #1177
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A little more information...this is all in a stock 2000 DR650SE
I installed the ProCycle jet kit last weekend and cut the top of the air box, and used the 145 jet. It ran but was a little flat in the midrange. Still it ran stronger than stock and both I and my son put a few miles on it. Today I opened it up to install the 150 jet and when I pulled the float bowl off this little thing was rattling around in the bottom!

Several questions come to mind...like when did it drop down there? Where did it come from? I never pulled the floats until AFTER I found the thing in the bowl, so I'm puzzled if it came out of the needle. It's just that the pic that Sumi posted is the only thing I found on this thread that even remotely looks like it might be it.

Once again, the thing is brass and has the same "weathered" look as the rest of the original brass fittings in the carb. It is about 1/8 - 3/16" long with a tapered end and a "pinhole" through the length of it. The tapered end is "indexed" like it has been fitting into a seat.

Thanks for any ideas you may have!
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Old 12-13-2012, 06:16 PM   #1178
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesCruiser View Post
Where did it come from?
The item is a cold start enrichment metering jet. It is normally located inside the upstream end of the cold start enrichment feed pipe (The cold start enrichment feed pipe is part of the float cage. The o-ring that isn't the float seat o-ring attaches to the downstream end). You should be able to push it back into its hole. If it won't stay, you can superglue or cylindrical parts bond it in (don't obstruct the hole in the process).

Regards,

Derek

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Old 12-13-2012, 06:34 PM   #1179
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesCruiser View Post
I installed the ProCycle jet kit last weekend and cut the top of the air box, and used the 145 jet.
Have a look at:



As the CO trace in this chart illustrates, the needle in the Pro Cycle kit is the wrong shape.
Quote:
It ran but was a little flat in the midrange.
What is the exact throttle opening when the symptom is experienced?

Regards,

Derek
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Old 12-13-2012, 06:40 PM   #1180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motolab View Post
The item is a cold start enrichment metering jet. It is normally located inside the upstream end of the cold start enrichment feed pipe (The cold start enrichment feed pipe is part which is part of the float cage. The o-ring that isn't the float seat o-ring attaches to the downstream end). You should be able to push it back into its hole. If it won't stay, you can superglue or cylindrical parts bond it in (don't obstruct the hole in the process).

Regards,

Derek
Thanks Derek. I went back through your pics but don't see this "cold start enrichment feed pipe" labeled. Could you please post a pic of what I should be looking for? That would help me a lot.
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Old 12-13-2012, 06:49 PM   #1181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motolab View Post
As the CO trace in this chart illustrates, the needle in the Pro Cycle kit is the wrong shape.What is the exact throttle opening when the symptom is experienced?

Regards,

Derek
Thanks again Derek but I'm no good at reading this chart. I started with the needle at the 4th clip and it bogged badly. I moved it to the 5th clip and it seemed to solve the bog completely. The flat spot seems to happen at between 1/2 and 3/4 throttle.
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Old 12-14-2012, 09:11 AM   #1182
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesCruiser View Post
Thanks again Derek but I'm no good at reading this chart.
As can be seen from the CO trace, there is a significant change in mixture as the rpm progress. It varies between extremes of 2.6 (a little too lean) and 9.5% (quite a bit too rich) (3-5% CO is a good target), which I would call unacceptable. Having had a look at the shape of the needle that was used here, I can tell you that installing a needle with a more suitable profile will flatten the curve considerably.
Quote:
I started with the needle at the 4th clip and it bogged badly. I moved it to the 5th clip and it seemed to solve the bog completely. The flat spot seems to happen at between 1/2 and 3/4 throttle.
I recommend installing a different needle and starting over. That said, the order of tuning should be from the top down. That means that no changes to the clip position should be made until the correct main jet has been arrived at for best WOT operation. The next step should be to set the clip position for correct operation at 1/4 opening. The area in between should then be correct (and cannot be addressed separately). In order to be able to assess the engine's behavior properly, it is important to test at precise openings. In order to facilitate this, put some tape on the throttle housing and the edge of the grip. Mark zero throttle with a sharpie. This is best done with the engine idling, so you can tell when the slack in the cable has just been taken up. Turn off the engine and mark wide open. Now take a tape measure (metric works best in my opinion) and measure the length of the arc. Put a mark at the mid point. Duplicate this procedure to mark the mid-point between here and zero throttle opening to get 1/4 open. Repeat for 1/8 and 1/16 openings. Ideally, testing is done on a 5-gas EGA equipped brake dyno. If done while riding, don't have an accident trying to look at the marks. If you do, I'm not responsible!

Regards,

Derek
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Old 12-14-2012, 09:20 AM   #1183
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesCruiser View Post
Thanks Derek. I went back through your pics but don't see this "cold start enrichment feed pipe" labeled. Could you please post a pic of what I should be looking for? That would help me a lot.


The upside-down L-shaped thing with the o-ring on the bottom, facing us in this picture, is the cold start enrichment feed pipe.

Regards,

Derek
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:44 PM   #1184
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Thanks Derek. I never would have guess that's where it went in a million years! I tamped it in with an allen and it seems tight so I hope it stays this time. No to start tuning the jet!
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Old 12-19-2012, 08:35 AM   #1185
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hi all, just posted this ove in the DR650 thread but someone reminded me this is probably a good place to get some exposure too. ive got a unifilter installed on the vent hose that goes to the top of the carb but it looks like a few hundred kms of the talcum powder that makes up the logging road surfaces in borneo just went straight through the unifilter and into the carb. does anyone run anything other than the unifilter on their carb vent? as far as im concerned its useless for anything other than stopping sand.
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