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Old 05-08-2009, 02:48 AM   #586
TheBigMuff
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Dual plug is good.

I don't agree with this, my experience is that a dual plug engine is MUCH more resistant to pinging and works better with bad fuel, everything else being equal. And starts better, and gets marginally better fuel economy.

As I understand it full advance set at 18btdc(?) is all you really need to do to get a standard/high compression dual plug engine to work well. Increasing compression as well is of course a different story, but a 9.5 CR motor will without question work a lot better on low octane fuel if it has dual plugs.

In hot weather up in the hills my Schek runs better on low octane fuel than my standard PD runs on 95+ octane petrol. Furthermore, with both bikes on high octane fuel the PD pings a LOT easier, again particularly in hot weather. No doubt when it is top end time the PD will get dual plugs and high compression slugs.

I reckon snapping a lower plug would be just about as common as a top plug failing - very rare with digital ignition. I carry one of each plug anyway, just cause I can.

Cheers
Lachlan

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malindi
If you're going to use that bike outside of NA, don't double plug it. You'll be more sensitive to gas quality fluctuations, or break off the bottom plug on rought ground and bouncing around.

TheBigMuff screwed with this post 05-08-2009 at 05:31 AM
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Old 05-08-2009, 03:29 AM   #587
StephenB
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+1

Ran my dual-plugged 1000cc ~9.7CR with the cheapest fuel there is, 3 days up in 9000ft in the Colorado Rockies, no pinging ever. Hot weather in New Mexico, low speed high rpm on gravel, in sand and mud, no pinging whatsoever. I ran 6deg BTDC and a 31deg full advance (F-mark centered) at about 3200rpm or thereabouts at the time. Gas mileage was 36mpg avg. (5000mls trip) fully loaded (2 bags, tailback and tent/sleeping bag). Changed that for this season to 3deg BTDC and 25deg advance for 28deg full advance at 3200rpm. See what that does to the mileage.

Besides you buy reliability with a second set of plugs. In the event of a lower plug breaking off, you still have the upper plugs. In the event of the electronic ignition failing I fall back to single-plug points and high octane gas.

I am sure Malindi was jokin', right?
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Old 05-08-2009, 06:55 AM   #588
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lurking in my own thread, how lame is that
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Old 05-08-2009, 07:08 AM   #589
Airhead Wrangler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenB
Ran my dual-plugged with the cheapest fuel there is ...in the Colorado Rockies, no pinging ever.
Just a side note, but if you plan to travel outside of North America you're likely to... no, you WILL encounter fuel of MUCH worse quality than even the crappiest swill you can find in Colorado.
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Old 05-08-2009, 07:42 AM   #590
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malindi
You can get pistons from Motobins. What kind of bike?
http://www.motobins.co.uk/displayfin...MBO%29+CALIPER
M:

Thanks, I didn't know that.
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Old 05-08-2009, 08:16 AM   #591
StephenB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airhead Wrangler
Just a side note, but if you plan to travel outside of North America you're likely to... no, you WILL encounter fuel of MUCH worse quality than even the crappiest swill you can find in Colorado.
Is AK outside NA

On a serious note, dual-plugged is a better start for any crap fuel on a high comp engine. But, if I WERE to go solo (!) South of the US borders, I would probably consider a 750 or 800cc engine with lowered compression (maybe even dual-plugged for built-in reliability and combustion efficiency) instead of the 1000cc high comp ... for exact that reason.
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Old 05-08-2009, 08:20 AM   #592
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I have an airhead for the simplicity, i.e. simple by choice. That means one coil, two spark plugs, no dual plugging. Gas in Mexico has always been good to me even when buying it from a barrel in Baja or Batopilas. Never stuck. My .02.

T.
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Old 05-08-2009, 08:35 AM   #593
Airhead Wrangler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Infracaninophile
Gas in Mexico has always been good to me even when buying it from a barrel in Baja or Batopilas. Never stuck. My .02.
I've gotten stuck with some shit gas bought out of a barrel on the side of dirt road in Kyrgyzstan. It was cut with enough of something that even my Ural wouldn't run well on it. Luckily I was carrying a jerrycan in the hack with some good gas that dilluted it enough to run well. In that case though, dual plugging and low compression wouldn't do much to help. If a Ural won't run well with it, nothing will.
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Old 05-08-2009, 08:40 AM   #594
Malindi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenB

I am sure Malindi was jokin', right?
My understanding is that most people up compression when you dual plug, else there is little point. I think that's a bad idea (and HPN says you MUST have an oil cooler with a hi-comp setup, something I only found out recently). Aside from that, it introduces more failure points.The plug breaking is more a scraping liability when you're in rough terrain. If it breaks you need to plug the hole and readjust the timing/ignition from what I've been told.


I think if you have pinging issues with an airhead with ANY type of gas you find in NA you have other problems in my opinion.

A properly setup standard system is still the most reliable. But to each his own.
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Old 05-08-2009, 08:47 AM   #595
Malindi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airhead Wrangler
I've gotten stuck with some shit gas bought out of a barrel on the side of dirt road in Kyrgyzstan. It was cut with enough of something that even my Ural wouldn't run well on it. Luckily I was carrying a jerrycan in the hack with some good gas that dilluted it enough to run well. In that case though, dual plugging and low compression wouldn't do much to help. If a Ural won't run well with it, nothing will.
Very true. I wonder what it was you got... I never got bad gas, or at least the bike. Or maybe the bike didn't notice it. The only things that I encountered that were weird is on the day I went to the Chinese border in Pakistan and got to around 15K feet at the Khunjerab pass. The bike was definitely feeling the altitude and seemed very lackluster. The battery also showed weird voltages that day (PC 680) but both cleared up as I descended. The most dubious gas I ever bought along the side of the road was in Dalbadin, PK, from a set of old coke bottles.
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Old 05-08-2009, 10:50 AM   #596
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Quote:
and HPN says you MUST have an oil cooler with a hi-comp setup, something I only found out recently
I wonder what HPN considers 'hi-comp'. I'm only looking at going to 9.2:1, the stock pistons on the Euro spec G/S. Those bikes didn't come with oil coolers.
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Old 05-08-2009, 10:55 AM   #597
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgoodsoil
I wonder what HPN considers 'hi-comp'. I'm only looking at going to 9.2:1, the stock pistons on the Euro spec G/S. Those bikes didn't come with oil coolers.
Their reference is the Siebenrock kit. I think 9.5 but don't quote me. HPNs were built for VERY hot climates and deep heavy sand, hence excess temps. But still a point to keep in mind. I prefer my airheads KISS.
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Old 05-11-2009, 02:20 PM   #598
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It's been a rough week. I had a blowout on the rear tire at 60 on the highway. The rear wheel went sideways, I don't know how I managed not to dump it. I'm not sure what caused the tube to blow. No punctures, no rips, the valve stem was ripped out but that could've happened after the fact. Great.

I didn't have my spare tube on me so I left it on the side of the road and came back with my buddy's truck. We threw the bike in the back and dragged it's sorry butt back home. Roomates got the tank, buddy's got the seat and I'm about to start hauling the rest of the parts back inside.



New tire, new rim strip, I even ran a band of electrical tape around the rim next to the strip to make sure the tube wasn't touching anything that it was before.

One electrical fire, one near death experience, 3 weeks til I leave on a 2 month road trip.

Neither of the Distanzias came with pucks in them. Pressure got the bead to finally seat on the rear but not on the front. I wedged some 2x4s in to stretch it for about an hour.....



didn't work, still wouldn't seat. I pulled the tire off, put my old one back on, rewedged the tire and left it sitting. It's been like that overnight. I'll take another crack at it tomorrow. If it still won't seat I'll put on the Duro front, call AMT and see if they'll take care of it. Whether Avon didn't put the pucks in or not, AMT should have.

Other than that I'm almost set for the trip. Oil change, check the valves. I still need to rebuild the carbs but Infra's and Slope'rs awesome write-ups oughta make that easy. I left Nathan with a Christmas list of spare parts and I'll pick them up tomorrow.

I did a dry run packing the bike:



sleeping pad(rolled outta the shot), towel, all cooking stuff(stove, pots, etc.), sleeping bag, hammock, bag liner(a lifesaver when it's 80 degrees at night), tent, and my clothes all fit in one box. I had to force the lid closed but it made it. Since the tools and spares are all in the tail bag or other assorted hidey holes throughout the bike the other box is empty. Water's in the Camelbak, I'll need food, but that's pretty much everything on the list in one box.

Dern. When I look at pictures of my bike from my first road trip it makes me think it was packed by the Beverly Hillbillies. All I needed was to throw Grandma and a rocking chair on top

I'll equalize the load, so that other box won't be empty, but luggage is definitely not an issue and I won't be throwing some massive top box on. It's also handy since the boxes lock. Makes me less nervous about somebody walking off with a dry bag strapped to the back. Let's hope the crooks don't have crowbars!
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Old 05-11-2009, 02:53 PM   #599
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that's the trick i use. leave it like that overnight. lots of lube on the beads and sometimes a ratcheting strap around the circumference of the tire. front tires can be a real pain.

Quote:
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Old 05-11-2009, 03:11 PM   #600
hardwaregrrl
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Jesus, Brad. Glad you're still among the living. I see it as a good sign, all this shit is going down before you split. Or look at it this way, you can handle it when the shit hits the fan. looking forward to the RR.
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