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Old 08-27-2014, 01:08 PM   #1
Natter2002 OP
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How hot does your bike get?

76r60/6,

Took it for its first ride today in about twenty years. The po said way back in the day the engine "seized" and he never road it again. I've been messing with this bike for about a year now. Anyway things were going great and I'm tooling along but then this terrible clanking sound develops. Like it's pinging but times ten. If it idles the noise is not there but when I rev or go under load there is that noise. I limped it home and checked the oil. Just for kicks. The dipstick is hot enough that I don't want to touch it. Is that normal? The headers slightly blued on the ride , and I touched the fins while riding and they felt like they could burn bear skin but I have no reference to if this is extra hot or not. I can attempt to capture this on film if it helps. Sounds like the piston will punch right out of the jug.

I have a couple of extra questions but I will keep them as separate subjects.
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Old 08-27-2014, 01:14 PM   #2
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Something is not right, for sure! Are you sure you have oil pressure? You are describing a pretty horrendous sound. If the engine seized previously, you may (probably!) have some serious damage inside, somewhere.....

Would need a LOT more information to even begin to figure out what is going on. You could start by pulling off the valve covers, then the heads... take pictures and ask questions!

The aluminum dipstick top gets hot enough to not want to touch it, it's tough to check the oil on a hot engine without a rag... but the bluing doesn't sound good. If you have an infrared digital thermometer, take a reading of the case, the area around the exhaust, etc.

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Old 08-27-2014, 01:25 PM   #3
Natter2002 OP
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Yes I don't doubt this bike is seriously screwed but I'll stay positive for now. I don't have a gun like that but I'll check around. I rode it around and around the block (about ten miles worth or even more ...I have a big country loop...before I figured I better stop bothering neighbors and filled my backpack with tools and took off on a big thirty mile loop. It was running awesome and sounded great. Yes some pinging but nothing crazy. Of course when you're traveling fast it's hard to hear the motor. But then this was fairly unmistakable while riding. On the center stand, revving it up was harder to hear.

I'm wondering if there is ever so slight a chance it could be a header leak, though when I tried to identify the location of the racket I didn't hear or feel any evidence of that.

I think I do have oil pressure because the oil light works. If I let it idle down too much it will come on. That indicates oil pressure, or something else?
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Old 08-27-2014, 01:37 PM   #4
Bill Harris
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Need more info.

Engine seized by the PO? What sort of "messing around" did you do to the engine to get runnable? Be exact, but concise...

Quote:
I think I do have oil pressure because the oil light works. If I let it idle down too much it will come on. That indicates oil pressure, or something else?
So it that the Red Alternator light or the Yellow(ish) oil pressure light? Idling it down to get the oil pressure light to come on is not a good sign.

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Old 08-27-2014, 02:28 PM   #5
Natter2002 OP
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Bill,

Found the bike on craigslist from a kid who knew nothing about bikes. It was given to him for free by a family friend who was original owner who also did.not have much for mechanical know how. Ok so I bought it from the kid because I could spin the engine over by turning the wheel and he was selling it for pennies. I'd of even bought it if it was seized that's how cheap it was,

Anyway in an attempt to find original owner so I could get a title he told me the story on how he had a company in Minnesota dual plug it. Then while riding it in the 80's it started to lose power and he limped it home. Then he said it was seized solid! He called it a boat anchor and it sat getting bird droppings on it for twenty years. The kid tried to fix the wiring but bailed and sold it to me.

two days later I get it to turn over. (Was just wiring). Then i did a compression test and it was ok. After a carb Rebuild I could ride it. Then I discovered tons of shavings in the tranny so I had Anton rebuild it for me. Did the rear main and oil pump cover seal while I was in there. New points, timed correctly, and valves adjusted. New fluids, checked brakes, etc.

Lots of electrical stuff like blinkers, headlight, stop lights.....and I replaced all the lights in the gauge cluster.

Now the bad news: Yes, Bill, I must admit I was looking at the generator light. I just checked and the oil light doesn't come on! I feel a bit of a fool. Anyways I can recheck this light and see if I can get it to come on by changing its bulb . It should come on when I turn the key?

So I didn't do anything at all to the engine really, just carbs, timing, fluids. I knew it could be ruined but I went forward anyway as it appeared ok but I never tested oil pressure, nor do I know how to.

Natter2002 screwed with this post 08-27-2014 at 02:36 PM Reason: More info
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:04 PM   #6
disston
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An engine that seizes while running has the pistons stuck in the cylinders or the crank bearings running without oil. Hot engine parts expand.

I don't think you are going to get anywhere without a complete engine tear down. At least at this point take the heads and the cylinders off and remove the rods so you can see the damage.

You may have to take the crankshaft out too. I think I would.

I don't think you have a minor problem.
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:24 PM   #7
Stan_R80/7
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Two things:

1. The engine is obviously not seized now. The (Christmas?) miracle which caused the engine to magically unseize has happened (again)!
2. If you can touch it without a burn (red skin or blister), it's not that hot.

FWIW, yes, the dipstick will be too hot to touch after riding. I wait until the engine cools. Around 60 C (140 degF) is too hot to handle without gloves - unless you want a burn.


Good luck!
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:31 PM   #8
Natter2002 OP
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Thanks guys, yeah it's toast. Something's totally wrong. That brand new oil is so dark you can't see through it in a shot glass. I poured some in my hand and it's like a copper glitter. Shine a light through said shot glass and all you see is black oil suspending copper metal.

I'm now very sad.

Ok so just start taking this baby apart? Might as well learn something from this. Decide how much to spend and repair later
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:38 PM   #9
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You will be in the market for a crankshaft I think. Certainly wait till you see the damage. But I think that is what you will find. I mention this because you are the second one this week with this sort of damage.

The other bike is an R90S and worth keeping the original block to have matching numbers some day. In your case it may be cheaper and faster to get a complete engine or a short block.

You spent a lot of money fixing the heads and dual plugging them but I think they need to be looked at again or at least taken apart to clean.

Take some photos of the damage you fimd.
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:49 PM   #10
Natter2002 OP
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Ok will do, what did you mean by spending money dual plugging them? Did you mean I will? Or the previous owner did?
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Old 08-27-2014, 04:07 PM   #11
disston
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I thought you said you had that done and also a bunch more getting this thing together. Maybe I have you confused with another bike?

You have an R60/6. I think I did confuse this with another bike. I'll run into the other bike and get it straight.

But the symptoms and the story of the seized engine all point to serious damage.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:30 PM   #12
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Things too hot to touch is quit normal. The noise and the stuff in your oil is not. Do a leak down test. They should always be the first and last thing you concerning stuff like this.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:53 PM   #13
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I rode a /5 through VT once and had the engine 'stick' on me. sat around for a couple of hours and could not get up and running again. next day it started right up, but thought better not to ride it. similar oil pressure light scenario.

Turned out the rubber o-ring for the oil filter wasn't in there, and the oil didn't have enough pressure to do its thing.




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Old 08-27-2014, 09:47 PM   #14
Natter2002 OP
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So do I start by pulling the heads to see what's wrong? Also, should I start a new thread?
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:38 PM   #15
disston
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You can start another thread or stay here. It's up to you. It doesn't seem to matter.

You need an exhaust nut wrench and maybe one of those large rubber mallets.

Take the exhaust headers off. Might as well take the entire exhaust system off.

Remove valve covers, rocker arms, pushrods, heads, cylinders, pistons and rods. Look for damage on the piston sides, the cylinders and the crankshaft journals.
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