ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > GSpot > Parallel Universe
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 09-30-2008, 02:17 PM   #46
Dieselboy OP
Journey not Destination
 
Dieselboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Port of the Gasparilla
Oddometer: 1,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Warner
Sorrry .. but I've no idea what an 'AP1' is ...


But on a KISS principle.
On the relay for the sebel ...
85 and 86 [I assume these are the coil connection of the relay] can be connected directly across the standard horn .. this will mean any inductive effects of the relay will be swamped by the standard horn!

87 [I assume this is one of the high current connectors of the relay] can be taken directly from the battery .. through a fuse for safety.

No CANBUSS connection is required with this wiring as the standard horn connection will take care of ignition key requirements etc.

[Suggest you test the assumed connections - connect terminals 85 and 86 directly to the battery, the other teminals unconnected to anything. The realy should click as the connection is made and unmade .. if not then something is wrong. ]

-------------------------------------------------
Driving a 20 Amp load (sebel horn) thought a capacitor .. would require an extreamly large capacitor!!!!! It is not going to happen.
Frank, thanks for the input. FYI and AP1 is an auxillary fuse panel. It is used to isolate the many gadgets from the bike's electrical system and prevent nasty melt downs.

Stebel is wired to the battery and is fused.

Relays are working as advertised.
__________________
Dieselboy
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Adventure Continues
Dieselboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2008, 02:18 PM   #47
Dieselboy OP
Journey not Destination
 
Dieselboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Port of the Gasparilla
Oddometer: 1,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by wpoll
Haven't meet Mrs. CANBus yet but I'm guessing the back EMF from the relay coil is screwing up the CANBus when the relay is de-activated (you let the horn switch go...)

Back EMF is the reverse current produced by the relay coil when you turn it off. You DO need a Diode to kill the back EMF, but the diode has to be reverse connected across the relay coil terminals, so it appears as a short circuit to any reverse voltage that appaears at the relay terminals.

Wire this correctly, and the problem should be gone. Get it wrong, and the diode goes west when you press the horn switch , and maybe the CANBus too!
EMF as you call it is not a product of horn button release. The Stebel cuts out while I still have the button depressed and the OEM horn continues to sound.
__________________
Dieselboy
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Adventure Continues
Dieselboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 02:29 AM   #48
mrpete64
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Feb 2007
Oddometer: 562
I have two stebel air horns on my '06 GT. Never a problem. I am going to buy a new GS so I hope all of you get this worked out. As all of you know...once you have a good horn you cannot live without it.

Mr. Pete--->
mrpete64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 03:25 AM   #49
PhilSpace
The Gov
 
PhilSpace's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2002
Location: Springfield, VA
Oddometer: 35,078
School solution on all CANBUS bikes is to leave the original horn connected to as it came from the factory and tap the relay into the horn circuit. The OEM horn is still there and the load change from the relay is negligible keeping the ZFE happy. You then drive the Stebel via the switched side of the relay from the battery and all is good. The relay alone will/should trip a ZFE fault on many if not all the CANBUS bikes.
__________________

PhilSpace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 03:41 AM   #50
RobTheRigger
Thread Killer
 
RobTheRigger's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Gone fishin'.
Oddometer: 673
What would the wiring diagram for that look like? Draw me a picture and I'm golden. Thanks!

-Rob
__________________
I can imagine a no more rewarding career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction: "I served in the United States Navy." JFK

"I rode a lot of dirt bikes when I was younger, so I trust the chain and sprockets more than that newfangled voodoo shaft stuff!" DolphinJohn
RobTheRigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 05:00 AM   #51
PhilSpace
The Gov
 
PhilSpace's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2002
Location: Springfield, VA
Oddometer: 35,078
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin650GS
What would the wiring diagram for that look like? Draw me a picture and I'm golden. Thanks!

-Rob
Give me a bit, I'm going on to a work pc and won't be able to play.
__________________

PhilSpace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 06:30 AM   #52
Dieselboy OP
Journey not Destination
 
Dieselboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Port of the Gasparilla
Oddometer: 1,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin650GS
What would the wiring diagram for that look like? Draw me a picture and I'm golden. Thanks!

-Rob



Don't forget to put a fuse in line between the battery and the #30 Input at the relay.

This is the basic diagram for what I am working with right now.
If you were to replace the battery in this picture and put the AP1 fuse pannel in its place, that is what I am trying to get working.
__________________
Dieselboy
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Adventure Continues

Dieselboy screwed with this post 11-21-2012 at 07:48 PM
Dieselboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 09:10 AM   #53
RobTheRigger
Thread Killer
 
RobTheRigger's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Gone fishin'.
Oddometer: 673
Sweet. Thanks! I gotta call 'stich and have 'em add an AP1 to my order.

-Rob
__________________
I can imagine a no more rewarding career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction: "I served in the United States Navy." JFK

"I rode a lot of dirt bikes when I was younger, so I trust the chain and sprockets more than that newfangled voodoo shaft stuff!" DolphinJohn
RobTheRigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 10:44 AM   #54
PhilSpace
The Gov
 
PhilSpace's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2002
Location: Springfield, VA
Oddometer: 35,078
Thanks Diesel. That be it, just add the fuse. This will keep the CANBUS happy with it always seeing a functioning horn. The service manager at my dealer did this with his ST and I have also done it, never a problem.
__________________

PhilSpace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 02:06 PM   #55
RobTheRigger
Thread Killer
 
RobTheRigger's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Gone fishin'.
Oddometer: 673
Phil, you got your's from Morton's, right? I'm in VA Beach, going through Adventure.

-Rob
__________________
I can imagine a no more rewarding career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction: "I served in the United States Navy." JFK

"I rode a lot of dirt bikes when I was younger, so I trust the chain and sprockets more than that newfangled voodoo shaft stuff!" DolphinJohn
RobTheRigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 04:23 PM   #56
Frank Warner
Traveller
 
Frank Warner's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2002
Location: Sydney, Australia
Oddometer: 6,593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dieselboy
This is the basic diagram for what I am working with right now.
Errr if that works then the OEM Horn is not directly connected to the canbuss but rather to a canbuss controller thingy ... as such the added relay does not connect to the canbuss but across the OEM Horn supply lines .. It is fundamentaly that you realise a relay will not directly function on a canbuss by itself!!!!

Dieselboy - if that connection works then you have a problem with your AP1 system ...
Frank Warner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 07:21 PM   #57
rapidoxidationman
Easily trainable
 
rapidoxidationman's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Location: The Teton Rockies
Oddometer: 8,039
sure am glad I've got a Jap bike...
__________________
Quote:
I know I'm feeling badly when I have no interest in speeding
Patrick
rapidoxidationman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 07:49 PM   #58
RobTheRigger
Thread Killer
 
RobTheRigger's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Gone fishin'.
Oddometer: 673
Quote:
Originally Posted by rapidoxidationman
sure am glad I've got a Jap bike...
__________________
I can imagine a no more rewarding career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction: "I served in the United States Navy." JFK

"I rode a lot of dirt bikes when I was younger, so I trust the chain and sprockets more than that newfangled voodoo shaft stuff!" DolphinJohn
RobTheRigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2008, 08:07 PM   #59
MJS
Beastly Adventurer
 
MJS's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Ventura, CA
Oddometer: 1,766
First, I have a 1200GS, the 800 is gonna have to wait awhile. That said, I believe the electronic systems are similar.

The ZFE senses high AND low current draw. The relay coil does not pull enough current and the ZFE shuts the circuit off because the current draw is "out of range". Add a 7.5 ohm, 25watt resistor (Mouser # 284-HS25-7.5F) across the relay coil and it will be fine. This is what I had to do for my 1200GS.

And FWIW, the canbus is just an industrial network that is used to send digital data. It does not do any "work" It's the telephone line, not the telephone.
__________________
"You can follow me, but it's gonna hurt"
MJS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2008, 01:06 AM   #60
Dieselboy OP
Journey not Destination
 
Dieselboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Port of the Gasparilla
Oddometer: 1,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJS
First, I have a 1200GS, the 800 is gonna have to wait awhile. That said, I believe the electronic systems are similar.

The ZFE senses high AND low current draw. The relay coil does not pull enough current and the ZFE shuts the circuit off because the current draw is "out of range". Add a 7.5 ohm, 25watt resistor (Mouser # 284-HS25-7.5F) across the relay coil and it will be fine. This is what I had to do for my 1200GS.

And FWIW, the canbus is just an industrial network that is used to send digital data. It does not do any "work" It's the telephone line, not the telephone.
I assume you put the resistor in line between the relay and the CANBUS tap?

EDIT...after re-reading your post, of course, that is where it is. So you are saying the resistor draws enough current to keep the ZFE from noticing too low a current. Did you remove your OEM horn? If not I'm not sure I understand why you would need to draw more current.


As I stated earlier in this series, the CANBUS pushes (EDIT .2+) volts even with the ignition off, so I'm still looking to prevent that (in addition to figuring out this quandary).
__________________
Dieselboy
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Adventure Continues

Dieselboy screwed with this post 10-17-2008 at 09:35 AM
Dieselboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 09:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014