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Old 01-09-2013, 02:15 PM   #4141
oldmanb777
Just say NO to socialism!
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beamer Pilot View Post
We all know that pilots love to bitch but these days thing are rough.

Brings up an old saying...on the lighter side:

At an Air Canada CALPA meeting the union rep coming out of negotiations said:"I got you guys the greatest deal ever in this new contract you will only work on Saturdays"
From the back of the room a pilots voice: "Is that going to be EVERY F#$% Saturday ?"


Like....."wish i had as much time off as the neighbors think I have, Slept with as many women as my freind think I do, and made as much money as my ex's lawyer thinks I make.
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Old 01-09-2013, 02:27 PM   #4142
oldmanb777
Just say NO to socialism!
 
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So,,, what is a successful CEO, of a $150 million dollar company, operating without a board of directors, living under a microscope, and if he makes mistakes several hundred people die. What is he worth, does he get incentives? bonuses? have teams of lawyers to keep him from getting hanged? Have all kinds of people who have no idea what he does, or how it does it, and couldn't do it no matter how much training they got, putting land mines in his path for him to navigate. But still he is 100% successful. What is he worth? Does he have the admiration of others, etc. Well a new B777 is worth that much or maybe a little more, carries several hundred people @ 8+ miles per minute. At any time it takes off it may be carrying $10 million in cargo. And the company hates me, the people who i take thier kids to see Grandma complain when I put my foot down and say "NO". I'm not going until it is fixed and I can be reasonably confident of a successful flight. They hate me because I made them few minutes late instead of adding more risk that I am willing to take with thier lives. So whats that worth? Constant paycuts?
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Old 01-09-2013, 02:59 PM   #4143
vspeed
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Originally Posted by chazbird View Post
Despite my malcontent, I agree with V-Speed, and its probably the best advice for people thinking of getting involved. Flying has been pretty much all I wanted to do, and I am happy I did it - the 14 or so years I took off from flying were in a aviation science safety realm, directly related to flying. In fact, it was inside in the deepest sense of inside. Now days, despite being unemployed, I still think of myself as a pilot and would be perfectly happy with a mid range salary flying a relatively "simple" plane (E.G. King Air, etc.). One doesn't have to fly for the airlines to have a interesting intrinsic satisfying job, although my opinion is that the skills and experience you build in the airlines and the military via their training and operations will do you well in any other sort of flying. I sometimes fly with people who have not gone through those sorts of systems and there are often habits or behaviors that are less than optimum. But, its one of those things, how do you know what you don't know?
Yep. I was just as happy years ago when I was making about $30K/ year flying freight in a Caravan. I was young, single, and flying airplanes for a living. Everything I owned (including my motorcycle) fit in the bed of my pick-up truck. Had to be mobile in that job. Life was good (and it still is).
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:20 PM   #4144
Heyload
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Originally Posted by Beamer Pilot View Post
Not to be disrespectful but does the word "Arctic" or - 45 degrees mean anything to you? At a certain point I hated mine !
I've done an upload of six UH-1's in -26 degree weather in Fairbanks. Five hours and that was more than enough. Of course, there was that little matter of the crew entrance door departing the aircraft shortly after take-off...

But yeah, I'm familiar with the word "Arctic".
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:47 PM   #4145
chazbird
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So true. Saying "no" is first and foremost about the most important thing a pilot can do. You sit there before departure with maintenance saying defer it, gate/ground service saying load and get out of here, and dispatch saying go - and "please" take minimum fuel. There are other more nuanced examples, but that's an overview.
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:16 PM   #4146
dorkpunch
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Originally Posted by pplassm View Post
And I like it. Not too many of us free-flighting anymore.
I'm doing my best to perpetuate it... We build these in one of the classes I teach, so roughly 40-60 kids a year are at least introduced to stick built rubber band powered models...

Love teaching this unit. Spent yesterday in the library with them, letting them basically look up whatever they wanted related to airplanes. Spent today talking about what they learned and adding my meager .02 to what they found while they repaired planes from the last "fly day"... Lotsa fun!
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Old 01-09-2013, 08:12 PM   #4147
XR650L_Dave
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Originally Posted by fullmonte View Post
If I were gonna be a pilot today, my passengers would be packages and my plane would be brown, or white with a blue tail. Anybody here fly freight?

They all fly freight, some is just self-loading.
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Old 01-10-2013, 01:31 AM   #4148
kamanya
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Originally Posted by oldmanb777 View Post
So,,, what is a successful CEO, of a $150 million dollar company, operating without a board of directors, living under a microscope, and if he makes mistakes several hundred people die. What is he worth, does he get incentives? bonuses? have teams of lawyers to keep him from getting hanged? Have all kinds of people who have no idea what he does, or how it does it, and couldn't do it no matter how much training they got, putting land mines in his path for him to navigate. But still he is 100% successful. What is he worth? Does he have the admiration of others, etc. Well a new B777 is worth that much or maybe a little more, carries several hundred people @ 8+ miles per minute. At any time it takes off it may be carrying $10 million in cargo. And the company hates me, the people who i take thier kids to see Grandma complain when I put my foot down and say "NO". I'm not going until it is fixed and I can be reasonably confident of a successful flight. They hate me because I made them few minutes late instead of adding more risk that I am willing to take with thier lives. So whats that worth? Constant paycuts?
Difference being, you don't own the aircraft or have share options in it. If it was your plane, you sure wouldn't feel the way you do now.
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Old 01-10-2013, 03:48 AM   #4149
PunkinHead
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Originally Posted by oldmanb777 View Post
So whats that worth? Constant paycuts?
Yes, that's what a pilot is worth in the free market because that's what they and the 100 others standing in line behind them are willing to accept. I'm surprised pilots don't pay the airlines for the privilege of flying. I don't know of any other profession where this is true.
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Old 01-10-2013, 06:52 AM   #4150
Beamer Pilot
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Ok…I figured it out,
All of us here with mega year experience, thick log books and worldwide experience should jump seat to a common location and hammer a deal on a multinational hiring & consulting company where pilots will always be well paid, well treated and happy.

My experience with pilots however is that they will jump ship as soon as something faster and bigger appears on the competition’s horizon and not necessarily for more pay or benefits… at least until they get to the majors.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:00 AM   #4151
Heyload
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Originally Posted by Beamer Pilot View Post
Ok…I figured it out,
All of us here with mega year experience, thick log books and worldwide experience should jump seat to a common location and hammer a deal on a multinational hiring & consulting company where pilots will always be well paid, well treated and happy.

My experience with pilots however is that they will jump ship as soon as something faster and bigger appears on the competition’s horizon and not necessarily for more pay or benefits… at least until they get to the majors.
How about we just start our own freight hauling outfit? "ADV Air". We get a couple of cargo planes and haul adventure riders to exotic destinations all over the globe, then pick 'em up when they are done riding all over it. We could haul bikes all over for folks that buy them and need 'em shipped. Expedite parts, help out with "fly and rides", etc.

Probably won't make any money, but it sure would be fun.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:05 AM   #4152
Daniii
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I was dropped out of the Air Force's pilot indoctrination program back in '67, when they discovered I had 20/25 in my left eye. I had 39 hours in Cessna's, and had solo'ed in 3. (I'd flown a bit before, even landed an Aero Commander at Meigs feild!). I never went on and got my private license, and now, reading all this, I have to say it appears to have been a blessing in disguise.

5 years as a Nav (ie: 2nd class citizen) in the USAF was an interesting experience, but totally worthless as any kind of pre-civilian job training (especially 3 years as a sensor operator in the AC-130, unless one can be a professional video game player).

Any hopes I had for a real job went away when the nav position was filled by a hand held widget.

In truth, I was eligible to go back and attend pilot training in '70, but by then, it was obvious that the USAF was headed for a major downsizing, and the trip to pilot school came with a 4 year commitment after graduation. Besides, I was having far too much fun shooting trucks over the 'trail at the time.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:16 AM   #4153
fullmonte
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Originally Posted by chazbird View Post
Maybe you can get yourself into 100K or more debt with minimal experience and get hired with this years indentured servant regional airline for 20K a year. I am sure your high earning wife (or better yet, a wife with a daddy who runs a hedge fund) will support that, and also decide to have your children - all without complaint.
I would be a fool to place a debt load like that on my high earning wife. We enjoy our debt free lifestyle. That crosses aviation off the possible career list.:loll I did enjoy the introductory tandem hang gliding flight she bought me a couple of years ago. That was huge fun.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:29 AM   #4154
Beamer Pilot
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Daniii
but totally worthless as any kind of pre-civilian job training (especially 3 years as a sensor operator in the AC-130, unless one can be a professional video game player).

Try 5 years Infantry under French flag, no one hires Famas experts...




[/QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyload View Post
Probably won't make any money, but it sure would be fun.


May be we should poll the readership as to average income...success is knowing your target audience...
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:35 AM   #4155
Heyload
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[/QUOTE]

May be we should poll the readership as to average income...success is knowing your target audience...
[/QUOTE]

Hmmm. Might be worth taking a look see, anyhow.

I'm pretty sure the Army is about to unload some C-27's, bet we could pick up a couple fairly cheap.
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