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Old 12-03-2012, 07:13 PM   #9076
dfye55
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Mississippi trip prep

I'm just about to finish the assembly of the route strips from Sam, did not guess it would take this long.

http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/...203_195648.jpg

The plan is to leave at 6am , trailer my KLR to Sardis to start the Mississippi Hill Country Trail http://www.transamtrail.com/ on Wed morning. I've loaded the maps to GPS, created the roll charts, prep'd the bike and trailer. I've got another hour's packing gear yet, but the night's young.

I'll post photo updates to facebook along the way, send a friend request if you want to see progress. pm me if you can't fiind me on fb. I can post some updates to this thread from my phone, but pictures after the ride.

Sam planned this route as a one day down and one day back and says "plan 10 daylight hours". Oops, in December there are barely 10 hours of daylight, I do not want to ride hard, so I'm breaking up the ride into 3 sections, still have a 10 hour day on Wed. Camping at Holmes County State Park Wed and Thur.

Well that's the plan anyway, we'll see what the adventure brings.

Don
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:13 PM   #9077
Kevinj110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnson357 View Post
Oh yeah handgun vs. rifle not a good option either........maybe I need to switch to my underfolder in my backpack.
I have been carrying my SBR Noveske in a pack for a while now. I like that I am ready with something a bit more battle ready than the 9mm.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:21 PM   #9078
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Originally Posted by Kevinj110 View Post
I have been carrying my SBR Noveske in a pack for a while now. I like that I am ready with something a bit more battle ready than the 9mm.
Were going to have to start carrying aks then lol.
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Old 12-03-2012, 09:23 PM   #9079
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The Defense Post

Disclaimer:
I am not a lawyer and I am not representing myself as a police officer but as someone giving guidance towards a subject that is racking some people's brains lately. This is not a pro gun or anti gun discussion. Anything I mention is stuff to just take in on your on and not necessarily what you should do or not do. tooslow4u and a few others encountered a a very scary and unpredictable situation a few days ago involving someone with a rifle. Although it looks like our inmates were in the right and on a public road the encounter of the individual is a tense situation. "well here comes some guy with a high powered rifle, stands in his front yard and proceeds to raise up and draw a friggin' bead on my back as I rode past. Then, when I'm already idled past, he is still raised up and draws a bead on one of the guys behind me" ~tooslow4u
Lets define deadly force and show its use according to Indiana Code.

Deadly force -
force which a person uses, causing—or that a person knows, or should know, would create a substantial risk of causing—death or serious bodily harm. In most jurisdictions, the use of deadly force is justified only under conditions of extreme necessity as a last resort, when all lesser means have failed or cannot reasonably be employed.

Forcible Felony - means a felony that involves the use or
threat of force against a human being, or in which there is imminent
danger of bodily injury to a human being.
*Let it be noted other states include burglary in the forcible felony definition but Indiana does not!*

IC (Indiana Code) 35-41-3-2
Use of force to protect person or property
Sec. 2. (a) In enacting this section, the general assembly finds and declares that it is the policy of this state to recognize the unique character of a citizen's home and to ensure that a citizen feels secure in his or her own home against unlawful intrusion by another individual or a public servant. By reaffirming the long standing right of a citizen to protect his or her home against unlawful intrusion, however, the general assembly does not intend to diminish in any way the other robust self defense rights that citizens of this state have always enjoyed. Accordingly, the general assembly also finds and declares that it is the policy of this state that people have a right to defend themselves and third parties from physical harm and crime. The purpose of this section is to provide the citizens of this state with a lawful means of carrying out this policy.
(b) As used in this section, "public servant" means a person described in IC 35-41-1-17, IC 35-31.5-2-129, or IC 35-31.5-2-185.
(c) A person is justified in using reasonable force against any other person to protect the person or a third person from what the person reasonably believes to be the imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person:
(1) is justified in using deadly force; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
if the person reasonably believes that that force is necessary to prevent serious bodily injury to the person or a third person or the commission of a forcible felony. No person in this state shall be placed in legal jeopardy of any kind whatsoever for protecting the person or a third person by reasonable means necessary.
(d) A person:
(1) is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force, against any other person; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person's unlawful entry of or attack on the person's dwelling, curtilage, or occupied motor vehicle.
(e) With respect to property other than a dwelling, curtilage, or an occupied motor vehicle, a person is justified in using reasonable force against any other person if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to immediately prevent or terminate the other person's trespass on or criminal interference with property lawfully in the person's possession, lawfully in possession of a member of the person's immediate family, or belonging to a person whose property the person has authority to protect. However, a person:
(1) is justified in using deadly force; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;
only if that force is justified under subsection (c).
(f) A person is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force, against any other person and does not have a duty to retreat if the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent or stop the other person from hijacking, attempting to hijack, or otherwise seizing or attempting to seize unlawful control of an aircraft in flight. For purposes of this subsection, an aircraft is considered to be in flight while the aircraft is:
(1) on the ground in Indiana:
(A) after the doors of the aircraft are closed for takeoff; and
(B) until the aircraft takes off;
(2) in the airspace above Indiana; or
(3) on the ground in Indiana:
(A) after the aircraft lands; and
(B) before the doors of the aircraft are opened after landing.
(g) Notwithstanding subsections (c) through (e), a person is not justified in using force if:
(1) the person is committing or is escaping after the commission of a crime;
(2) the person provokes unlawful action by another person with intent to cause bodily injury to the other person; or
(3) the person has entered into combat with another person or is the initial aggressor unless the person withdraws from the encounter and communicates to the other person the intent to do so and the other person nevertheless continues or threatens to continue unlawful action.
(h) Notwithstanding subsection (f), a person is not justified in using force if the person:
(1) is committing, or is escaping after the commission of, a crime;
(2) provokes unlawful action by another person, with intent to cause bodily injury to the other person; or
(3) continues to combat another person after the other person withdraws from the encounter and communicates the other person's intent to stop hijacking, attempting to hijack, or otherwise seizing or attempting to seize unlawful control of an aircraft in flight.
(i) A person is justified in using reasonable force against a public servant if the person reasonably believes the force is necessary to:
(1) protect the person or a third person from what the person reasonably believes to be the imminent use of unlawful force;
(2) prevent or terminate the public servant's unlawful entry of or attack on the person's dwelling, curtilage, or occupied motor vehicle; or
(3) prevent or terminate the public servant's unlawful trespass
on or criminal interference with property lawfully in the person's possession, lawfully in possession of a member of the person's immediate family, or belonging to a person whose property the person has authority to protect.
(j) Notwithstanding subsection (i), a person is not justified in using force against a public servant if:
(1) the person is committing or is escaping after the commission of a crime;
(2) the person provokes action by the public servant with intent to cause bodily injury to the public servant;
(3) the person has entered into combat with the public servant or is the initial aggressor, unless the person withdraws from the encounter and communicates to the public servant the intent to do so and the public servant nevertheless continues or threatens to continue unlawful action; or
(4) the person reasonably believes the public servant is:
(A) acting lawfully; or
(B) engaged in the lawful execution of the public servant's official duties.
(k) A person is not justified in using deadly force against a public servant whom the person knows or reasonably should know is a public servant unless:
(1) the person reasonably believes that the public servant is:
(A) acting unlawfully;
(B) not engaged in the execution of the public servant's official duties; and
(2) the force is reasonably necessary to prevent serious bodily injury to the person or a third person.
As added by Acts 1976, P.L.148, SEC.1. Amended by Acts 1977, P.L.340, SEC.8; Acts 1979, P.L.297, SEC.1; P.L.59-2002, SEC.1; P.L.189-2006, SEC.1; P.L.161-2012, SEC.1.

As you may have picked up from skimming all of the above the rifleman had no grounds what so ever of pointing his fire arm at any of our inmates. Our inmates did have a right to defend themselves if needed be at that point though. (This is not a Monday quarter back session so do not take it this way to everyone that was there.) I'm just using my experience from my years of active duty military with combat experience, my 2 years of executive protection, and my few years experience as a police officer. I personally think it was not tactically an opportune time to draw a weapon in self defense due to the rifleman already drawn down on our inmates so the best move was high tailing out of there like they did. Forget egos and anger and retreat if you can. Woodsrat made a good post in reply to this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsrat View Post
Finally a good reason to have a GoPro. Record stuff like this and call the authorities.
The other thing is to absolutely, postively know where you are. There are little-used roads in that area that may very well be legal county roads or ROW's but locals protect them for whatever reason. They might have had a meth lab set up around there or something else highly illegal that they don't want strangers to see. More often than not I've found them to be good ol' boys with an overload of testosterone. If anyone points a gun at me and I survive the encounter I'm calling The Man.
Be careful out there.
Plus you don't bring a handgun to a rifle fight. It was a tense uncertain and rapidly evolving moment and the decision to get the f out was great. I say if any of us ever encounter this again, mark a way point on your gps (most of us have those) and call the authorities when it is safely convenient to and let them deal with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davidc83 View Post
I think you are wrong on that; Indiana passed a law a couple/3 years ago stating we can protect our property, but I dont know if this covers other humans. Maybe the folks are tired of people casing out their places. I had to put a chain across my driveway due to people pulling up into my driveway at night and just sitting there, checking things out until I turned on my lights, then they would take off like a bat out of hades; or maybe they are tired of the damage off road bikes are doing to their property by careless/unthinking riders-the home owners cant tell the difference between courteous and dickhead riders.
What you are thinking of sir is the "castle doctrine". - an American legal doctrine that designates a person's abode (or, in some states, any place legally occupied, such as a car or place of work) as a place in which the person has certain protections and immunities and may in certain circumstances use force, up to and including deadly force, to defend against an intruder without becoming liable to prosecution. [Definition from Wikipedia.] Indiana recognizes the "castle doctrine" as the first part of the above listed indiana code. I will bold underline and italics the parts that must be met.

Sec. 2. (a) In enacting this section, the general assembly finds and declares that it is the policy of this state to recognize the unique character of a citizen's home and to ensure that a citizen feels secure in his or her own home against unlawful intrusion by another individual or a public servant. By reaffirming the long standing right of a citizen to protect his or her home against unlawful intrusion, however, the general assembly does not intend to diminish in any way the other robust self defense rights that citizens of this state have always enjoyed. Accordingly, the general assembly also finds and declares that it is the policy of this state that people have a right to defend themselves and third parties from physical harm and crime. The purpose of this section is to provide the citizens of this state with a lawful means of carrying out this policy.
(b) As used in this section, "public servant" means a person described in IC 35-41-1-17, IC 35-31.5-2-129, or IC 35-31.5-2-185.
(c) A person is justified in using reasonable force against any other person to protect the person or a third person from what the person reasonably believes to be the imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person:
(1) is justified in using deadly force; and
(2) does not have a duty to retreat;

if the person reasonably believes that that force is necessary to prevent serious bodily injury to the person or a third person or the commission of a forcible felony. No person in this state shall be placed in legal jeopardy of any kind whatsoever for protecting the person or a third person by reasonable means necessary.


In easy terms. If you feel your life or a third parties life to be in imminent danger you may use force as long as the burglar is not retreating. If you shoot a burglar in the back it will not turn out well for you unless he had a gun pointed behind him as he ran.
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Old 12-03-2012, 09:24 PM   #9080
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevinj110 View Post
I have been carrying my SBR Noveske in a pack for a while now. I like that I am ready with something a bit more battle ready than the 9mm.
I thought you just had your rape whistle and thats it on you?
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Old 12-03-2012, 09:38 PM   #9081
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Each and every day is in memory of IMPD Officer Perry Renn. E.O.W July 5, 2014. "I will always get out of my car."
2003 Sv650s; 2012 BMW F650GS; 1999 Suzuki Dr 350se
http://www.youtube.com/fetuss10
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Old 12-03-2012, 10:04 PM   #9082
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http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=845650
My west Coast trip planning thread.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:30 AM   #9083
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Nice write up about gun laws nickgindy. Tough to type that all up from squad car laptop? :)
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:09 AM   #9084
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A little motorcycle Christmas humor to start your day!

Sergei and his wife Katrina were riding their Ural motorcycle through Moscow when precipitation began to fall. Concerned because they were on their motorcycle, Katrina made Sergei pull over just as they were entering Red Square.

Katrina said, “We should go home, it’s not safe to ride in the snow.”

To which Sergei responded, “That wasn’t snow it was rain. We’ll be okay to finish our ride.”

“But honey, I saw a snowflake land on my nose!”

Before the argument could escalate too far - they saw Rudolph, a Communist Party official pull up on his Ural. They decided to ask him what the weather was doing.

Rudolph looked up and responded, “It is definitely raining!” and rode away in a cloud of exhaust.

Katrina looked up again, turned to Sergei and said, “I still think it’s snowing!”

To which Sergei replied, “Rudolph the red knows rain dear.”
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:33 AM   #9085
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Originally Posted by zamboni9 View Post
Nice write up about gun laws nickgindy. Tough to type that all up from squad car laptop? :)
umm...... copy n paste. easy cheesy.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:56 AM   #9086
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooSlow4U View Post
Sergei and his wife Katrina were riding their Ural motorcycle through Moscow when precipitation began to fall. Concerned because they were on their motorcycle, Katrina made Sergei pull over just as they were entering Red Square.

Katrina said, “We should go home, it’s not safe to ride in the snow.”

To which Sergei responded, “That wasn’t snow it was rain. We’ll be okay to finish our ride.”

“But honey, I saw a snowflake land on my nose!”

Before the argument could escalate too far - they saw Rudolph, a Communist Party official pull up on his Ural. They decided to ask him what the weather was doing.

Rudolph looked up and responded, “It is definitely raining!” and rode away in a cloud of exhaust.

Katrina looked up again, turned to Sergei and said, “I still think it’s snowing!”

To which Sergei replied, “Rudolph the red knows rain dear.”
Wah Wah Wah
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Old 12-04-2012, 11:49 AM   #9087
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those kind of things work themselves out
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Each and every day is in memory of IMPD Officer Perry Renn. E.O.W July 5, 2014. "I will always get out of my car."
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:20 PM   #9088
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsrat View Post
Nice guy that I am I didn't go back to look for 'em.
This is good to know. And bravo, good sir.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:29 PM   #9089
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsrat View Post
You guys with SM bikes will love Shiloh Rd. between Tunnel and Anderson Roads north of IN 45 and west of the Lake Lemon area.
You had us on this road for the 2011 HNF ride. I used that Sunday track 2 or 3 times this summer. Very technical, and like you said, many driveways,etc.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:37 PM   #9090
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[QUOTE=Woodsrat;20176263]You must tell me more of this new science.../QUOTE]


lol... You crack me up...
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