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Old 02-26-2013, 03:15 PM   #961
clintnz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I've seen a few broke frames, on line, never in person ....
.
Got a link? Given I've had to strengthen my 640 subframe I'm probably in the firing line for main frame issues also if they exist. I'd like to know where the weak point is so I can keep an eye on it. PM me if you like, no need to clutter this thread with KTM problems.

I'd recommend the DR650 as an adv bike to a lot of people but given I personally know several people that have had gearbox blowups & one who has broken a frame I wouldn't call the rates of these failures irrelevant.

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Old 02-26-2013, 05:40 PM   #962
Adv Grifter
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Originally Posted by clintnz View Post
Got a link? Given I've had to strengthen my 640 subframe I'm probably in the firing line for main frame issues also if they exist. I'd like to know where the weak point is so I can keep an eye on it. PM me if you like, no need to clutter this thread with KTM problems.
Hey Clintz,
I did a quick search and found a few KTM frame issues ... but NONE on 640 series. But I do remember a RR on Horizon's Unlimited some years ago, guy on an Africa trip, IIRC, cracked a frame on a 640 (but could have been a sub frame?) Hard to find link, long time ago.

Here are a couple interesting links listing 640 data:
http://micapeak.com/reg/bikes/LC4/

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...lems-list-9345
the above link starts in about 2004 ... goes forward from there.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=628511
Gunnerbuck and Clintz star in the above thread ... should put the fear of God (and special factory KTM tools!) to anyone considering a KTM
Can you imagine the rebuild costs if one were paying mechanic shop rates?

The pics I found (in 5 minutes) were mostly race bikes ... but I guess ALL KTM's are race bikes?

But I'm sure 640's are tougher and I'm sure you could find broken Suzuki race bikes too ... but you won't find many DR650's ... and THAT is my point. Your numbers and experiences are tiny representations of ALL DR650's out in the world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by clintnz View Post
I'd recommend the DR650 as an adv bike to a lot of people but given I personally know several people that have had gearbox blowups & one who has broken a frame I wouldn't call the rates of these failures irrelevant.
Cheers
Clint
That said, I could claim that since I know DOZENS of KTM riders and have witnessed many KTM failures IN PERSON (and even towed one out of the woods )... that KTM's failures are "not irrelevant" and one should NEVER consider a KTM because of that. Can you see where I'm going with this ... and do you see how weak your argument is?

And in the case of the DR ... given the HUGE numbers of units out in the world, especially irrelevant since failure rates on ANY part of the bike ... is probably a fraction of 1%.
A few pics of someone's bad day!










This last one has been reposted here on ADV a 100 times.
Overall, looks like a lot of steering stem failures in the pics above.

Adv Grifter screwed with this post 02-26-2013 at 10:04 PM
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Old 02-26-2013, 08:25 PM   #963
gunnerbuck
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Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Do you work in a MC Shop?
Would you ever consider a DR650 as a travel bike if you got the chance to do a long range trip? Or would you stick with your KTM?
Nope, no MC shops within 150Miles so people bring their stuff to me, I just fix whatever comes in, usually it'll be chain saws, mowers, weed whackers, generators, firearms or motorcycles, been doing it for years and am kind of tired of it... The last couple years I've been telling them to go elsewhere as I need my spare time for riding...

About 10 Yrs ago I was shopping for a DR but ended up getting a good deal on a KLR so I went that way... Now that I own a 640 {actually 2} I don't think I would consider a DR/KLR anymore, unless they came out with a modern updated version... By updated I don't mean the street platforms that manufactures seem to be focused on with their Adventure bike labels...


The 640 uses the same triple components as these bikes and it probably would not be hard to recreate a break like this with my bike... All I would have to do is grossly over torque the steering stem clamping bolt and then go do some high speed passes over choppy ground...
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:00 PM   #964
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Originally Posted by Klay View Post
Quit worrying about things that have so little probability of occurring at least comparing the number of KNOWN failures to the total number of DRs sold when factoring said probability. Look out for traffic, the real threat. If your ride blows up, you can always hitchhike home though that would instantly end the motorcycle trip youve been waiting for years to finally have the resources for.
Fixed it for ya'

I would think that the members of this community push their bikes harder than most... and thus it is likely we have a higher percentage of failures relative to the total number of DR650s ridden by members here. I only count those who, you know, USE the DR offroad. If its considered "beyond design parameters and thus your fault" if the DR650 blows third when you are out on some two-track, well.. thats pretty lame. Pretty cheap on Suzuki's part too.

The Aussies blow up their bikes more often because they ride them harder. Like im going to be trying to do... Frankly, ill worry about what I wish to worry about- a design flaw that in some bikes, supposedly a fraction of one percent as stated by the DR fanboys but debated by some of us, causes a catastrophic failure that essentially renders the bike a complete loss.

I understand to many of you, it really doesnt matter. Ok, it blew up- buy another one and transfer farkles.. done. Well, some of us are poor and cant afford that. $3400 is a lot of money to me (and what I paid for the DR). If it blows, im fucked. Its pretty much that simple. I certainly wouldnt use the remaining trip money to buy another DR- thats for damn sure. Id switch to the orange or blue koolaid before drinking more of the gear-exploding kind..
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:06 PM   #965
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Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
If you jump a DR650 or ride Whoops at speed ... something will break eventually. Not made for that. The DR is a mild mannered, long range travel bike ... not a Moto Cross bike. Anyone riding it as such gets what they get.
...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
In '96 Suzuki decided to toughen it up a bit and incorporate some new designs (SACS air/oil cooling, oil cooler, new frame, carb and more). They brought in Suzuki race them magician (and 5 time GNCC champion) Rodney Smith to help redesign and do R&D testing on the new bike. Turned out good ... not perfect, but not bad.

I attended the DR650 product launch ... in 1996. Anyone here riding then?
Rodney showed the press just what the bike could do ... in the right hands.
What did he do, run it in a circle on a smooth dirt patch? Apparently anything more and its "not made for that." Might want to switch to straight water instead of koolaid..
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:45 AM   #966
NordieBoy OP
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Originally Posted by GSF1200S View Post
...


What did he do, run it in a circle on a smooth dirt patch? Apparently anything more and its "not made for that." Might want to switch to straight water instead of koolaid..
DR650's got 2nd overall in the 1996 and 3rd overall in the 1997 Australian Safari.
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:51 AM   #967
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DR650's got 2nd overall in the 1996 and 3rd overall in the 1997 Australian Safari.
How many total kilometers/miles were on the bikes? Did those bikes have all the same components as the current DR650? If the bikes run in the Safari didn't blow, does that somehow prove the DR650 only blows less than 1% of gearboxes?

Did they rebuild the transmission afterwards?
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:03 AM   #968
warewolf
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Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
A few pics of someone's bad day!
Umm, none of those bikes are LC4s.

Not even close.
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:20 AM   #969
tHEtREV
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Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I admit I'm suspicious of KTM from the bad taste they left from my first experiences in the late 80's and early 90's riding AMA Enduros.



Suspicious? You base your whole opinion of Euro bikes on crap you read about or heard about KTMs in the 80's and early 90s.

But please carry on, I just love reading the crap you come up with sometimes.
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Old 02-27-2013, 03:30 AM   #970
warewolf
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All I would have to do is grossly over torque the steering stem clamping bolt and then go do some high speed passes over choppy ground...
Except for the over-torquing, I've done that a lot with my 640 Adventure and it's still going strong. In the last few years it's probably spent more time being hammered on technical trail rides and cross-country races than on road/adventure rides. I've even had a crack at enduro-cross on it. If anyone's gonna break an LC4 frame, it'll be me!!
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:03 AM   #971
Adv Grifter
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Originally Posted by GSF1200S View Post
The Aussies blow up their bikes more often because they ride them harder. Like im going to be trying to do... Frankly, ill worry about what I wish to worry about- a design flaw that in some bikes, supposedly a fraction of one percent as stated by the DR fanboys but debated by some of us, causes a catastrophic failure that essentially renders the bike a complete loss.
You need to check out some of the videos posted by our NZ and Oz brothers ... and ask Nordie boy about the sort or trails they ride down there. From what I've seen, a lot tougher than AK. Also, some guys down under are racing DR's, running moto cross races on them.

Alaska is a cakewalk by comparison to anything these guys are doing. AK is ALL roads ... mostly paved now, with some graded gravel roads. My buddy rode it on his Gold Wing 2 years ago ... with his wife on the back. No trails unless you get way off the beaten path. I rode AK in the 80's on a R80GS. Roads were worse back then ... I had no problems at all except for a few stretches of mud. On tour you won't be doing any hard riding. You'll be too loaded up for that.
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:13 AM   #972
Adv Grifter
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Umm, none of those bikes are LC4s.
Not even close.
reading comprehension? I clearly stated NO LC4's.
Read my posts mate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by warewolf View Post
Except for the over-torquing, I've done that a lot with my 640 Adventure and it's still going strong. In the last few years it's probably spent more time being hammered on technical trail rides and cross-country races than on road/adventure rides. I've even had a crack at enduro-cross on it. If anyone's gonna break an LC4 frame, it'll be me!!
Good to hear. After reading some of the LC4 threads (see links in post 966) listing LC4 problems and a few build threads. Way too much to deal with. You guys are clearly all
professional mechanics ... and more power to ya! Not all of us have Milling machines, Lathes, and Tig Welder in our shed ... nor are we able to buy $$$$ in special tools.
Great to see the loyalty and enthusiasm towards the LC4's. But I left all that behind in the 70's when I sold off my old Triumph Desert sleds and flat tracker bikes and bought a reliable Jap bike.
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:36 AM   #973
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You guys are clearly all
professional mechanics ... and more power to ya! Not all of us have Milling machines, Lathes, and Tig Welder in our shed ... nor are we able to buy $$$$ in special tools.
This is NZ.

We have our own hammers and hacksaws but share the vice and stick welder.





My lathe is a Unimat IV...
Not the fastest or best thing in the world...
Bit like a DR really :cool:
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:00 PM   #974
tHEtREV
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Originally Posted by NordieBoy View Post
DR650's got 2nd overall in the 1996 and 3rd overall in the 1997 Australian Safari.
You sure about that?

I know a DR came 3rd one year, but I thought that was the only time one was at the pointy end of the field (I'm running from memory here, it was a VSM preped DR).
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:13 PM   #975
tHEtREV
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Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Good to hear. After reading some of the LC4 threads (see links in post 966) listing LC4 problems and a few build threads. Way too much to deal with. You guys are clearly all
professional mechanics ... and more power to ya! Not all of us have Milling machines, Lathes, and Tig Welder in our shed ... nor are we able to buy $$$$ in special tools.
Great to see the loyalty and enthusiasm towards the LC4's. But I left all that behind in the 70's when I sold off my old Triumph Desert sleds and flat tracker bikes and bought a reliable Jap bike.
Not so much LC4 loyalty, more people sick of you spreading lies and misconceptions about non Jap bikes.

There are a hell of a lot of KTM owners who have never had a problem with them, and most if not all have had there share of jap bikes before going Euro.

How many KTMs or Huskys have you owned?

The DR is a good bike for the price, but it does have problems just like every other bike, your failure admit that,and your little story's that you like to make up prove your ignorance and nothing else.

Now back to the third gear failures...
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