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Old 03-10-2009, 03:52 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chewie
Chewie

Face it. You'll never understand us yanks.
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Old 03-10-2009, 06:23 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chewie


did it pull your virtual crevice hairs out when you removed it?
Hey Stroppy - how about a big, virtual "fuck you"



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Old 03-12-2009, 07:25 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlearl476
Yes, perhaps so. But will ONE say Genelecs are bad?
Yeah, I will. Okay they're very good, but I've spent the last 10 years auditioning mini-monitors for a project we have and found that the all-in-one Genelecs were a bit bright and unrefined for my taste. I'm just talking about their little self powered jobs here, not the big stuff; and we did (still do) have two different pair here in the shop to test. All I can say is that they're not the speakers people fight over.

The ones they fight over are the Harbeths HLP3 and Amphion Ions. Saddly, I'm prolly already recommending stuff way over your budget as the speakers are close to $2000/pr and you'll need a power amp that's at least $1000 to get the best out of them, and you'll still have to buy a sub. The Genelec sub is dandy, BTW.

So, the Genelec recco is decent and my only comeback is that folks may want to consider the NHT or Adam self powered speakers as an alternative, and if you're willing to go the route of passive speakers and amps check out PSB speakers---everyone a knockout at its price. And find a class-D amp which uses the ICEpower modules from B&O---there's a few dozen out there and can be had for around a grand if you look.

I'm definately in agreement with those who will tell you that you need to put them on stands out in the room. You'll never get really good imaging unless you're willing to move them out into the room. Where to put them is the trick. Lots to read on the web about speaker positioning, but the most important thing is that you make an equilateral triangle between the speakers and your head; and that you keep the speakers from being too close to the side walls.

That room is very live (lots of reverberance), but simply stuffing it with apolstered chairs and that polarbear skin rug you've been eying won't do it. See, all that stuff has fairly strong selectivity of absorption, so you'll be damping some frequencies far more than others. So reverberance will be damped unevenly. The quick and dirty advice is this: don't put too much damping in the room, you want a little reverberance time (called RT60-the time it takes for reverberance to decrease by 60dB). I'd keep it fairly lively and then put some of these things in the corners of the room, and some of these things where they'll block the first reflections from the side walls (where the sound from the speakers makes a bounce of the side wall and goes to your ears). Yes they're fucking expensive, but I guaranty you that the money you spend acoustically treating a room will go at least twice as far toward getting great sound as money spent on gear. Here's a killer page to start learing about room treatments, and more reading.

Computer audio slays! And there's not too much wrong with well ripped mp3s (320kbs, no VBR, LAME encoding) Use Exact Audio Copy as your ripper and Foobar as your player.

Best web audio revies and info is Soundstage, a very deep site. Most folks here will want the Goodsound section that specializes in great affordable audio.

Lastly, you old fart, I'll pm you my phone number, feel free to call anytime and we can talk about how your gaping butthole my interfere with the acoustic properties of the room and your precious fucking opera.

Doesn't anybody do old school jazz anymore?

Oh, and yes, I'm a dickhead modulator and moved your thread into shiny things ... where it belongs.
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Old 03-12-2009, 07:46 AM   #64
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Putts, you are a man of rare perspicacity and brilliance. Wait until I tell my wife I'm dropping a bunch of money on black styrofoam to place over the walls she just had painted

I have a pretty high end Dell laptop I plan to devote to this project initially. My son has recommended (and is hooking me up with) an Echo Indigo PCMCIA soundcard to address the conversion issue - what think you of that?

Thanks for the PM and for being a fountain of spewing auditory knowledge.

Oh - and what is this "jazz" of which you speak?
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Old 03-12-2009, 09:00 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobFV1
My son has recommended (and is hooking me up with) an Echo Indigo PCMCIA soundcard to address the conversion issue - what think you of that?
Mmm, okay. Try this. Sorry, , but there's really nothing better for even close to the price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob
Oh - and what is this "jazz" of which you speak?
It's music where the players don't get a score and just wing it.
(make sure to start watching at 3:00 in for pure, raw, inspired improv.)






You classical types may not get it.
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Old 03-12-2009, 10:06 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Putts
You classical types may not get it.
I get it - it's like a cadenza, sort of. Go about 3 minutes in to this clip and this crazy Chinaman improvises the dogshit out of Rachmaninov!



Okay Putts - what if I trash the D/A converter laptop idea and go to something like this - it looks pretty damn cool and multifunctional:

http://www.olive.us/products/opus4_overview.html#
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Old 03-12-2009, 11:53 AM   #67
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Going from a room to whole house audio?

I have a fireball server that docks with my Ipod, and gets controlled with a few Crestron panels, dedicated amps with B&W in-walls and a Sunfire sub, it sounds great for in-room sound, but it will not stand up to a mid-sized Genelec set. Not by a long shot.
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Old 03-12-2009, 12:06 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Putts
Yeah, I will. Okay they're very good, but I've spent the last 10 years auditioning mini-monitors for a project we have and found that the all-in-one Genelecs were a bit bright and unrefined for my taste. I'm just talking about their little self powered jobs here, not the big stuff; and we did (still do) have two different pair here in the shop to test. All I can say is that they're not the speakers people fight over.

I thought all of the Gens are active monitors? Did you try the tiny ones or the larger units? I know of more than a few speakers that sound better at a reasonable listening level, but since I am a movie buff I tend to play things loud and that may be why my opinion is so high.


The 1039a really rocks and can be as accurate as the original mix.
I want two of these and the matching center. But, the center costs more than a good used GS.









I may as well pick up a good sub with my lottery money that I just know I'm gonna get.

Say it with me:
"19 Hz lower cut-off frequency and 124 dB sound pressure output capability are sufficient to handle the most demanding high SPL applications"!




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Old 03-12-2009, 02:30 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FXRocket
I thought all of the Gens are active monitors? Did you try the tiny ones or the larger units? I know of more than a few speakers that sound better at a reasonable listening level,
Sorry, I wasn't too clear above, and I'm not really badmouthing Genelecs, just that at that very competitive lower price range, there's a couple of people who've done it better, IMHO. Also, at the low prices, for rather simple 2-way speakers, separate speakers and amps let buy buy the speakers from makers who've mastered the art of inexpensive speaker making, and price competition in the electronics market makes quality gear available readily. So I think by buyins separates at that price level you can do VERY well.

I mention PSB speakers in my above post, the electronics side would include folks like Channel Island Audio that friggen rock for the money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobUyerass1
this crazy Chinaman improvises the dogshit out of Rachmaninov!
HOLY SHIT! That guy rocks! Fuckin' thanks for that!

Since we're into piano players, unlike Thelonious Monk above who knew the value of a note and never player more of 'em than he needed to, Art Tatum never knew when to shut the fuck up. None the less, it is impressive as hell.

I know its rather more romantic then classical, but here he is going off on Dvorak.







So the Olive, eh? Why not just blow your wad and go for the Sooloos, a company just puchased by one of my audio company favorites: Meridian.



Yours for a mere $15,000. I hope the girl comes with it.

Naw, go with any old cheap ass computer with a humungus hard drive in it as your network file server; run the Slim Server app on it, and then put Squeezeboxes all over your house at $299 each. Any where you want good sound, hook up a little outboard DAC to the digital output.



I love my Squeezeboxes, high-rez music of the server, internet radio, Pandora music discovery services, friggen great.
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Old 03-13-2009, 04:48 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Putts
Mmm, okay. Try this.
Okay that looks pretty darn good to me. Can I input a Sirius receiver and my laptop and output to the Genelecs with that thing?
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Old 03-14-2009, 04:12 PM   #71
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I was gunna mention room treatment as well. WAY more bang for the buck than you will believe is possible. Especially in small 'live' rooms. Do make sure that your floor is solid. Really good source material and an impressive & capable sub woofer will get every wall and the ceiling hump'n. Room treatment will 'help' especially if tuned properly. I have ASC tube traps in my room and the difference these make is night and day.

http://www.asc-hifi.com/articles/iar85.htm
http://www.tubetrap.com/tube-trap-setup.htm
http://www.stereophile.com/roomtreat...ps/index1.html

They have been around for decades but are little known.

If you want to hear into the music these really help.

JJ
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Old 03-14-2009, 09:04 PM   #72
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JJ - thanks for the tip. Got the Genelec 8020's tonight and plugged them into the laptop - no DAC and due to a miscalculation on the number of cables required I could not hook up the sub, but even with these limtations, Mahler 9 sounded completely fantastic on these speakers - it sounded like an actual orchestra, not laike a recording of the orchestra.

Will get the sub hooked up tomorrow, and have a DAC on the way from Putts to hook in to my USB port/ Will spend some time with hte room - I think I need to get something in the corners to soak up some of the extra sound bouncing around.

So far these speakers are incredible. Oh - and that subwoofer is HEAVY!
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Old 03-14-2009, 10:01 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobFV1
snip

So far these speakers are incredible. Oh - and that subwoofer is HEAVY!
Having plenty of mass is decidely a good thing. The last thing you want to see is your sub woofer dancing across the room when they whack that big kettle drum…

JJ
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Old 03-15-2009, 11:02 AM   #74
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Progressive Genelec Ride Report

Okay - today I got over to Best Buy, and after asking three people I found one who knew what an XLR cable was. I couldn't remember myself, but I made up a mnemonic device - "cheap ass motorcycle, replace first letter with "X" "

So I bought two 5 foot male to female Hosa 3-pin XLR's and came home and hooked the subwoofer up beteen the laptop and the 8020A's. I am just running ripped MP3's off of iTunes because my iTunes library was already on the machine and my first attempt to use EAC was unsuccessful.

Anyway - first impressions of the Genelec TriPak (2 8020A's and a 7050B sub):
  • Sound reproduction is incredible. It is deep and textured, like sitting in the premium seats in a real symphony orchestra hall;
  • The subwoofer, while not cheap, is definitely something you should spring for if getting these speakers for HiFi music reproduction;
  • The Genelec's seem to be very well suited to the music that I listen to - so far have belted out a little Mahler, a little Brahms, some Verdi - major kick-ass sound;
  • The sound reproduction is very faithful - some of the source MP3's had a hiss, and it is very noticeable when played through these speakers;
  • Right now I am handicapped by not having my stands yet, so I have got the rear-ported 8020's too close to the back wall - they sound great now but will sound better.
  • Ditto on wall treatment - I will start with some sound absorbing curtains and stuff, probably get some tubes for the corners per JJ's suggestion and then see how I am doing.
  • I really need to clean up my digital music collection - addition of a DA converter is going to be very welcome. I imagine I will probably move to the Olive deck or something similar before too long, but the first I will try the Dell laptop with Tyll's DAC.
So far so good - nothing but great things to say about the Genelec's
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Old 03-15-2009, 11:41 AM   #75
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As long as you're on a tweak-fest, order up some Canare "Star-Quad" cable with Neutrik gold conductor XLRs from Sweetwater. IMO, better than the cable Monster charges a fortune for.
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