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Old 11-22-2012, 03:46 AM   #4861
johnno950
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you guys should go work for nasa
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:56 AM   #4862
KASUYAHO
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NASA works on 99.999999999 percent accuracy.

Theres way too many fuckups in here for that Johno
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Old 11-22-2012, 03:57 AM   #4863
poppy
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G'day Johnno, i tried ringing Serco today(thanks for the heads up), but the workshop must shut around 4.00. I have a couple of leads now so will chase them up tomorrow.
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Old 11-22-2012, 04:08 AM   #4864
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KASUYAHO View Post
NASA works on 99.999999999 percent accuracy.

Theres way too many fuckups in here for that Johno
ground control to major f-ckup happens quite a bit when i work on my bikes
Poppy if you want a loan of a clymer xr650r manual for a couple of months give me a pm and i will send it to you in the next week or so.
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Old 11-22-2012, 04:10 AM   #4865
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KASUYAHO View Post
NASA works on 99.999999999 percent accuracy.

Theres way too many fuckups in here for that Johno
nasa don't even know if there working in metric or imperial let alone getting down to a 99.999999999 % accuracy
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Old 11-22-2012, 05:03 AM   #4866
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnno950 View Post
ground control to major f-ckup happens quite a bit when i work on my bikes
Poppy if you want a loan of a clymer xr650r manual for a couple of months give me a pm and i will send it to you in the next week or so.
Yeh i have days like that
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Old 11-22-2012, 05:04 AM   #4867
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nasa don't even know if there working in metric or imperial let alone getting down to a 99.999999999 % accuracy
Whys that Joe
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:09 PM   #4868
Andy-Gadget
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I agree that these don't look like cracks to me, casting mold is the most likely cause.
If you want to be completely sure, do a dye penetrant crack check, but my bet is they won't show anything.

The non-rotating side of a bearing is usually size for size fit, called transition, only the crank side of the bearing needs interference, think about a rear wheel drive vehicle front wheel stub axle and hub, and where the interference is and which parts turn.

For reassembling and truing the crank, buy a copy of "Tuning for speed" by that great Aussie engineer, Phil Irving, and all will be described in practical terms.
Quote:
Originally Posted by poppy View Post
Push


Push


Push


There it is, welcome xr crank


Not sure i like the look of this bearing






or these cracks


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Old 11-22-2012, 12:56 PM   #4869
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy-Gadget View Post

The non-rotating side of a bearing is usually size for size fit, called transition, only the crank side of the bearing needs interference, think about a rear wheel drive vehicle front wheel stub axle and hub, and where the interference is and which parts turn.

.
Wee bit different when talking about steel into alloy housing though otherwise when the motor gets hot, the bearing will spin in the case.
Don't forget also that some cranks are located by one of the main ball bearings.
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Old 11-22-2012, 04:49 PM   #4870
jm-2008
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[QUOTE=KASUYAHO;20095241]I have been doing some reading etc about balancing the single engine cylinder engine.

I look at the crank on the 650R and i don't see drill holes to show that it has been balanced.

Thumpers generally have 'Pork Chop' flywheels (not full circle like the two strokes - different reason for them)
Majority of excess material is eliminated in the profile (pork chop shape) eliminating the need to remove heaps of material either side of the big end - Counter balancer addresses this issue
This is where the counter balancer comes in in that it replicates rotational mass in a 180 degree rotaion in the opposite direction to counter the effects of bigend crank mass flying around.

Big single and or (non 180degree) twins with a common throw (big ends together) benefit from a counter balancer.

In a non counter balancer type motor balancing the cranks is done with a percentage of the rod/piston weight at the bigend.
If memory serves me correctly the percentage will often come into play at different rev ranges
ie when your car wheels are 'out of balance' you will experience shake at some speeds and not others.

So what percentage do we over balance the 650R if any
Good question, theres data available for a non counterbalanced engine (if you are keen for a read find Phill Irvings - Tuning For Speed, mainly on old British singles and as he designed the Vincent has a lot on V Twins.
Certain theres a section on balancing.


Where does the counter balancer come into play, at lower RPM or High RPM's ?

Through out the range I say at a guess as it 'counters in the opposite plain'

JM
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Old 11-22-2012, 09:00 PM   #4871
poppy
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Bit more progress

Pulling the bearing off the crank


Had to do some repairs to the case were the case saver fits


Tigged up mounting lug


Cleaned & shaped up


Drilled out, ready for tapping


Bit of a chamfer just like factory


Works just like a bought one
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Old 11-22-2012, 09:19 PM   #4872
ditchwitch650
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best case saver i could find

but i suspect you might make your own might be a few here keen
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Old 11-23-2012, 01:34 AM   #4873
Lostsaffa
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Originally Posted by ditchwitch650 View Post
best case saver i could find

but i suspect you might make your own might be a few here keen
Hey is that my one DW?!
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Old 11-23-2012, 02:09 AM   #4874
jm-2008
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[QUOTE=DRjoe;20096765]thumper racing in the states can balance the crank and balancer for you but don't ask them how they do it because its apparently a trade secret.
I think lots of complex maths is the secret to getting the balancer shaft and the crank shaft working well together


Not certain is that big a secret.
Ref Big Willy's comment a few posts up re balancing the Bonnie at 85%
You could allways tell if some one had their late 60's early 70's Trophy/Bonnevile's balanced as the front wheel would not shake when they idled - not a guaranteed give away but a good indicator.

Back to the question -
Deducing the correct precentage of rod/piston weight to use for the desired effect is the secret.
With the old Trumpet's (Triumph's) many a percentage was tried till the 85% figure was settled on as a good target to aim at.
As for balancing a counterweighted motor one would expect balancing both together (to an appropriate % would be a good start point.

Lots of quiet lurkers out there who will know, maybe we should seek their sage advise

(This might turn into another - Whats the best oil discussion )

For the sake of the discussion would be interested to know from the learned ones

JM
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Old 11-23-2012, 02:09 AM   #4875
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best case saver i could find

but i suspect you might make your own might be a few here keen
Your bikes so clean.....it's nearly gay
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