ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Thumpers
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-19-2007, 11:56 PM   #1
Dotbond OP
Africa, Africa
 
Dotbond's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Dunedin. New Zealand
Oddometer: 732
Cry HELP!! F**KED my LC4 cam


Did a weekend ride and tappit noise came back about 100km into the ride.
Didn't think much of it.
Just pulled the rocker cover and the inlet cam follower bearing had siezed and has worn the inlet cam lobe about 1mm.
What to do??


Bike has done 15,500km. Regular oil and filter changes changes. 2004 model.
__________________
2012 KTM 690 R
2010 KTM 990 R (Sold)

2008 N.Z.Yamaha Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=306905
2007 N.Z.Adventures Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201557

Dotbond screwed with this post 11-20-2007 at 12:45 AM
Dotbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 01:12 AM   #2
JSL
Adventurer
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Location: Finland
Oddometer: 44
You need a new cam and the cam follower bearing (no? really!?). This happened to me this fall after about 28600km, though the damage was not nearly as bad. I suggest that you replace both cam follower bearings while you're at it. I replaced only the broken one and the tapping noise came back after ~1000km so I'll have to open it again some time soon.

The new (standard) cam is ~150 euros and the bearings are ~20 euros each. I've been told that a damaged cam may also be fixed by the same shops that do cam tuning.
JSL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 02:09 AM   #3
bmwktmbill
Traveler
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Traveler
Oddometer: 4,733
Dotbond,
That sucks, I just wrote a bunch of good stuff about KTM 640 reliability. I take it all back....
Make sure you peen the shafts for the new bearings in place. I didn't and paid for it when the shaft drifted out and raised a little hell.
Run a magnet around in the recesses. Check the water pump.
b.
__________________
'02 KTM 640 Adventure-lowered
"On the road there are no special cases."
Cormack McCarthy-The Crossing

The faster it goes the faster it breaks.
And high performance=high maintenance.
Bill Shockley
bmwktmbill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 04:56 AM   #4
rob748
resident alien !!!!
 
rob748's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: traveling somewhere :)
Oddometer: 824
cam

mine did this at about 15000, do the water pump seal while you have it open
rob748 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 06:02 AM   #5
whitezw
General Flunky and Grunt
 
whitezw's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: Southeast
Oddometer: 15
Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dotbond

Did a weekend ride and tappit noise came back about 100km into the ride.
Didn't think much of it.
Just pulled the rocker cover and the inlet cam follower bearing had siezed and has worn the inlet cam lobe about 1mm.
What to do??


Bike has done 15,500km. Regular oil and filter changes changes. 2004 model.
I have a cam from a 1997 LC4 if you are interested...

Thanks,
Zeb
whitezw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 05:55 PM   #6
Zerodog
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: SLC, UT
Oddometer: 1,233
Dude that sucks. Get a rally cam while you are at it.
Zerodog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 06:22 PM   #7
Spam16v
Squid Rocket
 
Spam16v's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: B-lo, NY
Oddometer: 777
good excuse to spend money for more power while it's apart if you ask me... look on the bright side b/c focusing on the negative just sucks.
Spam16v is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 08:49 PM   #8
Dotbond OP
Africa, Africa
 
Dotbond's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Dunedin. New Zealand
Oddometer: 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zerodog
Dude that sucks. Get a rally cam while you are at it.
And i suppose you "know" someone who does them.....?

Serious couple of questions here.
1. Will i need to strip the motor down to check it out or will just flushing and changing the oil and filters suffice? I am a student for the next 2 years - poor.

2. Any body heard of getting the cam repaired?

3. Do i replace the cam bearings with KTM ones or a known aftermarket brand?

4. How do i get the cam out?

Any words of wisdom welcome please.
__________________
2012 KTM 690 R
2010 KTM 990 R (Sold)

2008 N.Z.Yamaha Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=306905
2007 N.Z.Adventures Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201557
Dotbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 08:51 PM   #9
holycaveman
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2005
Oddometer: 14,379
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob748
mine did this at about 15000, do the water pump seal while you have it open
Hmmm, look familiar Rob?
holycaveman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 10:16 PM   #10
gunnerbuck
Island Hopper
 
gunnerbuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Location: N.V.I, B.C.
Oddometer: 3,707
#1 If the bearing just seized and all the needle rollers are in place only fine particulate may of gone into the motor. If thats the case you may get away with just doing the repair along with with a few oil flushes. Pull the drain plugs and see what the magnets say...

#2 I would say to just spring for the new part rather than trying to rebuild the old cam.

#3 I don't know of any aftermarket follower bearings for the 640. The OEMs are not that costly and I think are your only option. They are a little tricky to replace as the bearings consist of loose needles and a pastic containment sleeve that slides out when the shaft is pushed thru. As Bill mentioned you will have to press the old shafts out {I used a ball joint removal press to do mine} as the shaft ends have been flared with a ringstamp. The new shafts can be pushed in by hand and the ends can be flared by carefully dimpling the shaft ends 6-8 times per end with a small centerpunch around the outside edges.

#4 Use the crankshaft locking bolt to lock the shaft you can then loosen and remove the sprocket retaining bolt. Pry the bearing circlip up out of its groove. You then can tilt the cap bearing end of the camshaft up and slide the shaft out of the sprocket. Once clear of the sprocket the shaft, bearing and circlip can be lifted out together and a dowel can be put in the sprocket to hold it in place....
gunnerbuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 11:24 PM   #11
Dotbond OP
Africa, Africa
 
Dotbond's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Dunedin. New Zealand
Oddometer: 732
[quote/]#4 Use the crankshaft locking bolt to lock the shaft you can then loosen and remove the sprocket retaining bolt. Pry the bearing circlip up out of its groove. You then can tilt the cap bearing end of the camshaft up and slide the shaft out of the sprocket. Once clear of the sprocket the shaft, bearing and circlip can be lifted out together and a dowel can be put in the sprocket to hold it in place....[/quote]

Looks like i have a standard length bolt M8x16mm and 1mm thick washer according to the info about the bolt in the manual and i need a special tool.
I suppose a longer bolt would be the go. An ideas on the length required?
__________________
2012 KTM 690 R
2010 KTM 990 R (Sold)

2008 N.Z.Yamaha Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=306905
2007 N.Z.Adventures Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201557
Dotbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2007, 11:56 PM   #12
gunnerbuck
Island Hopper
 
gunnerbuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Location: N.V.I, B.C.
Oddometer: 3,707
I made one out of a stud that had 25+mms of thread. I ground about a 45 degree blunt point in the threaded end to engage the recess in the crank web and a screwdriver slot in the other to torque it in. You could use a bolt as well but may have to remove the filter anytime you wanted to use it. Leave a little flat on the end, in other words dont grind it to a full point and be carefull not to torque it in too hard and distort the crank... You can shine a flashlight into the hole to see the slot in the crankweb at TDC to see what shape to make your point....

Just measuring up the KTM OEM locking screw and it has about 25mm of thread....

Good luck...
David...
gunnerbuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2007, 12:21 AM   #13
Dotbond OP
Africa, Africa
 
Dotbond's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Dunedin. New Zealand
Oddometer: 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerbuck
I made one out of a stud that had 25+mms of thread. I ground about a 45 degree blunt point in the threaded end to engage the recess in the crank web and a screwdriver slot in the other to torque it in. You could use a bolt as well but may have to remove the filter anytime you wanted to use it. Leave a little flat on the end, in other words dont grind it to a full point and be carefull not to torque it in too hard and distort the crank... You can shine a flashlight into the hole to see the slot in the crankweb at TDC to see what shape to make your point....

Just measuring up the KTM OEM locking screw and it has about 25mm of thread....

Good luck...
David...
Thanks for that info. I found your post about this from last year but wasn't too sure.
Will take a photo of the mesh filter to see the debri from the cam.
There wasn't any sign of metal when removed the front spin on filter and drained the downtube.
Lots of fine-ish metal and very fine dust like metal around the two bottom magnetic drain plugs tho.
Haven't taken off the RH paper filter yet. Tomorrows job.

Trev.
__________________
2012 KTM 690 R
2010 KTM 990 R (Sold)

2008 N.Z.Yamaha Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=306905
2007 N.Z.Adventures Safari: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201557
Dotbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2007, 02:49 AM   #14
bmwktmbill
Traveler
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Traveler
Oddometer: 4,733
DB,
The cam repair is prbably a spray weld hard coating. It might work if you are broke, I understand that problem. A good auto machine sop should be able to help and press in and peen your new cam followers.

Don't give up.
This is the bad luck.
The engine really is tough.

Use the magnet on the top end and change the oil in the lower end, use cheap stuff, run it for a bit and change it again. I would just do the lower end oil, not the main tube. It is filtered to get in there.

Finially you can change everything and the filters and use good oil.
b.
__________________
'02 KTM 640 Adventure-lowered
"On the road there are no special cases."
Cormack McCarthy-The Crossing

The faster it goes the faster it breaks.
And high performance=high maintenance.
Bill Shockley
bmwktmbill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2007, 07:32 AM   #15
gunnerbuck
Island Hopper
 
gunnerbuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Location: N.V.I, B.C.
Oddometer: 3,707
If you leave the paper filter on its side to drain you will most likely see some metalflake in the oil.. To test if the oiljet is clear from this filter to the piston I use a thumb lever oilcan to squirt some oil thru the banjo port above the TDC inspection window. A shot with an airgun will also tell you it's open...
gunnerbuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 04:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014