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Old 04-19-2009, 06:45 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DolphinJohn
Not trying to stir shit up but that kind of rain is a daily occurrence down
here in the summer Not an exaggeration either, it rains hard.
Tropical downpours.
I ride in it all the time because it comes on you so fast you really have no choice, and it usually passes soon enough.
I have ridden in hard rain like that on my F800 with no issues, granted it was a short shower.

You yanks are just pussies up there. Just kidding.

It does rain very hard. Seriously. We ride in it. Bike should not stall.
You remind me of the last time I was down in Daytona on my R1150R... a gol-dern hurricane (well, maybe not technically) came up on us while we were exploring the backroads (of course there are backroads around Daytona) and we just decided to ride right through it for an hour. There was no place to hide, and we figured you can only get so wet before you won't hold any more water, like a sponge. So there we go, the only thing keeping us from drowning was our helmets! I remember thinking that my bike would either hold it's own or it would crap out due to the massive sheets of water pouring down on us. Needless to say, my BMW did fine and so did the FJ1300 and a R1200C that were with me. After that experience, I never worried about how much rain the bike could handle again.

Another thought: if the exposed motor makes a bike prone to fouling in rain, how do those guys cross streams and rivers with water up to the snorkels? I know I've seen it, and the bike just keeps right on running. Have they somehow added extra waterproofing to the engines, or is there a technique?
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Old 04-19-2009, 07:12 PM   #92
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I think you guys are confused. I agree that the bike shouldn't stall. At all. Under any circumstances. I was just trying to point out that under extreme conditions, electrical and mechanical things act weird. Example: I'm an audio engineer. The AC stopped working in the studio one day. The control room got up to 90 degrees with all the gear in there. The digital audio workstation started doing things on its own. Weird things. The rack gear started freaking out, the level on some of the digitally controlled mic preamps started changing on their own, etc, etc. Digital equipment including computers are very sensitive to high temps and high humidity. This whole time I've just been trying to make a simple point: that maybe extreme conditions are triggering it. And like usual, certain people started freaking out.
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Old 04-19-2009, 07:19 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodWorks
..So, sorry, but you're not going to convince any of us that riding in that kind of weather is inherently unsafe. Unpleasant, sure. But not foolhardy. And it won't cause an otherwise good running motorcycle to stall, no matter what that FSE said.

David
I'm not and have never tried to convince anyone that riding in downpours is unsafe. That is strictly opinion. It happens to be my opinion that it's unsafe. But I'm definitely not trying to push it on anyone. All I did was let you guys know what the FSE said...and then everyone, including you, claims that they were my words.

However, all BS aside, I've never had the stalling issue. Even riding in heavy downpours, which I have done. My opinion is that it is electrical or fuel canister related, and that the stalling issue has nothing to do with the rain. Other than maybe the rain is exaggerating it??
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Old 04-19-2009, 07:26 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Griz
All I did was let you guys know what the FSE said...and then everyone, including you, claims that they were my words.
Griz, haven't we been through this before?
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Griz
He also said you shouldn't be riding your bike in torrential downpours in the first place for safety reasons! I agreed with him.
I don't know how you can complain about being knocked for something you claim to agree with.

David
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Old 04-19-2009, 07:44 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodWorks
Griz, haven't we been through this before?

I don't know how you can complain about being knocked for something you claim to agree with.

David
You're talking in circles, WoodWorks. I'll say it again, just because I agree with him does not mean that I'm trying to push my opinion on other people or saying that you need to agree with it. I'll lay it out again:

I agreed with the FSE that it's unsafe to ride in torrential downpours (like the one in the video I posted earlier), but that's just my opinion.

However, I never said that it's ok for the bike to stall under any circumstances.


You seem to just want to create drama like everyone else.
You need to quit being all: Let it go, man.
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The Griz screwed with this post 04-19-2009 at 07:59 PM
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Old 04-19-2009, 08:33 PM   #96
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FWIW, I love riding in torrential downpours. Wicked, stupid love it.

Not in the way that I get excited about leaving my house in one, but when I'm on the open road and I get trapped, my mouth curls up into an evil grin and I accelerate into the hydroplane with a lusty kind of exhilaration that's hard to find in this increasingly static world.

And, man, I would sure hate my bike to quit in those circumstances.

I might agree with a service department that told me I really shouldn't be riding my bike over 100 miles an hour on public roads. But I'd be real f*cking pissed if that was the excuse they used for a bike that stalled at speeds over 100.
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Old 04-19-2009, 09:05 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Griz
I'm not and have never tried to convince anyone that riding in downpours is unsafe. That is strictly opinion. It happens to be my opinion that it's unsafe. But I'm definitely not trying to push it on anyone. All I did was let you guys know what the FSE said...and then everyone, including you, claims that they were my words.
Sorry Griz, but these were your words:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Griz
This is torrential rain. This is the type of rain that the BMW FSE and I are talking about. And yes, you'd be stupid to ride in it. If you think you're more a man or "adventurer" because you ride in shit like this, you might need council.
When you get caught in that shit it is unsafe to just pull off the road and wait it out. In a lot of areas those kinds of rains come on you, you know they are coming, but have no place to hide and you just ride it out. Seems to me that visibility in your video was fairly good.... I've seen worse. Personally, I don't think I'm stupid or need council.

My 800 has stalled in rain, and much lighter rain than that in the video. The rain is definitely causing the issue but I'm not convinced that it isn't something in the electronics getting wet that is causing the issue. Although, I have noticed what appears to be much more of a vacuum when opening the fuel tank in these conditions.

My 2 cents.... carry on now.

Cheers!
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Old 04-19-2009, 09:08 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cap'n Ron
Sorry Griz, but these were your words:



When you get caught in that shit it is unsafe to just pull off the road and wait it out. In a lot of areas those kinds of rains come on you, you know they are coming, but have no place to hide and you just ride it out. Seems to me that visibility in your video was fairly good.... I've seen worse. Personally, I don't think I'm stupid or need council.

My 800 has stalled in rain, and much lighter rain than that in the video. The rain is definitely causing the issue but I'm not convinced that it isn't something in the electronics getting wet that is causing the issue. Although, I have noticed what appears to be much more of a vacuum when opening the fuel tank in these conditions.

My 2 cents.... carry on now.

Cheers!
Wish I could nuke this thread.

I'll say it again, just because I agree with him does not mean that I'm trying to push my opinion on other people or saying that you need to agree with it. I'll lay it out again:

I agreed with the FSE that it's unsafe to ride in torrential downpours (like the one in the video I posted earlier), but that's just my opinion.

However, I never said that it's ok for the bike to stall under any circumstances.
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Old 04-19-2009, 09:31 PM   #99
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Is there any way 'we' could suck it up here and stop fucking up all the F800 threads. There's information here some may want to know, some will agree with and some will take as horseshit. Everyone sees it their own way. All that is accomplished is to make it seem as if BMW riders are a bunch of argumentative retards with nothing better to do.
Let's all go for a ride or something instead for crying out loud.

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Old 04-19-2009, 09:49 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayner
Is there any way 'we' could suck it up here and stop fucking up all the F800 threads. There's information here some may want to know, some will agree with and some will take as horseshit. Everyone sees it their own way. All that is accomplished is to make it seem as if BMW riders are a bunch of argumentative retards with nothing better to do.
Let's all go for a ride or something instead for crying out loud.

Agreed. Thanks man. Let's move this thread back into the productive category.
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Old 04-19-2009, 09:52 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Griz
I also agree that a bike should not stall in the rain. But when it's raining as hard as it was in that video, stalling doesn't surprise me.
I'm not sure why, but it seems as though you've convinced yourself that the people who stalled their bike in the rain did so in weather you would describe as 'torrential'.

My thoughts on riding in rain aside, the weather associated with my stalling problems was not as heavy as in the clip you posted.
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Old 04-19-2009, 10:09 PM   #102
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I'm going to remove my charcoal canister, the more I think about it the more that it makes sense that somehow, where ever the water is coming from it is causing the canister to not vent the tank properly and to stall.
I know for a fact I've over filled my gas tank many times trying to get as much range as possible, and have probably ruined my canister anyways... and I don't even own a car so take your environmental shit and stick it... plus I need somewhere to stash my pot and that spot will be a good place for a micro Pelican.

I also have sucked water directly into the engine enough to cause it to stall. After starting it and clearing out the water ( see my water crossing vid where you can see the steam coming out the exhaust) the engine ran fine. In other words the air filter got plenty wet, but after clearing the engine it ran fine. When it stalled from riding in the rain, clearing out the engine did nothing to really help... If it was just from the filter getting wet why didn't it improve? Maybe because it's not in the filter getting wet that's causing the stalling...

So off goes the canister and as soon as I get new one's to replace my blown out rear wheel bearings hopefully I can find some very heavy rain to go ride in at 100 mph to test my theory, my bike could use another good washing anyways...
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Old 04-19-2009, 10:26 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiTown
I have sucked water directly into the engine enough to cause it to stall. After starting it and clearing out the water ( see my water crossing vid where you can see the steam coming out the exhaust) the engine ran fine. In other words the air filter got plenty wet, but after clearing the engine it ran fine. When it stalled from riding in the rain, clearing out the engine did nothing to really help... If it was just from the filter getting wet why didn't it improve? Maybe because it's not in the filter getting wet that's causing the stalling...
Makes sense to me. Let us know the results.
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Old 04-19-2009, 10:35 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DockingPilot
The cannister (evap system) did indeed wreak havoc on the 950 engine. Stalling, hard starting and so on. Once it is removed, the bike ran like it was meant to. Most new bike owners remove that problematic tumor from thier engines. In fact, my BMW tech, on the cuff, told me to ditch it.
I had a 950, with fuel problems: overflow from one of the tanks, and stalling at traffic lights. Had had one or two tip-overs. Dealer thought it was a canister problem, and removed it for me. DID NOT fix the problem. Realized that it was a tank venting problem. All of the tank vents went thru labyrinth in the cap with some one way rubber seals that were "flaps". Performed a "flapendectomy" (search Orange Crush) and the problems were solved. I feel that the "canisterectomy" made no difference in my case.

I don't know what the F800GS tank vent system is like but I do know that riders have been having some problems - either pressure or vacuum in the tank when refueling. It is quite possible that in the rain the vent is getting wet and sticking, sealing the tank. The fuel pump then is working against a vacuum and finally cannot draw any more fuel - causing a stall.

So, a question for those who have motorcycles that have stalled:
Immediately after stalling, have you opened the fuel cap while listening for a pressure or vacuum release? Was there one? If so, that's a red herring. I believe there is a service bulletin of some sort that addresses the tank venting. I am interested in your experience.
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Old 04-20-2009, 06:50 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedHawk47
So, a question for those who have motorcycles that have stalled:Immediately after stalling, have you opened the fuel cap while listening for a pressure or vacuum release? Was there one? If so, that's a red herring. I believe there is a service bulletin of some sort that addresses the tank venting. I am interested in your experience.
Yeah, it's the same PUMA case that deals with the faulty fuel sensor (PUMA #1875680302). I asked the same question in one of the other threads. But no response so far.

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