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Old 07-29-2013, 07:12 PM   #22696
DHC-2
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I hope you're just trolling when you say "Idiot paid the price". I think most riders at some point have crossed the yellow line. Most don't want to, but too much entry speed, inattention, gravel, etc, may cause them to drift. There are some who really don't care which side of the road they're on. We don't know the facts so I don't think we should judge.
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Old 07-29-2013, 07:15 PM   #22697
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Originally Posted by DHC-2 View Post
I hope you're just trolling when you say "Idiot paid the price". I think most riders at some point have crossed the yellow line. Most don't want to, but too much entry speed, inattention, gravel, etc, may cause them to drift. There are some who really don't care which side of the road they're on. We don't know the facts so I don't think we should judge.
I've had many more close calls from cars cutting corners than from me running wide...
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Old 07-29-2013, 08:00 PM   #22698
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Originally Posted by alekkas View Post
I was there last year and more miatas than you could shake a stick at. Convention? Never saw one cross the yellow. What's the case here?
I go down every year for miatas at the gap and I'm glad to hear that everyone was behaving themselves. If anyone catches wind of a miata owner not playing nice be sure to post it so we can make sure that they are properly shamed.
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Old 07-29-2013, 08:06 PM   #22699
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Originally Posted by Boston813 View Post
I go down every year for miatas at the gap and I'm glad to hear that everyone was behaving themselves. If anyone catches wind of a miata owner not playing nice be sure to post it so we can make sure that they are properly shamed.
They've already been shamed, they're driving Miatas...
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Old 07-29-2013, 08:11 PM   #22700
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Originally Posted by RDTCU View Post
They've already been shamed, they're driving Miatas...
I see what you did there.
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Old 07-29-2013, 08:38 PM   #22701
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My 2c.......there is no reason NOT to cross the yellow line under certain conditions


-Dry conditions (I general avoid travelling along any painted lines in the wet).

-Clear visibility of the road ahead

-No traffic entering the road

-No gravel or those stupid fucking rumble divots the DOT have decided to put in some roads

-Only cross at points where the curve allows you to naturally move back onto your side of the road. i.e early to set up a right hand turn, or at the apex on a left hand turn. In both instances you need visibility beyond the turn, or at least beyond the apex. For right turns you look to the apex and beyond to determine if you can cross and carry more speed, for left you see beyond the apex to see if you can straighten sooner after the apex and accelerate harder.

I've ridden the Dragon once both ways and know most turns are pretty blind.....around where I live you have a lot of open sweepers and you can find yourself safely spending a lot of time over the yellow line.
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Old 07-29-2013, 11:29 PM   #22702
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Originally Posted by XPatriot View Post
around where I live you have a lot of open sweepers and you can find yourself safely spending a lot of time over the yellow line.

......... until the one time you get caught between the headlights of something with 4 wheels -- and can't get back.
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Old 07-30-2013, 12:46 AM   #22703
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DHC-2 View Post
.....Most don't want to, but too much entry speed, inattention, gravel, etc, may cause them to drift. There are some who really don't care which side of the road they're on. We don't know the facts so I don't think we should judge.
Anybody on the dragon, especially on a nice summer day which it appears to be in the pics of the stopped traffic, should see that it is obviously a busy road.

"Too much entry speed" on a busy 2-laner is the rider being an idiot. Who else's fault is the rider's choice of a speed that he could not make the corner at, when the speed limit is what, about 30 MPH?

"Inattention" ditto. Sure any of us could be inattentive but that would be our idiocy on a busy curvy road where a fuckup makes any of us a hood ornament.

Invisible gravel on that road in the daytime made someone run wide? Show me and maybe I'll change my mind.

I'll judge it I damned well want to. When a motorcycle runs wide into oncoming traffic, it would be truly exceptional and highly unlikely that it was NOT the rider's idiocy that put him there. I'm sorry he got hurt & all but even if he was my buddy and I saw him afterward, I'd say "Jeez Joe, you were an idiot" and he could say the same to me if the situation was reversed.
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viverrid screwed with this post 07-30-2013 at 01:03 AM
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Old 07-30-2013, 12:48 AM   #22704
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Originally Posted by XPatriot View Post
My 2c.......there is no reason NOT to cross the yellow line under certain conditions
When there's a Miata coming the other way would NOT be one of those conditions....
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Old 07-30-2013, 01:01 AM   #22705
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Originally Posted by Albie View Post
So Rune is Japanese for Dong?
Brief Rune story hijack.

A Honda dealer I know told me this, wasn't his deal, he found out about it while checking with other dealers on a Rune for a customer. I checked the figures on the net and it's plausible (dealer guy only gave me the generalities).

Guy buys a Rune. He is a very large man. Comes back a couple of weeks later, he'd read up on his bike and says the bike is over GVWR when he gets on it, they sold it to him, he wants something done about it. The GVWR is 1153 lbs. and the fully fueled wet weight is 888 lbs. for a payload of 265 lbs. He weighs well over 300.

Dealer contacts Honda for technical support, asks about permissible way to increase weight rating, stiffer springs and what else. Honda, probably concerned with liability, tells him NO, the GVW is the GVW, that's it. Dealer tells customer.

There was a suspicion that maybe there was some buyer's remorse going on, but the guy had a point. He complains that they sold him an unsuitable bike, they could see he was a big guy, wants a refund. After the beginnings of legal posturing, dealer ends up taking the bike back. So a Rune is a (nearly) 1200 lb. bike that can only support a load a little over 250.

The dealer guy that I was talking to compared (contrasted) this to the weight that some couples put on Gold Wings with two large people and lots of weight in the baggage.

Hijack off.
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Old 07-30-2013, 01:18 AM   #22706
atomicalex
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It's a Honda thing. Total payload of the Honda Element is a whopping 600 pounds.

My flipping VW has a payload of 1200#.
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Old 07-30-2013, 01:21 AM   #22707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DHC-2 View Post
I hope you're just trolling when you say "Idiot paid the price". I think most riders at some point have crossed the yellow line. Most don't want to, but too much entry speed, inattention, gravel, etc, may cause them to drift. There are some who really don't care which side of the road they're on. We don't know the facts so I don't think we should judge.
^^^^
What he said.
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Old 07-30-2013, 03:35 AM   #22708
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Seriously. Crashing badly could happen to anyone at any time. That's why its called an accident. Sometimes you get caught up in the moment and make poor judgment calls. Shit happens. Not cool to call someone an idiot while they are laying in a hospital or worse somewhere. As far as I'm concerned riding my bike is what I do to cut loose and enjoy being, as you would put it, an idiot. Yes it's better to be an idiot on a racetrack and not a busy road but none of us ride because it's the safest way to travel and at times we all have a moment when we think we're gp or rally racers and get in over our heads. I just hope the guy makes it out of the hospital OK and you should too.

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Old 07-30-2013, 04:10 AM   #22709
theshnizzle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XPatriot View Post
My 2c.......there is no reason NOT to cross the yellow line under certain conditions


-Dry conditions (I general avoid travelling along any painted lines in the wet).

-Clear visibility of the road ahead

-No traffic entering the road

-No gravel or those stupid fucking rumble divots the DOT have decided to put in some roads

-Only cross at points where the curve allows you to naturally move back onto your side of the road. i.e early to set up a right hand turn, or at the apex on a left hand turn. In both instances you need visibility beyond the turn, or at least beyond the apex. For right turns you look to the apex and beyond to determine if you can cross and carry more speed, for left you see beyond the apex to see if you can straighten sooner after the apex and accelerate harder.

I've ridden the Dragon once both ways and know most turns are pretty blind.....around where I live you have a lot of open sweepers and you can find yourself safely spending a lot of time over the yellow line.

Well, good luck with that. BTW, shoulder checking is a waste of time. So is using your turn signal and hand signalling. These are bad habits I have fallen into and I am trying hard to break.....
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Old 07-30-2013, 04:40 AM   #22710
RidingDonkeys
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viverrid View Post
When a motorcycle runs wide into oncoming traffic, it would be truly exceptional and highly unlikely that it was NOT the rider's idiocy that put him there...
Truer words have never been spoken. The word "accident" is overused, and is a nice way of saying "you screwed up."

You're driving down the road, checking your text message, and you look up just in enough time to see traffic stopping. You can't stop quick enough, and you rear end the car in front of you. Society would call this an "accident." However, it is in no way an accident. You were being stupid and you caused a wreck, not an accident.

The lines have been blurred over time, and in a politically correct society we use the word "accident" to explain "idiocy."

I'll even throw myself under the bus here. I was in a crash in 2011. Details here:

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=745670

The short version is that I was making a sharp right turn on the hack, and I put my sidecar wheel into an eroded section of the road. Going into it wasn't the problem, it was the huge bump coming out. It launched the sidecar into the air, and sent me into oncoming traffic.

This was not an accident. This was me not paying attention. I drive that road five days a week, and I took it for granted that big trucks are always eating up the road, especially in that intersection. I didn't scan the road properly. I didn't see the damaged portion. I caused the wreck. I was the idiot that day.

The point is that if you look at these things as accidents, you are likely to repeat them. Accidents are events largely out of your control. If you look at them as idiot induced crashes, you'll learn from them, and are less likely to make the same mistakes.
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