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Old 11-07-2013, 08:16 PM   #1081
pdxmotorhead
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A lot of old ford trucks had a tick lower ratio in the front for the same reason.

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Old 11-07-2013, 08:31 PM   #1082
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Ah, from the jet blue terminal.

It should be fun to experiment with ratios but for this weekends shakedown it will be enough to learn it. When it's spinning and the front is driving it really tightens the steering up. Unlike the 450's the 990 can probably still spin the front at 100mph and spin it fast. I can't say how much the front spinning is going to change the bike in both drive and gyroscopic forces. I know that the throttle needs to be treated carefully because the bike is much more likely to go where it's pointed as opposed to a normal bike.

This is going to be fun. Really, really fun.

Gregor

PS that is our lovely producer Erin in the tent.
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:41 PM   #1083
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Originally Posted by CosentinoEngineering View Post
Marty, care to share your thoughts a bit on underdrive ratios? Christini likes to stay around mid-60s and says if you go higher you get a hard feeling on the pull of the bike. (?) I'd think (with no testing to back it up) as close to 100% as possible without overdriving it would provide the most seamless transition from rear drive to 2wd.
On my bikes I've found matching rollout (gear ratio * circumference. ie. how far the bike travels per turn of the tranny output) front and rear is a good start. We've actually found driving the front wheel 5-10% faster is best on sand/mud, but it increases rolling resistance and has a funny steering feel on pavement. I'm running the front rollout 1-2% faster on the bikes now. The knobbies squirm enough that the steering feels normal, and the bikes are just magic when on the throttle!

Christini's advice on underdrive is a side effect of how they re-combine the two drive shafts to the front wheel. I'd at least try it 1:1 to see if the instant traction is worth fighting the slip-clutch all the time.

@Wadester: Not a problem. Both my bikes and the Christini have an overrunning clutch to let the front wheel spin faster when it needs to. Though it's only really needed when going slow or brake sliding. (or when the engine seizes...)

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Old 11-08-2013, 06:16 PM   #1084
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>>Just my $.02 - the problem comes with cornering, where the front wheel covers more distance than the rear.

With a dual track vehicle this is noticable but the nature of how a single track vehicle turns greatly reduces this effect.

>>Christini's advice on underdrive is a side effect of how they re-combine the two drive shafts to the front wheel.

I thought so. One more benefit of a FFE.

We have easy gearing for about 65, 72 and 82 that we can test.
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Old 11-08-2013, 08:26 PM   #1085
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We have easy gearing for about 65, 72 and 82 that we can test.
Just ran into our mutual friend Dan from Revit tonight at Gino's place and he's offered some help for our test this weekend. This is going to be much more fun now but I'm not letting the cat out if the bag just yet. You'll see.

Yes, it looks like we'll take the bike over to Revit's sample sale tomorrow after noon sometime. We're going to use tomorrow to prep for Sunday.

Gregor
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Old 11-10-2013, 08:51 PM   #1086
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So today was my first ride on the bike. Chris rode it to the Revit sample sale yesterday but I didn't get the chance to ride it as Tommy and I decided that we wanted to make a fun video and we had a few ideas that we thought would put it over the top. When we mentioned it to our friend Dan at Revit he thought it sounded like fun and asked if we needed anything - we said heck yeah, how about a couple more GoPros? He said sure and so we spent the day learning the new cameras and packing all our gear.

Sunday came and we were at the shop early to go over the bike and then take it out for a test. We found a bearing had backed out of the jack shaft backside and that required some machining to fit a circlip. Chris hasn't finalized all the parts so this was the first shakedown issue.





Once Chris made a spacer and turned the groove for the circlip we put the bike back together.



The chain line is final but not yet enclosed. You can certainly hear it when rolling but it's not very loud. Since we had spent some daylight making fixes we decided to go across the street to the gravel road for a little spin with Gino as our reference as he had his 18/21 wheel set on with a set of TKC's and my bike had the smaller 17/19 with a pair of Avon Distanza's.

It was no contest. Even giving him a bit of a lead my bike, with pure street tires, consistently pulled him. The bike is just amazing and it's going to take a little while to recalibrate the way I ride because it behaves quite differently. If you're used to giving it a bit of gas to swing the rear around on gravel it just doesn't really do that anymore. There's none of that wild spinning as the bike fishtales around - it just goes, where it's pointed, very fast. You have to be careful where the front wheel is pointing when you hit the gas because it will go there immediately. Frighteningly fast in fact.

It is more than I expected and it's exactly what I was hoping for. This bike, more than any other off road bike, desperately needs traction and the whole package delivers it. With street tires on gravel the bike accelerates faster than knobbies could ever hope and gives an amazing sense of confidence up until you realize how fast you're going. I can't wait until I get it in dirt with the second set of wheels and fresh knobbies. It looks like that old two rears to one one front ratio is gone for good.

We shot video with six cameras , were almost arrested twice , and were kicked out of every place we went . It was fun and we got some amazing footage. It's going to take a few days to sort the 80 Gigs of video and turn it into something but hopefully it will be worth the wait...

Gregor

sakurama screwed with this post 11-11-2013 at 06:30 AM
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Old 11-10-2013, 09:08 PM   #1087
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Yea, what he said.

I should have know that for Gregor shooting a little video entails a carful of equipment and 3 non-riding personnel!

It was a lot of fun and we rode it pretty hard and had no problems. The abuse got so bad at one point we had to chain it down. It was interesting to see Gregor look a little spooked after some of the higher speed runs. I'm banned from putting up any of my crappy footage yet but the HD and slo-mo stuff will be worth it.
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Old 11-10-2013, 09:34 PM   #1088
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Old 11-11-2013, 08:27 AM   #1089
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I can just imagine a Teraflex on both ends
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Old 11-11-2013, 08:38 AM   #1090
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I can just imagine a Teraflex on both ends
When I finally get it out to Portland I plan on putting a pair of paddles on it and taking it to the dunes where my nephew races quads. That should be silly fun.

The funny thing, which you'll see in the video, is that the front pulling is constantly straightening the bike out. It's a strange sensation of being pushed and pulled at the same time. Gino's bike, like all normal 990's, is just wildly spinning and fishtailing as no tire can manage the 990's power.

Gregor
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:12 AM   #1091
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So, this thread has gone on for so long and I've been pretty tied up with other stuff from time to time but I have to say, I'm always impressed with what's going on when I do catch up.

Nice work but I genuinely mean this, who's bike is it anyway? There is so many cool people involved, I've lost track.........OK, I could go look and I think I vaguely remember.....



PS. I have a spare KTM690RR in the shed, that would make a cool AWD project, let me know when you guys get bored
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:26 AM   #1092
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Originally Posted by sakurama View Post
When I finally get it out to Portland I plan on putting a pair of paddles on it and taking it to the dunes where my nephew races quads. That should be silly fun.

The funny thing, which you'll see in the video, is that the front pulling is constantly straightening the bike out. It's a strange sensation of being pushed and pulled at the same time. Gino's bike, like all normal 990's, is just wildly spinning and fishtailing as no tire can manage the 990's power.

Gregor
Dunes big fun.. A winter trip to Christmas Valley would be high fun factor as well.. Semi frozen dunes.. Maybe snow on them.. What could go wrong?

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Old 11-11-2013, 12:59 PM   #1093
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PS. I have a spare KTM690RR in the shed, that would make a cool AWD project, let me know when you guys get bored
And while you are working up Pyndons 690 AWD kit, I'll take a set too for my 690, might as well make at least 2 of everything.
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Old 11-11-2013, 01:26 PM   #1094
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The Christini package on a CR500 would not be boring..

How much gyro do you get if you crack the throttle in mid air?

Hmm.. Just a fascinating bit of engineering it is..

DAve
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Old 11-11-2013, 01:43 PM   #1095
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>>And while you are working up Pyndons 690 AWD kit

I'll have to take a look at that bike and see how feasable it is. Nobody I know has one. Anyone have good pics of the chain side without bodywork?

>>How much gyro do you get if you crack the throttle in mid air?

Should work at least as well as rolling up the windows.

>>Nice work but I genuinely mean this, who's bike is it anyway?

Isn't possession 9/10 of the law? ;)
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