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Old 06-16-2009, 03:24 PM   #136
DockingPilot OP
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Also I might add, after flogging the bike now and having both ends re worked, man it is riding terrific ! My ISDE buddie switched bikes with me the other day, (a 950 SE). He commented on how well the suspension was soaking it up. In comaprison, his stock SE suspension felt harsh to me coming off the Bitubo/Hyper Pro combo. I ran it hard in deep whoops also and she tracked straight as an arrow, no swapping or nose diving.
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Old 06-16-2009, 04:30 PM   #137
johngil
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Eh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bumbee800
John,

can elaborate what you did when you went off script and installed the spring to tighten the bottom cartridge retaining bolt. Did you reinstall the spring and cap and tighten the cap down to add tension to the entire assembly so that the cartridge would not spin freely and you can tighten the bolt to the specific torque. Also can you specify what that bolt is torqued value is and what the top cap torque to dampening rod lock nut torque is. I have to do this all soon and would love it if some one with the service dvd could post all the torque values for this entire install. THANKS !!
Yes, I installed the spring so that I could tighten the lower bolt. I then removed the spring to add the oil to spec.
I didn't torque to any spec but my own.
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Old 06-17-2009, 12:40 PM   #138
bumbee800
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PackMule
Damper unit to slider tube

M10 x 25 - 10.9

with sealing ring
50 Nm



This specification seems wrong. The retaining bolt for the dampner cartridge is not a M10 it is a M8 and for a similar sized bolt used for the same purpose on the F650GS the torque spec is 20nm. Any one with a service DVD please clarify.
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Old 06-17-2009, 05:20 PM   #139
jeffchri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumbee800
This specification seems wrong. The retaining bolt for the dampner cartridge is not a M10 it is a M8 and for a similar sized bolt used for the same purpose on the F650GS the torque spec is 20nm. Any one with a service DVD please clarify.
That's what the repair DVD says as well - M10x25-10.9 with ring, 50nm.
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Old 06-18-2009, 11:36 AM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffchri
That's what the repair DVD says as well - M10x25-10.9 with ring, 50nm.
Ok I went down to the dealer and checked with them. The bolt is an M10 and 50nm is the correct torque value for that fastner. Thanks jeffchri

To add to the installation I read that the trick for that bolt was to snug up the bolt enough to prevent any fluid leaking out, but to apply final torque once fully assembled and that will prevent the cartridge from spinning frreely. Just another option.
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Old 06-18-2009, 11:42 AM   #141
jeffchri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumbee800
To add to the installation I read that the trick for that bolt was to snug up the bolt enough to prevent any fluid leaking out, but to apply final torque once fully assembled and that will prevent the cartridge from spinning frreely. Just another option.
Ooh, I like that technique. I'll give that whirl - my Bitubos just arrived in the mail last night.
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2009 BMW F800GS - the "attack helicopter"
2008 Husqvarna TE510 - loud and proud
2006 BMW R1200S - dedicated track bike now, mostly because of sloppy welds
2010 BMW S1000RR - soooooon, very soooon ...

Recent past: Montesa 4RT (now in the hands of the fiancee), Weestrom, F650GS Dakar, Yammy WR250F, (a scooter), (another scooter)
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Old 06-18-2009, 12:06 PM   #142
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Yea, but remember when you go to torque, those factory values where for the junk, ah, I mean the Zokes, not these. Be carefull.
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Old 06-18-2009, 11:59 PM   #143
jeffchri
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Well, the gunship is only one-legged right now ...

The first fork leg went really well - oddly well, actually. The bottom bolt seated and held just fine, and I was able to tighten it up once there was the littlest bit of pressure from the spring. Back on the bike, ready for its brother ...

The other leg, though ... ugh. I can't get the damper to stop spinning, no matter what I've tried so far. The pressure of the spring isn't enough to stop the f'ing damper from spinning, so I get "kinda" tight and then nothing better .. and of course, I can't back it out now either, for the same reason.

Other ideas? I'm really really leery about going and buying a impact wrench to make this work, though I suspect it would just need that extra little hit to get past this critical point, then there'd be enough friction to stop the damn thing from spinning.

Now I'm going to bed to ponder and recharge, before I throw something across the garage ...
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2009 BMW F800GS - the "attack helicopter"
2008 Husqvarna TE510 - loud and proud
2006 BMW R1200S - dedicated track bike now, mostly because of sloppy welds
2010 BMW S1000RR - soooooon, very soooon ...

Recent past: Montesa 4RT (now in the hands of the fiancee), Weestrom, F650GS Dakar, Yammy WR250F, (a scooter), (another scooter)
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Old 06-19-2009, 12:04 AM   #144
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isn't there a tool or something to hold it in place while the bolt is properly torque? or are you taking a shortcut that is now a longcut?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffchri
Well, the gunship is only one-legged right now ...

The first fork leg went really well - oddly well, actually. The bottom bolt seated and held just fine, and I was able to tighten it up once there was the littlest bit of pressure from the spring. Back on the bike, ready for its brother ...

The other leg, though ... ugh. I can't get the damper to stop spinning, no matter what I've tried so far. The pressure of the spring isn't enough to stop the f'ing damper from spinning, so I get "kinda" tight and then nothing better .. and of course, I can't back it out now either, for the same reason.

Other ideas? I'm really really leery about going and buying a impact wrench to make this work, though I suspect it would just need that extra little hit to get past this critical point, then there'd be enough friction to stop the damn thing from spinning.

Now I'm going to bed to ponder and recharge, before I throw something across the garage ...
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Old 06-19-2009, 12:50 AM   #145
jeffchri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eakins
isn't there a tool or something to hold it in place while the bolt is properly torque? or are you taking a shortcut that is now a longcut?
I certainly don't have a tool, and not sure how it would work anyway, the top of the damper is round, unlike the OEM dampers that have teeth in the top, presumably to help with this sort of problem. There ARE flats on the Bit dampers, but they are on the other end of the damper, right next to the where the bolt is coming in and far far far away from anything I could use.

I'm wondering if the bolt bound just the tiniest bit on the way in and now just spins the whole thing no matter what I try. I just wedged some junk down there temporarily to try to prevent the damper from rotating - my best idea was parts of an old inner tube - but no dice, the thing still turned.

Gah.

Edit: like one of these? http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/partno/08-0117/ Well, those would work if the Bit dampers had teeth in the top, but for some reason they don't.

2nd Edit: going to get impact wrench after work ... dang it. Loved the idea of not doing that ...
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2009 BMW F800GS - the "attack helicopter"
2008 Husqvarna TE510 - loud and proud
2006 BMW R1200S - dedicated track bike now, mostly because of sloppy welds
2010 BMW S1000RR - soooooon, very soooon ...

Recent past: Montesa 4RT (now in the hands of the fiancee), Weestrom, F650GS Dakar, Yammy WR250F, (a scooter), (another scooter)

jeffchri screwed with this post 06-19-2009 at 01:09 AM
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Old 06-19-2009, 06:19 AM   #146
DockingPilot OP
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Jeff,
You could try using a drill/extension/socket before the impact wrench. Less torque maybe ?
Yea, in hindsight, I would thread those bolts up by hand 1st to make sure they go in without much resistence. I also did not locktite mine, otherwise, you will have a hellava time if you ever needed to take them out.
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Old 06-19-2009, 06:55 AM   #147
johngil
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W/ the spring and cap installed and holding the fork upside down, compress the fork as much as possible while you have a helper tighten (or loosen) the bolt.
I had to compress the fork almost half way before I got the damper to stop spinning.
You really need some sort of impact gun here. A drill motor might work too.
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Old 06-19-2009, 08:16 AM   #148
jeffchri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DockingPilot
Jeff,
You could try using a drill/extension/socket before the impact wrench. Less torque maybe ?
Yea, in hindsight, I would thread those bolts up by hand 1st to make sure they go in without much resistence. I also did not locktite mine, otherwise, you will have a hellava time if you ever needed to take them out.
Drill: tried it, didn't work. Did hand-tigthen first. Fortunately, didn't locktite.
__________________
2009 BMW F800GS - the "attack helicopter"
2008 Husqvarna TE510 - loud and proud
2006 BMW R1200S - dedicated track bike now, mostly because of sloppy welds
2010 BMW S1000RR - soooooon, very soooon ...

Recent past: Montesa 4RT (now in the hands of the fiancee), Weestrom, F650GS Dakar, Yammy WR250F, (a scooter), (another scooter)
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Old 06-19-2009, 08:19 AM   #149
jeffchri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johngil
W/ the spring and cap installed and holding the fork upside down, compress the fork as much as possible while you have a helper tighten (or loosen) the bolt.
I had to compress the fork almost half way before I got the damper to stop spinning.
You really need some sort of impact gun here. A drill motor might work too.
Super-compressed as hard as I could: didn't work. There just isn't enough friction between the end cap on the other and of the spring and the damper itself, once the resistance on the end bolt exceeds a certain point. In hindsight, I wonder if a little WD on the threads would have been better, to make sure you didn't hit anything.
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2009 BMW F800GS - the "attack helicopter"
2008 Husqvarna TE510 - loud and proud
2006 BMW R1200S - dedicated track bike now, mostly because of sloppy welds
2010 BMW S1000RR - soooooon, very soooon ...

Recent past: Montesa 4RT (now in the hands of the fiancee), Weestrom, F650GS Dakar, Yammy WR250F, (a scooter), (another scooter)
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Old 06-19-2009, 10:39 AM   #150
itsatdm
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a question to those that have installed the Bitubo unit. To clarify in my mind on how the cartridge insert works. When you say that the unit is sealed, am I correct in thinking that means that the valving is sealed and not adjustable and not that the unit does not have orifices that allow the fork oil to enter the cartridge and work through the valving?
If the above is true, then perhaps I could extend optimal rider weight peramater by using my aftermarket spring and if the valving proved to be inadequate use a slightly heavier viscosity oil to get better valving action?.
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