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Old 09-01-2009, 10:32 AM   #181
Law Dawg (ret)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmex
Dawg, the dealer did not exactly deny the warranty claim, but stated that the policy is that the owner of the bike pays for the service until BMW decides if it is a warrnty claim, and then the owner is reimbursed. Seems kinda weird to me. Actually there was no talk of even filing a warranty claim until SJBMW saw the hub. I was going to get stuck for $90 for the three bearings and seals plus $90 of labor to replace them (which I have paid), but do not have a rear wheel I can use. Nor are two of the bearings installed since the dealer concluded the hub was toast.
Seems the road test crew is in full force...BMW beta testers one and all eh? I have never heard of a warranty being checked only after the owner puts cash up front. I'd prolly be jumping up and down on someone's desk if they tried to pull that one (sounds like possible dealer BS). Once again, this one has the potential to bring serious injury and BMW corporate might take a screwing in court.

Perhaps someone on the inside (dealer/service tech etc) will tell us the process to notify the mothership. Maybe even inform if the pay first thing is for real.
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Old 09-01-2009, 11:45 AM   #182
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I'm heading out for a 10-day trip to bumphuq nowhere on Friday. Tonight I change tires and check bearings. If they're going bad, I'll change them; otherwise I'll carry some spares. I really don't have time to mess with this, but the prospect of a ruined vacation isn't pretty. Just got the bike back from the dealer with new front axle, new sprocket bolts, new fuel sensor, and one new radiator hose. On order is a new gas tank to replace my cracked one. Can BMW be making any money on these bikes? The good news is the Rotax heart of the beast never misses a beat.
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Old 09-01-2009, 12:09 PM   #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Law Dawg
I have never heard of a warranty being checked only after the owner puts cash up front. I'd prolly be jumping up and down on someone's desk if they tried to pull that one (sounds like possible dealer BS).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Law Dawg
Maybe even inform if the pay first thing is for real.
My new F800GS is currently in for warranty repairs and they didn't ask me to pay for anything up front. Heck, I didn't even have to sign my name when BMW Roadside Assistance had it towed 60 miles.
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Old 09-01-2009, 12:41 PM   #184
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Sorry guys, but I didn't index the bearing when I removed it. I wanted to ride so I just fixed it while I had it in the shop (I'm a mechanic...) I'd be willing to bet though that the spacer is not the same length as the distance between the pockets that hold the bearing. If the interference fit of the hub to outer race were too tight, you would get the same damage type, but it would be centered. In my case something forced that bearing to run off-centerline, if only slightly. I can't imagine a method of setting preload on the spacer other than by fully seating the bearings and expecting it to be in spec. The next person definately needs to measure for us.
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Old 09-01-2009, 01:34 PM   #185
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Could this bearing issue be the result of axel mis-alignment?
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Old 09-01-2009, 01:37 PM   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BykMyk
Could this bearing issue be the result of axel mis-alignment?
I've wondered that too. It used to happen with XRs because the indicators on the swingarm were off by a tiny bit.
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Old 09-01-2009, 02:05 PM   #187
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A further thought....assuming that all the other 6204 bearings on a particular bike were from the same source and batch, why don't we see problems with the front set?
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Old 09-01-2009, 02:30 PM   #188
tmex OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BykMyk
A further thought....assuming that all the other 6204 bearings on a particular bike were from the same source and batch, why don't we see problems with the front set?
That is why we are focussing on the environment of the rotor side rear. It seems to be the only bearing with confirmed failures.
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Old 09-01-2009, 02:55 PM   #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmex
That is why we are focussing on the environment of the rotor side rear. It seems to be the only bearing with confirmed failures.
If someone had a handheld infared thermometer they could ride the bike for a while, hop off and check temps of the rotor, hub and surounding areas to see what kind of temps your getting.
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Old 09-01-2009, 03:16 PM   #190
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Yesterday after my ride home I checked the rear wheel hub temp with my hand, thinking that it may be a heat related failure, although not a long commute home it involves traffic and the resulting braking and the hub was not anywhere near hot to the touch.

For fear of pointing out the obvious: I'm inclined to think that the bearing failure is the result of some sort of mis-alignment and I would expect that even the "better" bearings that are being installed will fail. I'm not saying that they shouldn't be changed but we should also be after BMW to fix the root cause.
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Old 09-01-2009, 03:23 PM   #191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BykMyk
Yesterday after my ride home I checked the rear wheel hub temp with my hand, thinking that it may be a heat related failure, although not a long commute home it involves traffic and the resulting braking and the hub was not anywhere near hot to the touch.

For fear of pointing out the obvious: I'm inclined to think that the bearing failure is the result of some sort of mis-alignment and I would expect that even the "better" bearings that are being installed will fail. I'm not saying that they shouldn't be changed but we should also be after BMW to fix the root cause.
I tend to agree with you. We will know more after folks have some life on the replacement bearings, but the fact the the rotor side is vulnerable is very suspicious.
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Old 09-01-2009, 03:48 PM   #192
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When I sold my 1200 I was glad to no longer have to carry around a fuel pump bypass cable. Now maybe I have to carry around a spare bearing and the tools to replace it?



Not bloody likely.
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Old 09-01-2009, 03:58 PM   #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmex
That is why we are focussing on the environment of the rotor side rear. It seems to be the only bearing with confirmed failures.
As noted, my carrier bearing felt gritty when I pulled my wheel for inspection, and someone else earlier in this thread had similar findings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BykMyk
For fear of pointing out the obvious: I'm inclined to think that the bearing failure is the result of some sort of mis-alignment and I would expect that even the "better" bearings that are being installed will fail. I'm not saying that they shouldn't be changed but we should also be after BMW to fix the root cause.
Obvious or not, that's been my point all along.

Mind you, I'd LOVE to find out that the issue is simply crappy bearings. That's an easy fix.

For those of you who ARE replacing your OEM bearings with non-OEM ones, for the sake of the collective, please record as much information you can on the bearings. Vendor, price, load ratings, thermal ratings, etc. Unfortunately nobody knows (and will never know) the true specs of the OEM units, so the next best thing is to start with a known quantity on round two. IMHO, that 'known quantity' is really the #1 reason to go with a non-OEM part.
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Old 09-01-2009, 04:02 PM   #194
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I've got my bike in the bmw shop right now for transmission problems (won't shift out of first), go figure... but I told them to check the bearings.

At first the shop guys said "oh we've never heard of rear bearing failures" then I explained to them the failures I have been reading about. One of them shook his head in disbelief when I said there have been catastrophic failures at high speeds that could be life threatening but the other guy's eyes lit up and he said "Oh yeah!... maybe these people did not do the recall"...

What recall you ask? He explained there was a recall on some of the rear assemblies because one of the internal spacers was installed backwards and rides on the circlip instead of the inner race of the bearing... I could not visualize what he was saying and as soon as I get home I'm going to check my service DVD to find out. Seems when this happens there are a lot of aluminum shavings due to machining of the spacer by the circlip... which leads me to believe this is not the case we are looking at.



I believe we are on the right track with the spacing of the bearing or misalignment of the axle. Someone needs to show us the inside of their damaged bearings *in the correct orientation* so we can solidify our hypothesis. I would not be at all surprised to find the inner spacers out of tolerance resulting in large axial loads (lateral loads) on these bearings when the axle is torqued. (Thereby premature failure because these are NOT tapered roller bearings and are not designed to handle those loads).
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Old 09-01-2009, 07:16 PM   #195
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Just incredible.
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