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Old 11-08-2009, 02:33 PM   #31
JRWooden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XB12R
Good points, thanks.

Why exactly is the 650 HP less than the 800?
Mechanically speaking the there are some differences in the valve timing -the overlap and lift are less on the F658GS ... which helps the low end a bit at the expense of the high end.

I'm sure there are ignition timing and other differences in the way the ECU is programmed, but I've never seen the details.
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Old 11-09-2009, 03:23 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XB12R
Experience and confidance has little to do with it. I put 20,000 miles on the GS this year alone and I've been riding since the 60's. Fact is you'r going to have to reach the ground sometime and there won't be anything there.

How is the 800 low seat for comfort?
Gotta disagree on the confidence bit mate. I have been riding/racing bikes for 37 years and only 2 years ago I did an advanced dirt riding course and I learnt an absolute shitload and I thought I knew it all!

You are never too old to learn!!
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Old 11-09-2009, 10:40 AM   #33
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I'm 5'6" with a 29" inseam and went through the exact same dilemma.

I ended up with a F800GS and the low seat. Took me a bit to get used to it, but now I'm very happy I went this route.
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Old 11-09-2009, 03:30 PM   #34
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I agree the F800GS is too tall for an "average" rider to use comfortably in off road situations. I have dumped my F8 at least ten times and most of those get-offs were of the low speed tip-over variety. I am 5'11" with a 31" inseam. I am in the process of lowering mine with the Touratech kit. I will let you all know how that works out.

It is easy to say "ride the pegs", and I do ride the pegs. Every now and then a situation arises that you did not successfully anticipate. Unless you are very very good, you will need to dab on some of these occassions. Unless you can do so, you will experience a tip-over. I am strong enough to pick up the bike by myself in most situations and in others I can reposition it to allow pickup. I would prefer not to pick it up as often as I do.

If I intended to keep mine on streets and fire roads, I would leave it as is.
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Old 11-09-2009, 03:46 PM   #35
JimVonBaden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XB12R
I have a 30" inseam. While many short riders feel they can handle a tall bike I do not. I have almost dropped my GS1200 (standard seat) many times. If you ride behind a rider on a bike that's too tall it becomes obvious they have little control at low speeds.

I'm at my limit with the GS1200, the 800 is even taller. The low seat on a works for me but I think I may be sacrificing some comfort due to less padding. If I could lower it 2" I'd be good.
5'8" with a 28" inseam, and the standard R1200GS is fine, and contrary to your statement, I was never out of control. 55K miles without a drop should tell something.

I have ridden everything from a 12GS to an HP2, and an HP2 Sport, with no issues. It is all about paying attention to your environment, and practice.





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Old 11-09-2009, 03:54 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanderlost
Unless you are doing hard core off road the 650 has several advantages.
The tubeless tires are nice if you get a flat far from home
The smaller tire diameter is better for road riding. 21's are great off road but less good on road
You can change the front sprocket for a little more pull if you want it, but at the sacrifice of more vibes at high speed
You can use regular gas instead of premium
Less money

Paul:
You can change the gearing on the 800 as well so there is no benefit to the 650 there, but there will be a good amount of sacrifice on top in if you even change one tooth on the front sprocket of a 650.
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Old 11-09-2009, 10:59 PM   #37
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Don't be a wuss and lower the suspension on an 800. You lose ground clearance. That's why off road bikes are tall in the first place! If you don't care about clearance, buy a Wee/VStrom. But if you want a more capable DUAL sport, learn how to manage a taller bike.

Learn to rely on the throttle and clutch to keep you upright. Learn to drop one foot and to look for ground that's higher on one side so you can leverage that advantage.

I have a 30" inseam. I do have a custom low seat by Corbin that's slightly lower than the stock low seat, but it's still a reach (and laugh for experienced off roaders who watch) for me to get on and off the bike. But I manage.

And every time I do a water crossing over go over some rough 4wd type terrain, I'm glad for that 9+" of clearance.

If you were going to get a dirt bike it'd be even worse. For an off road bike, the F800 tall seat is short by several inches compared to your typical dirt bike. (which range from 38-39" seat height, compared to 34" for the F800gs tall seat).
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Old 11-10-2009, 03:08 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M N B
Don't be a wuss and lower the suspension on an 800. You lose ground clearance. That's why off road bikes are tall in the first place! If you don't care about clearance, buy a Wee/VStrom. But if you want a more capable DUAL sport, learn how to manage a taller bike.

Learn to rely on the throttle and clutch to keep you upright. Learn to drop one foot and to look for ground that's higher on one side so you can leverage that advantage.

I have a 30" inseam. I do have a custom low seat by Corbin that's slightly lower than the stock low seat, but it's still a reach (and laugh for experienced off roaders who watch) for me to get on and off the bike. But I manage.

And every time I do a water crossing over go over some rough 4wd type terrain, I'm glad for that 9+" of clearance.

If you were going to get a dirt bike it'd be even worse. For an off road bike, the F800 tall seat is short by several inches compared to your typical dirt bike. (which range from 38-39" seat height, compared to 34" for the F800gs tall seat).
I have a garage full of dirt bikes. My favorites are a pair of 300EXC's with 37.8" seat height and 15.2" of ground clearance. I have not lowered any of them. However, the static sag for dirt bikes is on the order of 4" which brings the "on the bike" seat height down to 33.7" or so. In order to get the F8 to work right the rear sag needs to be minimalist. I have mine set to about 2" which brings the "on the bike" seat height down to 32.8" with the stock seat. However, the seat on the F8 is much wider than a dirt bike seat so unless you have a very fat ass, your legs leave the seat at a much greater angle and a significant portion of your inseam is absorbed by that angle. I have more ground contact with my boots on the 300EXC's than I do on the F8, and the bike weighs about half as much as the F8. My guess is that you have the rear suspension of your F8 set fairly soft and that you are pretty wide around the butt, and the places you take your F8 are not as difficult as you think they are. If you have time to look around for ground that is higher on one side to acomodate your dab, then you are not riding difficult terrain.

The F8 is not a dirt bike, I have taken mine in some pretty darn gnarly places, and have not been particularly threatened by ground clearance issues. As far as throttle and clutch control are concerned, I am a virtual ballerina on the bike and I still auger it in routinely. We shall see how the experiment turns out. The lowering is easy to reverse. Nothing gets cut. Nothing ventured. Nothing gained.
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Old 11-10-2009, 06:34 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmex
I agree the F800GS is too tall for an "average" rider to use comfortably in off road situations. I have dumped my F8 at least ten times and most of those get-offs were of the low speed tip-over variety. I am 5'11" with a 31" inseam. I am in the process of lowering mine with the Touratech kit. I will let you all know how that works out.

It is easy to say "ride the pegs", and I do ride the pegs. Every now and then a situation arises that you did not successfully anticipate. Unless you are very very good, you will need to dab on some of these occassions. Unless you can do so, you will experience a tip-over. I am strong enough to pick up the bike by myself in most situations and in others I can reposition it to allow pickup. I would prefer not to pick it up as often as I do.

If I intended to keep mine on streets and fire roads, I would leave it as is.
Yes , keep me informed on the Touratech kit, I'm all ears. BTW how much does it lower it and what is the cost?
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Old 11-10-2009, 07:11 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XB12R
Yes , keep me informed on the Touratech kit, I'm all ears. BTW how much does it lower it and what is the cost?
xb12r:

not sure if someone's already mentioned this, but there is an easy solution. my dealer actually did it for his daughter. they replaced the 800's rear shock with the 650's. easy.

I rented an 800gs this summer, and loved it. i'm about 5'10" with a 30 inch inseam. my father is smaller, but has the same inseam. he couldn't get a foot down.
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Old 11-10-2009, 07:35 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NativeSon
xb12r:

not sure if someone's already mentioned this, but there is an easy solution. my dealer actually did it for his daughter. they replaced the 800's rear shock with the 650's. easy.

I rented an 800gs this summer, and loved it. i'm about 5'10" with a 30 inch inseam. my father is smaller, but has the same inseam. he couldn't get a foot down.
Not one?

Jim

PS I have ridden both with my 28" inseam, and was able to get the balls of my feet (both) down on the 800GS.
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Old 11-10-2009, 07:53 AM   #42
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Don't spend all that money on aftermarket kits. Do my temporary solution by getting an inch or two added to your riding boots or, even better, go with riverguy9's solution of cutting down your own spring. http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=411916
This thread, complete with pics is great. And I have PM'd rg9 a good year after the fact to see if he is still happy and the answer was "As a Clam."
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:26 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XB12R
Yes , keep me informed on the Touratech kit, I'm all ears. BTW how much does it lower it and what is the cost?
The lowering is two inches. Figure on about $400 total since when you add the Toruatech Kit you must replace the sidestand and the centerstand with the 650GS units because the F8 sidestand and centerstand will be too long.

Simply using the 650GS shock spring does nothing for the front. The kit comes with new progrssive springs front and rear along with some other stuff.
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:27 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by JimVonBaden
Not one?

Jim

PS I have ridden both with my 28" inseam, and was able to get the balls of my feet (both) down on the 800GS.
Read my earlier post about having a fat ass.
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Old 11-10-2009, 10:55 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by tmex
Read my earlier post about having a fat ass.


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