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Old 03-03-2014, 02:46 PM   #3871
Bluebull2007
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DC has the best job in the world. No doubt about it.


Troy: That was a good post.

Taking the orga's POV, I agree 100% with the decision to have a cutoff for people going up to 4,300m on a ridge in the late afternoon. 2-3pm would have been the cutoff for sure and for good reason. We found it never really helped because for whatever reason half the front runners ended up down the wrong canyon and the other half apparently were directed down it. I still have my doubts about that story. My gut feel is that people just got lost.

CHAVO: If you're still reading this can you remember seeing an official at the top of the mountain in Stage 3? If you can can you remember if he was near the point where you went back down that two track on the other side? Also we know it was a clear day when Barrea was video'd, but was it still clear when you got to the top or cloudy?

Weather can change quickly and that may have had an impact.
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Old 03-03-2014, 04:22 PM   #3872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebull2007 View Post
DC has the best job in the world. No doubt about it.


Troy: That was a good post.

Taking the orga's POV, I agree 100% with the decision to have a cutoff for people going up to 4,300m on a ridge in the late afternoon. 2-3pm would have been the cutoff for sure and for good reason. We found it never really helped because for whatever reason half the front runners ended up down the wrong canyon and the other half apparently were directed down it. I still have my doubts about that story. My gut feel is that people just got lost.

CHAVO: If you're still reading this can you remember seeing an official at the top of the mountain in Stage 3? If you can can you remember if he was near the point where you went back down that two track on the other side? Also we know it was a clear day when Barrea was video'd, but was it still clear when you got to the top or cloudy?

Weather can change quickly and that may have had an impact.
I didnt see any officials at that mountain or near it when I went by. The "canyongate" was probably 3-5 kms from that climb where it was easy to make a nav mistake and go down the mountain on the wrong side. I did a few circles at the top searching for the correct way but always was careful not to go down on anything that seemed hard to return again...
There were spectactors though, on enduro bikes and 2 trucks at the top, one with oxygen that I enjoyed for a few minutes!
The weather was ok, no fog or low clouds, we had good visibility.
My fellow countrymen Walter Nosiglia on the quads told me that he was redirected by officials before the gnarly climb, and did not go up on it. They were turning them back and around some place, obviously missing wps.
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Old 03-03-2014, 05:28 PM   #3873
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Thanks for the reply Chavo! Very interesting indeed!

Very interesting to hear about Walllllllltter Nosiiiiiiiiigliaaaaaaaaaa

He must have gone up that hill in the end as well otherwise he would not have made it to be bivouac no?

Un abraso
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Old 03-03-2014, 07:04 PM   #3874
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Clayton Jacobson

a great guy I met during the rally during the Dakar was Clayton Jacobson.. he was one of the guys "excluded" Here is his take on that climb and the ASO's choices on his Facebook page





Hi All,

Sorry for the delay in information, I have been choking on my result and not wanting to relive it.

so here it is My Dakar Day 3 - Short and Bitter,

So this years race has been brutal, my race came to an end on Day 3, not from crashing, exhaustion or mechanical problems but I was a victim of the organisers desire to make the toughest race in the world, the toughest race in the world.

Day 3 started fine, although as soon as the course opened up from the tight technical canyons we started in I came across broken bikes and riders.

At the fuel stop the photographer said he had picked up 4 riders with broken bones in the helicopter.

I seemed to have found a rhythm that worked and was navigating well and picking up some places without pushing (pushing is bad, you will crash).

Around 60kms from the end of the stage we started to climb in the mountains 2000m up to 4000m. On one of the climbs I got caught half way up when blocked by another rider and realised i had a major free flowing fuel leak. I did not want the bike to catch on fire so i kept it upright on the climb while the fuel drained away.

10mins later I ran out of fuel, I asked rider after rider if i could have some fuel and no one would spare any as the stage still had 60kms to go. Eventually an italian rider gave me a litre to continue up to CP2. I had wasted about 90mins trying to get fuel ( this is what put me in a bad position and late for the CP).

On getting to the bottom of a very technical and difficult climb at CP2 around 4000m, the organisation had placed their vehicle across the track and said the stage is closed as there is to many injured and missing riders , we are to wait here for news from race control.

There we broken bikes and people all about the place.

I called race control on my iritrack twice to confirm what was happening and they said it was with the jury, and we are to stay put.

Some riders turned back but 7 of us who were ready to go waited, we were held there until we were losing the light, the organisation said we must decend as the temperature will drop quickly.

We were constantly asking about our race position and what this delay means for our start the next day, we were told by race control arrangements were being made for a delayed start for us.

we were given the option to sleep in the mountains or ride to San juan bivouac for further instructions which we elected to do only to be told we must not ride the mountains at night as it is too dangerous. These instruction were given to us from the head of the race David Casters.

We froze at 2700m with only our plastic foil blanket and CP banners for warmth.

In the morning before dawn we were not allowed to leave as riders were still missing in the area and we could not leave until they were found.

Eventually we were able to leave and ride to San Jaun bivouac and then told to go the next bivouac 550kms away.

There we pleaded our case to the head of motorcycles who said it would go to the jury as we had missed the stage.

We were informed we had been excluded from the race 1 hr later.

We then took our protest to the race control who understood there had been a mistake but could do nothing about it.

We then took our protest to the head of the Dakar David Caster who agreed he had made a mistake but because they had lost control of the security of the race we would not be allowed to start the next day.

this argument went on for 3hrs.

the final word was "it is not possible" for us to start the next day.

they agreed we had followed the rules from the organisation exactly as required and that he had held us and made us miss the start and that was a mistake.

Still the verdict stood.

the 7 of us were excluded from Dakar 2014.
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Old 03-03-2014, 07:05 PM   #3875
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Originally Posted by Bluebull2007 View Post
Thanks for the reply Chavo! Very interesting indeed!

Very interesting to hear about Walllllllltter Nosiiiiiiiiigliaaaaaaaaaa

He must have gone up that hill in the end as well otherwise he would not have made it to be bivouac no?

Un abraso
Neil
Sam never mentioned anyone giving directions either, his road book was out of sync, as was he after just about pushing the bike up that last section..

Disorientated he then made the "fatal" error of following (his Brit mate Grabbo ) - he realised something wasn't right after about 50 metres, but couldn't get back as it was too steep.

There were a few of them, Grabbo, Speedy and Faria amongst them.

They aided Ruben when he had his issues and after pushing, dropping bikes off rock edges and risking serious falls, they managed to get out after about 2 hours!

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Old 03-03-2014, 09:43 PM   #3876
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I heard a few accounts very similar to Clayton's so at this point, I accept that story as pretty much the facts of what happened. The frustration level must have been through the roof.
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Old 03-04-2014, 12:30 AM   #3877
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We must have a left over roadbook to clear this.
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Old 03-04-2014, 05:47 AM   #3878
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This is a message I received from a mate after the race who was there also and had problems.

His outcome is really bad as you will read!

My engine broke down on 4.000 meter at 14.00. I had the 54th position!! The oil come out everywhere. At 19.00 I was very happy I had the possibility to buy a engine of an slovianian participator which broke his wrist. Then I get stopt at 20.30 by the organization to change the engine. I need to come down with them because the race was neutralized ! Than the next day they took us out of the race. I was very disappointed! The organization left my bike for 4 days on the mountain. Now it is stolen and not insured! I'am really Fed up with ASO!
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Old 03-04-2014, 05:57 AM   #3879
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Originally Posted by ROKIT_71 View Post
This is a message I received from a mate after the race who was there also and had problems.



His outcome is really bad as you will read!



My engine broke down on 4.000 meter at 14.00. I had the 54th position!! The oil come out everywhere. At 19.00 I was very happy I had the possibility to buy a engine of an slovianian participator which broke his wrist. Then I get stopt at 20.30 by the organization to change the engine. I need to come down with them because the race was neutralized ! Than the next day they took us out of the race. I was very disappointed! The organization left my bike for 4 days on the mountain. Now it is stolen and not insured! I'am really Fed up with ASO!

Is this pal ullevaters? (Sorry:))
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Old 03-04-2014, 06:22 AM   #3880
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Is this pal ullevaters? (Sorry:))

No not Pal.

I won't mention this guys name just in case he'd rather not want me too.
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Old 03-04-2014, 07:00 AM   #3881
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There we go...

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Old 03-04-2014, 07:03 AM   #3882
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Send help...

So "Sundersam's" new KTM race team nickname is "Balise"...?















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Old 03-04-2014, 07:31 AM   #3883
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wrk2srf: Are you able to ask Clayton how long he had to wait at the official truck? Interesting that he mentioned they were there until dark. To me it indicated that they must have arrived at the CP really late.
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Old 03-04-2014, 08:11 AM   #3884
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I heard a few accounts very similar to Clayton's so at this point, I accept that story as pretty much the facts of what happened. The frustration level must have been through the roof.
Castera:
"Yeah, we fucked up. Tough shit."

It's not like these guys were fighting for the win with their timings at that point. They were looking to finish. So the orga not letting them back in after their cock up because it wouldn't be cricket is a big steaming pile.

As I tell my son: Everybody makes mistakes. That's life. It's not the mistake that defines you, but what you do about it.
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Old 03-04-2014, 08:21 AM   #3885
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Castera:
"Yeah, we fucked up. Tough shit."

It's not like these guys were fighting for the win with their timings at that point. They were looking to finish. So the orga not letting them back in after their cock up because it wouldn't be cricket is a big steaming pile.

As I tell my son: Everybody makes mistakes. That's life. It's not the mistake that defines you, but what you do about it.
Going to play devils advocate on this beat to death topic

The guys who were behind the pace were behind the pace to complete the stage safely. Org did the right thing by not letting them continue. Had they of been having a quicker pace this wouldn't have happened to them.

I think the Org made the right call, the only call they could have made. They chose safety

I am compassionate to the folks who had their race end, truly. That being said riding at the back of the pack and being told to stop for safety reasons isn't really something to complain about ?

Seems like the org even tried to figure a way to let them continue but logistically it wasn't feasible. No way can you let folks continue after missing a stage...that wouldn't be fair to the folks who rode a faster pace and rode the stage completely and the next days stage.

I really don't see what the fuss is all about (and yes I realize that sounds cold)...
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