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Old 06-24-2012, 03:57 AM   #12736
sidetrack one
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I concur, that is why I am modifying mine!. As an Aussie I wanted to support a local manufacturer, I think I have a suitable work around for the mount, otherwise it seems OK
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Old 06-24-2012, 04:11 AM   #12737
jaumev
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As you can see in the pics, there are three dangerous points to break the engine. The two supports with bolt holes are the worst.
To break the cover it is not necessary a very strong hit at high speed. Apparently the breaking cover it was crossing a tree log. The bike weight is enough to fold the plate and break the engine cover.
I’m thinking seriously to cut this supports and have a flat surface . In my skid plate we are going to reinforce this areas and have a thick foam.



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Old 06-24-2012, 04:21 AM   #12738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaumev View Post
IMHO this is the worst possible place to attach the skid plate. The hits force are concentrated in a single point and in the other side as well.
It could happen this:

Could see that coming a mile away.....

Greg.
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Old 06-24-2012, 05:27 AM   #12739
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Looks like the Touratech had a sump failure in Utah

http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/ind...87550#msg87550
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Old 06-24-2012, 08:42 AM   #12740
CafeRacer99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sidetrack bob View Post
I can assure you guys that the Force plate DOES use the sump as a connection point , I have mine off at the moment and modifying it so as to remove these pick up points, a good hit will break the tabs off the sump IMO. I have engineered a relatively simple solution,which I will post when completed


Yeah, you're right. I was focused on the rear mounting point because that's all I've ever heard of anyone having problems with. I'm looking forward to seeing your work-around. I think the hit would have to be pretty hard to break those lugs though, but better to avoid the possibility than have to worry about it.

So this seems like a pretty big issue. I'm new to the ADV bike world and I'm curious, is the S10 the only bike that uses the bottom of the engine as a mounting point for skid plates? Every other bike is set up to use the frame as attachment for their skid plates? How the hell does Yamaha justify this?
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Old 06-24-2012, 09:10 AM   #12741
Dallara
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
...How the hell does Yamaha justify this?

Perhaps because they are building the bike for 90% of the target market instead of for the 10% of the market perceived by some enthusiasts???

Dallara


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Old 06-24-2012, 09:50 AM   #12742
markjenn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
So this seems like a pretty big issue. I'm new to the ADV bike world and I'm curious, is the S10 the only bike that uses the bottom of the engine as a mounting point for skid plates? Every other bike is set up to use the frame as attachment for their skid plates? How the hell does Yamaha justify this?
Almost all bikes without frame rails under the engine have skid plates that end up being attached to some part of the engine, more or less. It's really the nature of the beast. Occasionally you see a model that builds up a substantial structure to route loads up to higher-up non-engine attachment points, but to do this properly, you're essentially building an under-engine frame extension that has to support the full load of the bike.

I don't think you can engineer around every failure possibility, at least not without other drawbacks. It's all about tradeoffs within one's anticipated use of the bike. I don't think engine attachment points are deal-breakers for most of us and how it attaches is probably more important than whether it attaches. Attaching but distributing the load is a viable strategy.

- Mark
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Old 06-24-2012, 10:58 AM   #12743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markjenn View Post
Almost all bikes without frame rails under the engine have skid plates that end up being attached to some part of the engine, more or less. It's really the nature of the beast. Occasionally you see a model that builds up a substantial structure to route loads up to higher-up non-engine attachment points, but to do this properly, you're essentially building an under-engine frame extension that has to support the full load of the bike.

I don't think you can engineer around every failure possibility, at least not without other drawbacks. It's all about tradeoffs within one's anticipated use of the bike. I don't think engine attachment points are deal-breakers for most of us and how it attaches is probably more important than whether it attaches. Attaching but distributing the load is a viable strategy.

- Mark
Okay. So this is what I'm looking for, some perspective. The L-shaped brackets that attach the front of the Force Accessories plate to the engine lugs seem pretty well designed to spread the force of an impact.

But the question to me is how much of an impact, and what type of impact, is reasonable to expect any plate to absorb?

There has to be a reasonable standard before you can judge whether a plate meets it, correct? Pretty much all these plates meet the standard of protecting against stones being thrown up by the front wheel (notwithstanding the fluke pole-vaulting situation linked a couple of posts ago - that's just bad luck.)

But I think what we are all worried about is the scenario where you are dropping off a paved road onto an unpaved one, and the front end compresses and your skid plate impacts the tarmac or concrete. (Which is what I think happened to the Tenere in that bike test video, and the Tenere dropped all it's oil on the ground.) Or bumping over a large rock or log.

Everyone seems to agree that the skid plate is made to protect in this scenario. But is that reasonable? In that scenario, a very large percentage of the bikes weight is going to be on the plate along with some multiplier based on the speed of impact. How hard you hit that curb (or big rock or log) is up to the rider really.

At what point does it go from a reasonable impact that any properly equiped bike should survice, to bad judgement on the part of the rider who should never have gone over that obstacle?

When does it become a suspension issue and not a skid plate issue?

I don't have the experience to make these judgements. I'm curious to hear the collective thoughts of the group.
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Old 06-24-2012, 11:23 AM   #12744
jaumev
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CafeRacer99 View Post
Yeah, you're right. I was focused on the rear mounting point because that's all I've ever heard of anyone having problems with. I'm looking forward to seeing your work-around. I think the hit would have to be pretty hard to break those lugs though, but better to avoid the possibility than have to worry about it.

So this seems like a pretty big issue. I'm new to the ADV bike world and I'm curious, is the S10 the only bike that uses the bottom of the engine as a mounting point for skid plates? Every other bike is set up to use the frame as attachment for their skid plates? How the hell does Yamaha justify this?
I think the current maxitrail don’t have frame under the engine so they have to fix the skid plates to the engine, this is a weak point of this bikes if you want to do off road. This is why I want to improve the ground clearance and have a proper skid plate.
I suppose as Dalara said they are building the bike mostly for road users. In the GS, is even worse because there is no alternative and the plate is fixed the motor with silent blocks. I have seen several GS strainer covers with holes where the silent blocks are fixed.
At least in the ST if the plate is large enough you can fix it in the frame, that's what I'd like to do in mine. Another problem is they are very heavy bikes so in a hard impact the skid plate moves and hits the strained cover. A thick foam between the plate and the engine to distribute the impact could be a good alternative

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Old 06-24-2012, 11:48 AM   #12745
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New steed coming soon

So... After a REALLY tough decision, I sold my first true love, my 99 Blackbird, to make way for my forthcoming Tenere.
A few years back I bought a DR650 and turned it into a mini adventure bike. In doing so, I found I am not nearly as adapt at offroad riding (nor do I love it as much as on road) as I am in the paved twisty bits. I truly enjoyed jaunts down gravel roads and dirt paths, but single-trak, rough or super soft stuff is not my forte'. I sold the DR through this site (and got all my advise and info prior to and during ownership here) some time ago, but totally loved the riding position over my Bird. I really want to get back to that style of bike!

That being said, I am negotiating with a few dealerships on a price and have my heart set on a Raven Tenere. Knowing I will rarely take it off road, I will not be throwing on the latest, greatest hard core off road farkles. My plan is to go with the Givi (previously owned another set on my 'Bird) Trekker setup, top and sides vs the Yamaha setup due to capacity and familiarity with Givi. I will be mounting some manner of Cruise lock, and the choices seem few. I will get a crash bar set of some sort (kinda like the look of the Yamaha crash bar due to variable mounting points for lights, removable highway pegs, etc). And likely a bash plate just in case. I already have Ram mount bits to transfer over.

In scanning the over 12000 posts here, it is impossible to read every one in the time I have, so, what are the must have farkles? Or must replace accessories/parts? And yes, I know this is subjective. I retire in 18 months and will be riding it to Alaska from Virginia.
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Old 06-24-2012, 01:01 PM   #12746
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It is very subjective, like you said. I've put 9000 miles on mine in 3 months (everything from 800 mile days on the freeway to actual trail riding) without a single modification. I'm out of the ordinary though.

Most like to modify the seat. There are a few free versions, and a few pay methods to adjusting the angle so it is more flat, as opposed to tilting a bit forward.

Many complain of buffeting and either add the Yamaha winglets, or more often, put an aftermarket shield or mount on.

Since you're going to Alaska, dirt/gravel roads are in your future, and a skid plate should be on your list. If all you're planning on hitting are dirt/gravel roads, then any brand will work perfectly. If you may see yourself in more technical terrain, where the skid plate may be bottoming out or being used heavily, than you want to avoid the Yamaha plate. The Altrider is well respected, and there are numerous other options.
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Old 06-24-2012, 02:19 PM   #12747
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Old 06-24-2012, 03:49 PM   #12748
AKoffroader
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Yamaha OEM case mounts

Hi Fellow XT1200Z owners

I was wondering if anyone has the installation guide for the Yamaha OEM side case mounting brackets. I was riding two up with the cases off and my passenger managed to knock off the rubber bumpers that the lower case mounting saddle go over.

I need the part number for the rubber bumpers if it one is listed on the installation sheet. Tried searching the parts catalog but it only deals with bike parts and not OEM accessory parts.

If you have these panniers, I'd suggest drilling a hole just below the bumpers and running a zip tie over the top of the bumpers to keep them on. Silicone glue like the instructions suggest is just not enough to keep them on when a passenger's foot hits them. End result... loose and saggy side cases.

AK Greg
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Old 06-24-2012, 03:53 PM   #12749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaumev View Post
As you can see in the pics, there are three dangerous points to break the engine. The two supports with bolt holes are the worst.
To break the cover it is not necessary a very strong hit at high speed. Apparently the breaking cover it was crossing a tree log. The bike weight is enough to fold the plate and break the engine cover.
Im thinking seriously to cut this supports and have a flat surface . In my skid plate we are going to reinforce this areas and have a thick foam.



I've yet to get a plate for mine. Now that there are several offered, what do you guys / gals think is the best one for the money here in the USA?

Thanks for any relies on this in advance.

AK Greg
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Old 06-24-2012, 04:10 PM   #12750
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It doesn't show here....but got a new front sneaker this weekend. A Trail Wing...like on the Strom...always liked that tire.

I really like this motorcycle a lot...
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