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Old 02-03-2010, 09:32 AM   #46
Gordy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TemeculaRider
OMG! I thought Mexico was totally devoid of violence! You're telling me it's not?!

So where else is the violence? I'd really like to know. I just got back from 16 days in the Yucatan and Riviera Maya. Is it there? What about 13 days from TJ to Los Cabos and back in late December? Should I not have gone then too? Where do you recommend I ride from now on? I'd also like to warn all the great people I've met and been helped by in Mexico who seem so happy down there! They need to know about this! (the sarcasm is palpable, isn't it?)

Better yet, do this for me: Could you please post some links to reports of completely non-drug-related violence against in Americans in Mexico? I'll be waiting for your answer. As soon as you're done, for every one you post, I'll post 100 reports of non-drug-related violence in the US. Deal?

I'm not getting into a debate on this. No time right now. I posted my perception and that is all.
Do what you want. Ride without a helmet if that is what gives you a thrill. Makes no difference to me.

BTW, the Mexican Riviera is not where the bad news is coming from, but riding there without going through the frontera would be tough. YRMV
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:56 AM   #47
TemeculaRider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordy
I'm not getting into a debate on this. No time right now. I posted my perception and that is all.
Do what you want. Ride without a helmet if that is what gives you a thrill. Makes no difference to me.

BTW, the Mexican Riviera is not where the bad news is coming from, but riding there without going through the frontera would be tough. YRMV
I didn't ask you to debate me, I asked for common-sense answers to some very basic questions. You don't have any answers?

I don't blame you for not debating me on this cause you don't know what you're talking about. Posting "your perception" is no different than me wading into a discussion about riding in India and trying to sound like an authority when, in reality, I have nothing to add except links to media reports. Sound about right?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
you are safer in 99% of Northern Mexico than you are in 99% of Jacksonville, FL.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:04 AM   #48
TemeculaRider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordy
I'm not getting into a debate on this. No time right now. I posted my perception and that is all.
Do what you want. Ride without a helmet if that is what gives you a thrill. Makes no difference to me.

BTW, the Mexican Riviera is not where the bad news is coming from, but riding there without going through the frontera would be tough. YRMV
I just noticed this statement too. So maybe you can give us some crime rates on the border town of Mexicali. Since you won't find violent crime there, just give me any kind of crime. Anxiously awaiting your answer.

This myth you're trying to perpetuate of violence against Americans lurking around every corner of Mexico is UTTER NONSENSE. There is no basis for it AT ALL because it is simply not true. That being said, if your perspective is different, then by all means, DON'T GO!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
you are safer in 99% of Northern Mexico than you are in 99% of Jacksonville, FL.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:26 AM   #49
Sir Not Appearing
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My girlfriend and I went to Mexico in August of '07 and were in a little town about 15mi from Puerto Vallarta. Against the wishes of the resort and paying the taxi drivers $$$, we took the public buses too/from town and never had any worries. $1 each way. You couldn't beat it and I never once felt concerned for our safety during the day or night.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:27 AM   #50
enduro-ince
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TemeculaRider

This myth you're trying to perpetuate of violence against Americans lurking around every corner of Mexico is UTTER NONSENSE. There is no basis for it AT ALL because it is simply not true. That being said, if your perspective is different, then by all means, DON'T GO!

I sure didn't read that Gordy thought there was violence directed at americans any where in his posts. More reading, less chest thumping.

My opinion, if I'm allowed one, is that the dangerous areas and circumstances aren't as obvious in Mexico, there is more cross fire danger. Its easier to be in the way of that cross fire and it does not have to be at night near a strip club...and it doesn't have to be in the shady part of Mexico City or Juarez. It could be in an area you feel is paradise and that you feel is not a risky place to be... There are those who have been surprised by the lawlessness and those about to be surprised. Its still a great country and I'll still go, but I understand the risks a bit more now and realize you can't alleviate them by simply staying in at night.

What if you were one of the tourist hanging around creel (in the day time) when the cartel came into town blasting away at pretty much anybody in between them and their target? I don't think you'd say to yourself, "no biggie, its just like the united states"... Where they stupid for being there because of its proximity to drug turf even though its a tourist hub for the train and the canyons?
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:28 AM   #51
Kiko
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I think I probably posted this before somewhere but here it goes again as I think it provides some perspective.

A few years ago a Canadian couple flew down to Cancun for a family wedding. They were murdered and the Canadian news media was all over it like white on rice. "Corrupt Mexican authorities, corrupt police officials, extortion, lawless country,,don't go there your life is at risk!!!!..etc , etc,"

The US and Canadian news media frenzy went on for weeks. Finally the Canadian govt decides that they need to intervene and teach the Mexican police how to do an investigation. The outcome, through the joint effort of both countries, was that the murderers were fellow Canadians. All of the media drama ended in Canada. Buried on pg 19 of the Toronto papers.

Same story in Cabo, Canadian murdered and guess who killed him. A Mexican along with an American in a botched robbery attempt.

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2006/0...gsuspects.html
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:37 AM   #52
TomTom63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiko
...
The outcome, through the joint effort of both countries, was that the murderers were fellow Canadians. All of the media drama ended in Canada. Buried on pg 19 of the Toronto papers.
...
Very sad, half truth can do a lot of damage.

I guess the biggest thing is not knowing. Those of us, who can travel to other countries and experience different cultures and perspective are very fortunate. This type of experience cannot be found in any text book...
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:37 AM   #53
TemeculaRider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enduro-ince
I sure didn't read that Gordy thought there was violence directed at americans any where in his posts. More reading, less chest thumping.

My opinion, if I'm allowed one, is that the dangerous areas and circumstances aren't as obvious in Mexico, there is more cross fire danger. Its easier to be in the way of that cross fire and it does not have to be at night near a strip club...and it doesn't have to be in the shady part of Mexico City or Juarez. It could be in an area you feel is paradise and that you feel is not a risky place to be... There are those who have been surprised by the lawlessness and those about to be surprised. Its still a great country and I'll still go, but I understand the risks a bit more now and realize you can't alleviate them by simply staying in at night.

What if you were one of the tourist hanging around creel (in the day time) when the cartel came into town blasting away at pretty much anybody in between them and their target? I don't think you'd say to yourself, "no biggie, its just like the united states"... Where they stupid for being there because of its proximity to drug turf even though its a tourist hub for the train and the canyons?
Then why isn't he ever going back? What are we talking about here? Violence directed toward Mongolians?

Chest thumping?

The picture you're painting is of basically every place in the world. I'm curious what you'd recommend to "alleviate the risks?"
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2009 KLR650 (now a KLR685-Stage II)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
you are safer in 99% of Northern Mexico than you are in 99% of Jacksonville, FL.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:53 AM   #54
subcomm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TemeculaRider
Then why isn't he ever going back? What are we talking about here? Violence directed toward Mongolians?

Chest thumping?

The picture you're painting is of basically every place in the world. I'm curious what you'd recommend to "alleviate the risks?"
I would recommend that you alleviate the risks by doing the following:
1. Never and I mean never consider riding a motorcycle to any part of Mexico. It is total anarchy! Dope dealers, crooked cops, banditos. Stay far, far away.
2. Only ride your motorcycle within 25 miles of your home, make sure you always practice AGAAT and you must carry a Spot transceiver as well as a cell phone. Make sure also you never ride alone or at night.

Better yet, sell the bike, lock yourself in your house and stay tuned to your favorite cable news network to advise you when the world is going to end.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:57 AM   #55
TemeculaRider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subcomm
I would recommend that you alleviate the risks by doing the following:
1. Never and I mean never consider riding a motorcycle to any part of Mexico. It is total anarchy! Dope dealers, crooked cops, banditos. Stay far, far away.
2. Only ride your motorcycle within 25 miles of your home, make sure you always practice AGAAT and you must carry a Spot transceiver as well as a cell phone. Make sure also you never ride alone or at night.

Better yet, sell the bike, lock yourself in your house and stay tuned to your favorite cable news network to advise you when the world is going to end.
This is one of the first posts in this whole thead that makes a damn bit of sense!
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Justin
2009 KLR650 (now a KLR685-Stage II)
My Ford E350 4x4 Baja Van

Quote:
Originally Posted by PirateJohn
you are safer in 99% of Northern Mexico than you are in 99% of Jacksonville, FL.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:58 AM   #56
enduro-ince
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TemeculaRider
Then why isn't he ever going back? What are we talking about here? Violence directed toward Mongolians?

Chest thumping?

The picture you're painting is of basically every place in the world. I'm curious what you'd recommend to "alleviate the risks?"

My point, Justin, is that you made it sound as though Gordy was saying, "Don't go to Mexico, they kill americans down there".

Anybody who has been down there knows thats not the case, but they sure are taking a beating from each other. Cartel vs Cartel, cartel vs good cops, cartel vs bad cops, good cops vs bad cops, bad cops vs good cops. Add in the fact that all family members can be targets too, and it starts becoming something you don't typically see in the good ole USA.

And I'm painting a picture of every country ran by drug cartels in the world.

You can't alleviate the risks, that was my point.
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Old 02-03-2010, 11:03 AM   #57
tricepilot
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Hey - it's break time!

OK wiseguys, time for a siesta in this debate, let's all meet in my mancave for a round of this:



two shots each and you can get back to it!
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Old 02-03-2010, 11:12 AM   #58
enduro-ince
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tricepilot
OK wiseguys, time for a siesta in this debate, let's all meet in my mancave for a round of this:


two shots each and you can get back to it!

Not only is my drink stronger, my man cave is way bigger.

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Old 02-03-2010, 11:14 AM   #59
tricepilot
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Excellent! Then you're all tuned up to come over here and help me finish this project this afteroon on a VERY rainy day in San Antonio:

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Old 02-03-2010, 11:34 AM   #60
patsymack
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Hi Guys,
I{m in Mexico right now in Xilitla SLP,been in mexico for aweek now no problems only good people So far.Only problem has been the rain and cool weather for the last 4 days.Hope it clears up have about a month to play.Going to make aloop to west coast and then back north.Retirement {s great
later Patsy
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