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Old 04-27-2015, 02:19 AM   #1
TR5ESU OP
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F800GS Overhaul

Hi all,

I haven't posted here for a long time. My bike has been sitting in the driveway under a couple of motorbike covers for a couple of years, only making it to the MOT centre and back a few times in that time.

I used the mike mostly off-road since I got it (it's a 2008 model) and in that time it took some aesthetic damage.. nothing serious, just the usual rusted header pipes, paint coming off the frame where offroad boots rub against it, etc.

Now I finally have time (and a some "good enough" cover) to take care of my bike and I started an overhaul of it. I will admit that the bike has been neglected by leaving it sitting there for too long.. and probably by not taking good enough care of it while I rode it offroad in the past, so judge me freely on that :-).

A while ago I had replaced the AdvSpec bash plate I had on the bike for the original plastic sump guard and found that the paint on the sump cover was flaking off.. I had noticed that paint was coming off the starter motor a couple of years ago.. I attributed that to the front wheel throwing dirt, rocks, etc at the starter... but I didn't know the issue extended to the sump cover too. I'll have a better picture of this soon as I have not taken the plastic cover off, but here is one from the side:


I also have a seized chain adjuster bolt on the right side.. which has now turned into a snapped, semi drilled bolt! The bolt started twisting and I didn't realize in time before it snapped. I started drilling it out but I'll need a longer drill bit as the drill starts touching the swingarm (sorry about the wrong focus on this pic.. I'll take a better one today):



So.. now I have to take the swinging arm off and possibly take it to a shop or replace it with a used one from ebay.. BUT.. seized bolt #3! The lower bolt in the rear shock. This time I was better prepared and wasn't gonna have another bolt snap on me.. lots of de-ruster (I went and got a can of WD40 Specialist Rust Release.. seems to work), here is the bolt removed:



I thought that would be the last of it, but now it's my 3rd day trying to take out bolt #4: Swinging arm pivot bolt. I removed the nut on the left side of the bike with no problem.. was torqued to 100nm or close to that, I went to the other side with the 21mm socket and it was hard.. but it turned free and after a few turns it spins relatively free (if I want to tighten the left side nut I have to put a wrench on the right side or it spins).
So.. looking at the diagrams for that section of the bike it seems the bolt is rusted together with either the bush bearings or the needle sleeve. When turning the bolt I can see what is either the needle sleeve or the bush bearings turning with the bolt...


This is what my bike looks like atm (minus a few more bits I've taken off):



I have drained the oil and taken the battery out and I plan to lay the bike on its side so I can spray WD40 Rust Release on it and leave it doing it's work.

So.. wish me luck! Also any advice is more than welcomed!

I'll be asking for advice on restoring the sump cover when I get to it.. if I don't end putting a new one. I initially thought the paint peeling off affected the entire engine and I freaked out a bit.. I do have what seems to be a bit of corrosion around the bolts on the engine case.. but hopefully it's not the same deal as with the sump cover.

Cheers!
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Old 04-27-2015, 06:45 AM   #2
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I found this hub puller at my local Halfords that might just work if I can get it to align and am able to put two steel threaded rods through the frame all the other way to the oher side:
http://www.toolsinstock.com/100MM__1...uct--4666.html

If I can't align it I can return it and maybe try something else.

Cheers
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Old 04-27-2015, 08:23 AM   #3
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Wow.

The bike has been sitting in a damp location so you've gotten corrosion on everything including the sump. Standard when storing things in the open as you've noticed. You'll need to check all your bearings and pivot points for rust. Esp your steering head bearings when you get to the front half. Get some good anti-seize and remove bolts while you can. Make sure you know what gets anti-seized and what gets loc-tite. The lower shock bolt is loc-tite and likely why it was so hard to remove. 100 NM + loc-tite plus dampness and time.

For the chain adjuster bolt, knock the spacer piece out of the way if you haven't yet. I'd want to change the swingarm myself once you get it off. There seems to be a good used part supply in England on Ebay. I've bought a few for $50 US or less. If your bearings get damage then a good used arm will be cheaper than some bearings and seals.

The long bolt goes through the swingarm AND the engine. If you crack the lower case, you're done. Soak all the areas in penetrant oil, use sandpaper where you can see the bolt in the middle to remove rust and caked on stuff. That part has to go back through the bushes on the rh side so if not clean, will go tight on you. It's the engine bushings you need to protect. Once soaked, I'd use a punch and lightly try to bash the bolt through. A puller might get too frustrating.

I'll look for pics.

Since you're there, remove the shock and try to see if the chrome is rusty. Not a bad idea to see if the upper bolt is bent anyway.

It's a can of worms, you'll keep finding things.
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Reaver screwed with this post 04-27-2015 at 08:29 AM
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Old 04-27-2015, 10:33 AM   #4
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Hi Reaver!

Thank you very much for the advice! It's very much appreciated.
I agree, I suspect I'll find many more headaches as I go through.

The puller doesn't quite fit in any easy to use way so I'll be laying the bike down on its side and spraying lots of penetrating oil for a few days/weeks while I work on the rest of the bike.

Re chain adjuster: Yes, I've removed the spacer before trying to drill out the bolt.. but I am leaning more and more towards just replacing the swinging arm once I get it out... I might have a go at drilling the bolt out just for practice/fun on this one first though.

I'll keep you guys posted!

Cheers
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Old 04-27-2015, 10:40 AM   #5
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I do have a bit of experience with that. My 2012 needed a bit of work.








I'm moving and will be offline for a bit. Have fun!



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Old 04-27-2015, 11:12 AM   #6
Capt CF
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You guys might get more help if you posted these over on the unicycle forum...
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Old 04-28-2015, 12:38 AM   #7
TR5ESU OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaver View Post
I do have a bit of experience with that. My 2012 needed a bit of work.

I'm moving and will be offline for a bit. Have fun!
Yikes!

Am I the only one who thinks the F800GS looks particularly cool bare down to its frame like this!? in unicycle form as Capt CF says :)

Good luck moving! I'll have plenty of fun I am sure
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Old 04-28-2015, 02:42 PM   #8
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Got the top bolt from the rear shock off today.. it looks in good shape, just a barely noticeable bend when looked against a very flat surface.



The shock itself... needs a good clean, can it be serviced?





Removed the front fairing panels and laid the bike on its side (oil already drained.. coolant still there). Sprayed penetrating oil in the swinging arm bolt and hit it with a small sledge hammer a couple of times but nothing yet. Will keep spraying penetrating oil over the next few days while I keep dismantling the rest of the bike.




Oh.. and I also seem to have a oil cooler leaking coolant (doesn't seem to be leaking oil)
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Old 04-29-2015, 02:28 PM   #9
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Slow Connection in the Jungle....

Your oil cooler has probably corroded the paint off under the seal. I figured that. Remove it when possible and clean all the bad paint and maybe a smear of silicone with the gasket. If bad enough then you'll need another one.

Some say the shocks can be rebuilt but no one's said THEY'VE done it. Mine looked ok but had lost oil so was springy on the fully extended part. See if it works I guess. Is all that grease from the chain or is the shock leaking?
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Old 04-30-2015, 01:23 AM   #10
TR5ESU OP
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I think it's grease from the chain.. the shock was in good shape as far as I knew.
I'll have to read up on shock maintenance and see what I can do about it.

Thanks for the advice on the oil cooler. I'll give that a shot.

Yesterday I removed the read brake line, brake sensor and sidestand cut off sensor so I could free the rear end of the bike from all cables, wires and tubes.

Today I'll be cleaning the bike as much as I can.. I have been cleaning parts as I remove them.. but with the swinging arm not moving yet I will have to clean it where it is first or I'll keep getting grease all over me.. and who knows, maybe a good clean will loosen it up a bit!

I'll take some before/after cleaning pics and post them tonight.

Cheers!
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Old 04-30-2015, 07:05 AM   #11
HobbitMarco
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Good luck with her TR5ESU! I know nothing about motorcycle maintenance/repair. But I will be following this revival :).

I plan on parking my bike in my yard under a cover (and later a shed/roof when I've built it). I plan on riding and maintaining my bike regularly etc. Should I be worried about those 'deeper' bolts rusting if I keep it outside? Is this something I should/can take care of? Or is this inevitably going to happen anyway?
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Old 04-30-2015, 07:18 AM   #12
TR5ESU OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HobbitMarco View Post
Good luck with her TR5ESU! I know nothing about motorcycle maintenance/repair. But I will be following this revival :).

I plan on parking my bike in my yard under a cover (and later a shed/roof when I've built it). I plan on riding and maintaining my bike regularly etc. Should I be worried about those 'deeper' bolts rusting if I keep it outside? Is this something I should/can take care of? Or is this inevitably going to happen anyway?
Thanks for the encouragement HobbitMarco!

I only have my motorbike to go by with regards to your questions, and it didn't live the normal F800GS life.
It's done several deep river/pond crossings.
I rode it through winter every year and in the UK they throw a lot of salt.
And apart from the first 1.5 years when I had a garage, it has always been parked outside under covers.

The two areas I am having issues with now are the chain adjuster bolts on the swinging arm and the pivot bolt.

The chain adjuster bolts are easy to remove and grease with anti-seize.. you should probably do it.

The pivot bolt should be easy to take out, but I would not worry about that one unless you've submerged in water more than once. Bear in mind that if you remove the nut on that bolt you are supposed to put a new one in (self locking, etc).

Just regular maintenance however should suffice I'd think. Be careful with water pressure washers though.. I am still wondering whether that had anything to do with it some of the seized bolts I am finding, even when used in the lowest pressure setting.

Cheers!
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Old 04-30-2015, 10:07 AM   #13
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Hey saw your post and wanted to give you a bit of advise as best I can. I have worked on aircraft with frozen hardware for years and have found the best thing, despite the rumors, is try and freeze the bolt. You v
Can find some freeze spray or even get dry ice or better yet Liquid Nitrogen. We have had many a mechanic beat the living crap out of hardware in attempts to renove said frozen hardware, what you end up doing is mushrooming the bolt.
So if the penetrant does not work you might try the cold method. I can also recommend a product called Mouse Milk, it has never let me down and seems to work faster and better then WD40, not to say WD40 isn't a good product,
You should be able to clean up the hardware with some thread chasers, will make it much easier to reassemble
Hey good luck with you OH
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Old 04-30-2015, 02:09 PM   #14
TR5ESU OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr B View Post
Hey saw your post and wanted to give you a bit of advise as best I can. I have worked on aircraft with frozen hardware for years and have found the best thing, despite the rumors, is try and freeze the bolt. You v
Can find some freeze spray or even get dry ice or better yet Liquid Nitrogen. We have had many a mechanic beat the living crap out of hardware in attempts to renove said frozen hardware, what you end up doing is mushrooming the bolt.
So if the penetrant does not work you might try the cold method. I can also recommend a product called Mouse Milk, it has never let me down and seems to work faster and better then WD40, not to say WD40 isn't a good product,
You should be able to clean up the hardware with some thread chasers, will make it much easier to reassemble
Hey good luck with you OH
Thanks for the advice! I have started trying the "heat outter metal, freeze inner metal" method but it's hard to get the bolt frozen where I believe it's stuck to the bushings, but I'll keep trying! See my next reply.

Thanks again!
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Old 04-30-2015, 02:24 PM   #15
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So, I cleaned the swinging arm and the rear end.. it's not perfect yet but working on it it's much easier now that I don't have to be watching where I put my hand in case I get grease all over me.

And I have movement on the swinging arm pivot bolt! It's not out yet.. and I a little worried about what's moving and what's not.

I have hit the bolt (with the nut half threaded in so as not to mushroom the bolt) with a small sledgehammer quite a bit, at the same time as turning it, spraying it with penetrating oil and trying a bit of hot/cold treatment with a heatgun + a compressed air can that when turned upside down freezes thing pretty quick.

The bolt didn't seem to move at all, but then I tried pushing the bolt in with a little tap with the hammer and I saw it move back in a very small amount.. maybe 2 or 3mm. I proceeded to tap the bolt from each side while observing what moves and what not and here is what's happening:

Things on the left side don't seem to move.. that is the bolt slides through whatever is on the left.
On the right, there's a bush bearing (or is that the needle sleeve?) that moves with the bolt. Here is a picture with an arrow pointing to the bush bearing I am talking about, it's inside the swinging arm, not the engine case:



Now.. what I am worried about is that since that bush bearing on the right is moving WITH the bolt... what has given way for it to move? Have I made the frame slightly wider by pushing it out with the bolt + bush bearing?
Or is the swinging arm deforming inside thus giving way for the bush bearing?

I am way for the weekend in Amsterdam so I'll have to give it a rest.. I'll leave it with a good dose of penetrating oil.. hopefully it works its magic on it.

Also, I was reading online about similar cases (other bikes) and it seems some of these bolts are hollow.. making it possible to drill a hole from one side and easy to fill with something that will freeze it.. dry ice, etc. Does anyone know if this is the case with this bolt? And do you think this might be a good idea?

Cheers!
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