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Old 03-14-2010, 08:01 AM   #1
mouthfulloflake OP
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1100gs, replaced headgaskets, odd noise afterwards

My right side was leaky, see this thread.

http://advrider.com/forums/showthrea...ghlight=gasket

I picked up 2 new gaskets, the newer 3 layer, versus the older 4 layer gaskets.

swapped the side that was leaking, and did the other side, to make them even in the event that gasket thickness would yield different compression.

opposite ( non leaky ) side had some slight seepage at cylinder base, so I removed that cylinder , put new permatex, and went ahead with that head gasket replacement too .


cam sprocket position was verified on both sides, engine went back together easily.

I went VERY light on the head torquing, I went to 20 NM, then 90 degrees, and barely any more. ( I was afraid Id pull a stud out)

anyway, after a 12 miles test ride yesterday, there is some slight oil leaking, from what appears to be the head gasket on the left side.

and THE ODD PART.

I rode to a buddy's house, let the bike site for an hour, when I left, bike was cool, ( no bars on RID)

I cranked it and rode off, I goosed the gas once, and it made a really odd noise, like a giant electrical arc, or maybe head to piston interference?

I babied it down the road a mile, and it quit, after it had 2 bars on the RID, I could goose the throttle all I wanted and no noise.

wtf was that?

any ideas are appreciated.

I plan to pull the covers and re-torque the 4 nuts and hopefully solve that leak, but the noise scares me?!
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Old 03-14-2010, 08:09 AM   #2
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In this last pic, the intake valves are open slightly, I think the cam sprocket turned abit upon removal leaving the cam in that position when the head wa removed, that sprocket 'tang' was in the slot though, the engine started right up, made no noises, and ran well ( other than odd cold clattering noise)

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Old 03-14-2010, 08:11 PM   #3
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what did you use for TDC reference? The arrows on the cam sprocket or the flywheel marks?
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Old 03-15-2010, 02:40 AM   #4
Dan Căta
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If you still have your heads off, I recommend a ultrasonic bath cleaning for all the carbon deposits on there ;)

It will make them like brand new ;)
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Old 03-15-2010, 05:51 AM   #5
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I used the OT mark on the flywheel peep hole, the cam sprocket arrows lined up at pretty much the same time.

I retorqued ( additional torque added) the head studs, and re-adjusted the valves, and it seems to be better.

time will tell.
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Old 03-15-2010, 05:54 AM   #6
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Hard to say about the noise, but you should not have ignored the head torquing procedure. You may now not be able to get the gaskets to seal correctly.

Initial 20nm and 90°, followed by another 90° is designed to seat the gaskets, then seal them correctly. If your studs were going to pull out, shorting the torque wouldn't help anyhow. Now you will have to loosen and retorque them again, twice.

Jim
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Old 03-15-2010, 05:56 AM   #7
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I dont follow your logic on less torque being less likely to pull the studs out.

But regardless, yeah, they might be screwed, but they seem to be sealing off now, if they dont, Ill buy more and do it again, its no biggy, still far cheaper than shop labor.

Oh yeah, I had read a report you did, replacing a stud, and retorquing ( under the target value) and assumed that your similar situation ended well with less head stud torque, as referenced here:

http://advrider.com/forums/showpost....41&postcount=9
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mouthfulloflake screwed with this post 03-15-2010 at 08:46 AM
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Old 03-15-2010, 06:01 AM   #8
JimVonBaden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouthfulloflake
I dont follow your logic on less torque being less likely to pull the studs out.

But regardless, yeah, they might be screwed, but they seem to be sealing off now, if they dont, Ill buy more and do it again, its no biggy, still far cheaper than shop labor.
Less torque is not really less likely to pull the studs out. 90° is plenty of torque to do that, DAMHIK.

However, the compression of combustion puts much more force on the studs than 90° of torque from tightening the stud nut.

Jim
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Old 03-15-2010, 05:50 PM   #9
GSA GIRL
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Head Torque

If torquing the head studs to specs causes you to pull a Stud, then you had a bad hole to begin with. If the threads won't hold the recommended torque then you really need to fix the threads with Heli-Coil or one of the other products out there. The threaded hole should support much more than just the recommended torque.
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Old 03-15-2010, 05:57 PM   #10
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exhaust leak, at the cyl head to manifold. As it warmed up the metal expanded and sealed the leak,

Recheck the exhaust studs

Or maybe something completely different
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Old 03-15-2010, 08:52 PM   #11
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I retorqued the heads to spec ( pretty much)


it hasnt made that noise again, and seems to be running, and idling smoother than ever.

Time will tell, oh and about the carbon build up, my plan is rev the piss out of it an aweful lot to clean that up.
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Old 03-17-2010, 07:40 AM   #12
MattW
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Spark plug tunnel seals?

Mine made some really weird noises when I displaced one after changing a head gasket.
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Old 03-17-2010, 01:25 PM   #13
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yeah I went thru that too, one was off, its like a wheezing/sucking noise when they are off, and I learned to peer into the plug hole with a flashlight to make sure they are in place.

as I said, it hasnt made that noise again.

My best guess was I got on the throttle hard before the cam chain tensioners had oil pressure and it was clacking around?
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Old 02-09-2014, 01:03 AM   #14
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Try using cold ATF through the vacuum ports on a hot engine to clean the carbon buildup. I usually do that before an engine tear down/build up. A bore scope is an excellent investment for checking cylinders before or after breaking into. My next one will have the ability to record onto an SD card for computer evaluation but the one I have now has saved me huge amounts of money and thus paid for itself tenfold.
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Old 02-09-2014, 05:21 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
Less torque is not really less likely to pull the studs out. 90° is plenty of torque to do that, DAMHIK.

However, the compression of combustion puts much more force on the studs than 90° of torque from tightening the stud nut.

Jim
Um, no
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