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Old 02-16-2012, 09:42 AM   #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtb_man View Post
Great to see this project has started up again (and that you made it through a Afg tour ok).

Thanks

A few observations/questions:
1) You will need a bigger radiator than the ADV one. The RC8 runs very hot in slow traffic and that's with proper airflow through the fairings, a bigger radiator and 0.5L more coolant. Twin fans would also be a good idea.

Im aware of the cooling issue and it will tested before any serious roadtrip. If its going to be an issue i will go for the RC8 cooler.

2) I agree with Katoom that you'll need a cush hub for the motard wheel. As an alternative that uses stock KTM parts, try to find a set of Super Duke wheels. The Super Duke wheels need some front brake adapters from CJRacer, but the setup will be great.

Yes i will go for a cush anyway, but this set have a buyer already. The buyer will know of the spokes this times. I will maybe look for the marchesini option. One question regarding the marchesini. Are the Super Duke and RC8 rims not the same in size?

3) Will the SXS muffler will flow enough to handle the RC8's exhaust output? At full throttle you'll have ~150hp worth of exhaust flow going through a muffler that was designed to handle less than 60hp. I'd run with two mufflers if you can find the room. Plus the RC8 is noisy enough with a stock muffler (~100db), with the smaller SXS muffler it'll be much louder. Lucky the RC8 has a nice sound.

Well the SXS muffler was one from a project. It should not be to restrictive. 2" all the way through. If it wont work i still have my 950 akras. I dont think the hp output would be of any trouble in this. The SXS looks just like the akra inside.

4) For the dipstick/oil filler tube problem, could you remove the filler tube and run without a dipstick? It looks like you could machine up a blanking plate that was clamped by the two bolts that hold the filler tube onto the oil tank. No dipstick might be a problem but you also remove the known RC8 issue of the filler tube leaking (KTM issued new parts to stop the leak). I reckon you could run without a dipstick, the RC8's dry sump means you can under or overfill a bit and it's not such a huge deal as with wet sump engine.

This is very thought. I will look into this later. thanks

5) The gearing will be a fun thing to set up. The LC8 has more torque down low than the RC8, so lower gearing will help, but the bigger 18in tyre will increase your slow crawl speed. I reckon 16-42 should be pretty good for fast gravel work. You also have an extra 1000rpm to play with thanks to the RC8's higher rev limit.

This gearing/rideability will be a very funny thing to look into. Yes these engines performs totally different but if we compare the dynos i think it will be ok.

LC8:
3000 - nil
4000 - 75 nm
5000 - 80 nm
6000 - 84 nm
7000 - 86 nm
8000 - 83 nm
9000 - 72 nm

RC8R:
3000 - 87 nm
4000 - 94 nm
5000 - 102 nm
6000 - 106 nm
7000 - 117 nm
8000 - 115 nm
9000 - 112 nm
10000 - 110 nm
10500 - 100nm

These numbers are dynos found on the different forums and ofcourse they are not accurate. They still give numbers we can compare them with. Because this is, as you said, very interesting. The LC8 area i used was 4500-8000 rpm. And this looks promising as the RC8R have 97 nm at 4500. But im thinking of the flywheelweight(is it called that?). If its "racelight" to make it really fast revy would it(ME) not be prone to stall a bit easyer??? Or am i out of area here?


Keep up the hard work and good luck with the challenges. I'm looking forward to your next update.

Thanks for the thought i appreciate that.

Mikael

ps: Sorry for sucky english.
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Old 02-17-2012, 10:17 AM   #167
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My RC8 (not the R model) doesn't really start to come alive until 5000 rpm, the engine doesn't smooth out until 4000 rpm. My bet would be slap on the stock RC8 gearing and try that first. You might find that the engine has enough power to pull the high gearing without stalling.
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Old 02-17-2012, 12:43 PM   #168
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Thanks for the inside knowledge. Are you running stock gearing?
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:05 PM   #169
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Well not much time with the bike today though fixed some smallish stuff.


Thought i would try the SAS blanking plates from the LC8 on the RC8R...



Worked fine.


Cut the Oilstick/fillergap. Making a shot for a plate. Well try see if this works out.


Next time ill try attack this dashboard eletrical problem. I need 20cm more to reach the dash position.



Regarding wheels i think ill try run with the Super Duke wheels. And the ECU, imobilizer and keyset was ordered today. 8900 Danish kr. Wow a boring buy, but somewhat needed. Anyone now if i can splice the wiring for the sidestand on this machine. Just like we do on the LC8?

Best regards
Mikael
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:39 PM   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Locul@hotmail.com View Post
Thanks for the inside knowledge. Are you running stock gearing?
Yeah, I haven't changed the gearing on either bike. I think as long as you stay out of the single track that the RC8 motor will pull the standard RC8 gearing. You might have to make 1 tooth change at the front but I think that will be the absolute most.
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Old 02-17-2012, 04:23 PM   #171
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Keep it up! Sweet build.

And you gotta love the dumb loyal pooches. When there smart is when you gotta watch out.
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Old 02-20-2012, 12:56 PM   #172
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2 hours today and a little help got me into the electrics...

Ze bike.


By the way the dealer confirmed that the ECU/Ignitionset and imobilizer unit is on the way AND i couldnt return them it once bought.. Because it wasnt bought with a frame number. Well this just got to work.

The wiring job for the Dash. Need 20cm and there 22 cables to cut and make perfect.



1 hour got me 6 wires today. Wow this is boring.



I should be able to finish this tomorrow. And a danish supplyer of PETG(thermoplastic)has some smaller parts i could buy to get on top of the dash/gps area. I have asked for 3mm and it should be rigid enough. Im looking foreward to put this dash area under control because it is all a mess at the "tower".
If we dream a bit and look into the nearer future(1-2 month) i could maybe have a runner. Next 2 big stuff is the exhaust and the cooling.

uhhh someday maybe, someday.
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Old 02-21-2012, 11:57 AM   #173
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Got through the first real wiring hazzle. It got laced in a plastictubing and taped up.


to this


Did some tinkering with the plate where the damper will be, Plan is to cut away this 10mm cylindric piece.


Then fabricate a mount just like the EXCs "U" shape.





Now im waiting for the plastic to arrive and the ECU bits.
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Old 02-22-2012, 04:13 PM   #174
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Your progress looks great.

As far as I know, the Super Duke rear wheels aren't as wide as the RC8 wheels (fronts are the same), and I doubt the RC8 rear wheel would fit in the ADV swingarm. Good choice on the SD wheels. I have a set in the garage that I'll fit to my ADV when I have the time. You'll have to run a 180/55R17 rear tyre, which will squirm a bit with the RC8's torque, but that's ok.

As for gearing, I've geared my RC8 and ADV down 3 rear teeth from stock (now 17-40 and 17-45 respectively) which is the same as 1 tooth at the front. The RC8 is pretty bad down low on stock gearing like Katoom said, for me 1st was unusable in traffic without slipping the clutch too much. In the same speed traffic, my lower geared ADV can lug along just fine without any clutch.

You make a good point about the flywheel weight too. I find the RC8 stalls pretty easily due to the low engine intertia, whereas the ADV will keep running. The lighter flywheel in the RC8 will make the bike trickier to ride on technical tracks, but if you stick to the 4500-8000rpm area that you used on the 950, you'll be fine (and destroy rear tyres even faster ).
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Old 02-22-2012, 05:03 PM   #175
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Old 02-23-2012, 02:21 AM   #176
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Thanks for the questions and thoughts. How did your RC8 react to the 3 less tooth on the rear. Im thinking riding slow/street/starting etc. Did it give any grunt or would just be lousy until 4000.



Mikael

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtb_man View Post
Your progress looks great.

As far as I know, the Super Duke rear wheels aren't as wide as the RC8 wheels (fronts are the same), and I doubt the RC8 rear wheel would fit in the ADV swingarm. Good choice on the SD wheels. I have a set in the garage that I'll fit to my ADV when I have the time. You'll have to run a 180/55R17 rear tyre, which will squirm a bit with the RC8's torque, but that's ok.

As for gearing, I've geared my RC8 and ADV down 3 rear teeth from stock (now 17-40 and 17-45 respectively) which is the same as 1 tooth at the front. The RC8 is pretty bad down low on stock gearing like Katoom said, for me 1st was unusable in traffic without slipping the clutch too much. In the same speed traffic, my lower geared ADV can lug along just fine without any clutch.

You make a good point about the flywheel weight too. I find the RC8 stalls pretty easily due to the low engine intertia, whereas the ADV will keep running. The lighter flywheel in the RC8 will make the bike trickier to ride on technical tracks, but if you stick to the 4500-8000rpm area that you used on the 950, you'll be fine (and destroy rear tyres even faster ).
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Old 02-23-2012, 05:29 PM   #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Locul@hotmail.com View Post
Thanks for the questions and thoughts. How did your RC8 react to the 3 less tooth on the rear. Im thinking riding slow/street/starting etc. Did it give any grunt or would just be lousy until 4000.



Mikael
The three extra teeth (stock RC8 is 37T rear, I use a 40T now) on the rear made the RC8 much better for slow street riding and starting. The bike is happy to ride around at 3000rpm in traffic and I don't have to slip the clutch as much in slow riding.

The lower gearing makes the bike pull better out of corners and it feels like it has more grunt down low too. On a race track it wouldn't be needed but for the street it works really well.
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Old 02-24-2012, 01:45 AM   #178
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Thanks for the reply. Very helpful. Gearing with the 18"(150/80/18) rear should be 45 teeth(touring, gravel). With the(soon to come SD wheels) 17" tarmac killer im thinking 42 teeth.

Danish speedlimits.
Town/city: 50km/h
Highway: 80/90km/h
Motorway: 110/130km/h

21/18(150/80) wheels, 16:45:

2th gear(4500rpm): 60 km/h
5th gear(5000rpm): 110 km/h

17/17(180/55), 16:40 is practical the same setup.

If the 21/18 in the real world shows to be to much speed(did i say that)then i could go for the 47 teeth. By the way 42-45-47 is the sizes Dirttrick provides for the big machines. I have used them a lot on the 530 in the Danish enduro championship. And they show a very little sign of wear at 150hours(we race most sandy/muddy tracks). With 47 setup it would be.

2th gear(4500rpm): 56 km/h
5th gear(5000rpm): 105 km/h


A SUSPENSION question. For 3 years ago i got SPS to revalve and change my springs in the fork. They are now .54 and ok plush. He did a great job, but ive become a better, more agressive rider. The bike will in be in the 1200GS weightclass.
Me 78kg
Gear 10kg 88kg
RC8R engine 62kg 6kg
(LC8 engine 56kg)
Gas(22+22+10+10) 64kg 43kg

Standard KTM 950 Adv.(dry) 198kg
KTM 1190 Adv. 203kg Wet 246kg
(These numbers are just mindgames/interwebsearch. Actual numbers will come when done).
I have some .64 in the shop but the thoughts are spinning to get the .70 to make it stiffer for the tarmac. Anyone done the .70 upgrade and would care to tell about it? The bike setup would be 17/17 most of the time.
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Old 02-24-2012, 11:26 AM   #179
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I really like your garage setup with all the natural light
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Old 02-24-2012, 12:29 PM   #180
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I'm freaking out just looking at all that wiring!!
Good thread.
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