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Old 05-16-2012, 09:20 PM   #2806
mouthfulloflake
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rocker end play.

I have checked it.

it is within the factory BMW specs, but leaning towards the high side of the measurements.

But, how would the rocker end play have an influence on the iice air thingy?
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Old 05-16-2012, 09:51 PM   #2807
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Originally Posted by mouthfulloflake View Post

My next idea, to richen the steady state, mid engine RPM fueling is to soak my air filter in bar and chain oil.

Yes, I was thinking you could richen up the idle mixture.


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Old 05-17-2012, 12:31 AM   #2808
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouthfulloflake View Post
rocker end play.

I have checked it.

it is within the factory BMW specs, but leaning towards the high side of the measurements.

But, how would the rocker end play have an influence on the iice air thingy?
As we detailed in OREPAD, large amounts of rocker end play essentially reduces maximal valve lift, which affects the fundamental breathing abilities of the engine. AND it delays the timing when the valves open and makes them close earlier, away from optimal running conditions, which further detunes engine output.

The 'allowable' range is HUGE (0.05 to 0.40mm) and again, as is mentioned in the writeup, tighter tolerances are better.

Of course just because the engine will run with these large end play gaps, doesn't mean it runs near peak performance. And it is possible that this 'detuning' along with other wear could be enough to help mask the IICE Air gains.

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Old 05-17-2012, 06:16 AM   #2809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouthfulloflake View Post

I tried the Ice air with the stock pink plug initially, and it surged just like it did without ice air thingy.

As of about 8pm tonight, it was removed, and sits in a pile, with a techlusion something or other, and some random carb parts.
How did the Techlusion work out?

Re your comments about Surging, that occurs in a different motor operational range than where the IICE Air works. See this chart and this chart, along with the full-blown explanations. (Note: Both charts are the same except the second chart has a Pink box surrounding the Closed Loop operational range.)

The IICE Air operates in the Blue range. That range is generally referred to as Leading Throttle. There is some slight overlap, but Leading Throttle doesn't include Closed Loop operation. And that's where surging happens.


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Old 05-17-2012, 06:46 AM   #2810
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yes I understand that the Ice air does nothing for the surging.

I never did install the techlusion, and likely wont, the surge issue was solved with the steptoe jumper mod in place of the rose colored CCP, fuel economy declined, but surging was eliminated.

as i said last night, removed the ice air completely, rode to work this morning, and I cant tell any difference.

Whenever I decide im not lazy ill adjust the rocker end play, since JJ seems to think that could be partially to blame ( I am doubtful though, about that honestly)

I will tinker with it some more, but so far ive felt no gains with it, I guess I am the only guy out there with a boxer bike that isnt in good enough shape to burn all that extra fuel.
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Old 05-17-2012, 06:54 AM   #2811
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I don't for a second doubt your experience with the device.

I do think the idea of testing your device on another bike or another device on your bike is the only way to rule out a device specific problem. Heck, I need to get to your area soon anyway. We'll do a test thing if I do.
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Old 05-17-2012, 07:01 AM   #2812
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouthfulloflake View Post
yes I understand that the Ice air does nothing for the surging.

I never did install the techlusion, and likely wont, the surge issue was solved with the steptoe jumper mod in place of the rose colored CCP, fuel economy declined, but surging was eliminated.

as i said last night, removed the ice air completely, rode to work this morning, and I cant tell any difference.

Whenever I decide im not lazy ill adjust the rocker end play, since JJ seems to think that could be partially to blame ( I am doubtful though, about that honestly)

I will tinker with it some more, but so far ive felt no gains with it, I guess I am the only guy out there with a boxer bike that isnt in good enough shape to burn all that extra fuel.
The R1100 has a richer map when neither 86 nor 87 are jumpered; so you are running non-cat and Open Loop. I have never measured it but believe that config to be in the 13.8 to 14.0 range based on the CO pot trim spec for European BMWs. That being the case, an additional 6% enrichment from 13.8ish to 13.0ish should not make much if any difference. Perhaps that is the explanation.

If you were running the stock coding plug your mixture would be in the 14.7 range and the chart below shows what would happen? Top chart is open loop no BoosterPlug bottom chart is open loop with booster. The horizontal lines are at 147 and 13.8. The iice air should do the same in the 20C setting.

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Old 05-17-2012, 07:06 AM   #2813
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that would be cool, just let me know when you are thinking of making the trip, ill call into work dead, and tag along maybe.


Quote:
Originally Posted by slowoldguy View Post
I don't for a second doubt your experience with the device.

I do think the idea of testing your device on another bike or another device on your bike is the only way to rule out a device specific problem. Heck, I need to get to your area soon anyway. We'll do a test thing if I do.
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Old 05-17-2012, 07:08 AM   #2814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt View Post

The R1100 has a richer map when neither 86 nor 87 are jumpered; so you are running non-cat and Open Loop. I have never measured it but believe that config to be in the 13.8 to 14.0 range based on the CO pot trim spec for European BMWs. That being the case, an additional 6% enrichment from 13.8ish to 13.0ish should not make much if any difference. Perhaps that is the explanation.
What a coincidence. I was just typing a response to ask if he was running a CO Potentiometer.


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Old 05-17-2012, 07:31 AM   #2815
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Ok Roger, so the 'steptoe' jumper setting is the one you describe? Ive slept since I looked at the plug last, so I cant recall which pins ive got jumpered.

what you are saying makes alot of sense, it explains why the jumper mod eliminated my surging, and it could also explain why im not feeling a difference with the Ice Air.

Ill go back to the stock pink CCP, and then try the Ice air again and see if I can feel a difference then, am i following your logic ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt View Post
The R1100 has a richer map when neither 86 nor 87 are jumpered; so you are running non-cat and Open Loop. I have never measured it but believe that config to be in the 13.8 to 14.0 range based on the CO pot trim spec for European BMWs. That being the case, an additional 6% enrichment from 13.8ish to 13.0ish should not make much if any difference. Perhaps that is the explanation.

If you were running the stock coding plug your mixture would be in the 14.7 range and the chart below shows what would happen? Top chart is open loop no BoosterPlug bottom chart is open loop with booster. The horizontal lines are at 147 and 13.8. The iice air should do the same in the 20C setting.

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Old 05-17-2012, 07:33 AM   #2816
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I dont think so, they dont come on bikes equipped with Catalytic combustors do they?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside View Post
What a coincidence. I was just typing a response to ask if he was running a CO Potentiometer.

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Old 05-17-2012, 07:47 AM   #2817
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouthfulloflake View Post
Ok Roger, so the 'steptoe' jumper setting is the one you describe? Ive slept since I looked at the plug last, so I cant recall which pins ive got jumpered.

what you are saying makes alot of sense, it explains why the jumper mod eliminated my surging, and it could also explain why im not feeling a difference with the Ice Air.

Ill go back to the stock pink CCP, and then try the Ice air again and see if I can feel a difference then, am i following your logic ?
That's a good thought process and you could try it ... but when you reconnect 87, the bike will go into the closed loop mode unless you have unplugged the O2 sensor so you would be changing 2 things at once. But try it and see what you think.

On the 1100s many find the no 86/87 to be a big enough improvement.

If you were running E10 as I was in the plots above, the 10C or 20C setting of the iice air would correct for the effect of E10 and therefore be useful even with the Steptoe mod.

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Old 05-17-2012, 08:12 AM   #2818
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I dont think so, they dont come on bikes equipped with Catalytic combustors do they?
The 1100s have the connector for them, the CO Pot is a common add on.


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Old 05-17-2012, 09:22 AM   #2819
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Not alone...

Nice to see I'm not alone as I too feel zero difference with this device installed. Tried all positions, remove, reinstall, etc... No difference.

Questioned whether I should replace the temp sensor, instead tested it and it appears Good. Had the bike in to the dealer for a service (unusual since I always do my own work) and asked them to check the temp sensor and read the moronic brain. The result? No issues, all appears normal. (I had removed the device first). So my base line is clean. And the comment from the tech was that my GS was one of the better running 1150's he'd worked on in a long time.

I realize that the device is simple as can be, a resistor to alter the signal to the moronic brain. So IF it's a misassembled device, I'd be surprised. If there are 3 bad resistors in the mix, I'd be even more surprised...

I run with StepToe mod btw... Which I DID notice a difference in the way the bike ran, compared to no ccp.

So, all that said, it's MY OPINION that those that are stating glaringly obvious improvements should join the actors guild, or maybe become used car salesmen. And to back up that comment, as Poolside has said many times, this applies to transition changes, NOT steady state... yet people continually state runs smoother at idle, down the road, yada yada ... It should have no bearing on anything but the effect of a slightly larger "accelerator pump squirt".. Correct me if I'm wrong...

Anyway, mine sits on the bench... If some one with a top grade butt dyno wants to buy let me know...

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Old 05-17-2012, 09:32 AM   #2820
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Ok, Roger.

according to this

http://bmwsporttouring.com/ubbthread...08415&page=all


I have 30 and 87a connected.

which I think is the same as the beige plug.

as you said stock setting for non cat bike, with no CO potentiometer installed.

Oh well, I guess that solves the same ( plus the surging issue) instead of the Ice Air.

EDIT, yes Roadrage apparently the beige cat code plug ( or home built jumper) is a better mod for those of us with perfectly running, yet malfunctioning, high mileage, daily ridden oilheads.
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