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Old 08-07-2012, 08:11 AM   #3031
Tessitori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside View Post
Puts a smile on my face as well! Thanks for posting up your report Tessitori.
Is that for the F650GS twin?

Nope, I installed in on my F650GS single! I might have to go out and buy myself a F800GS or a 1200GS just to see what that would feel like!
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Old 08-07-2012, 08:16 AM   #3032
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OK then .......

let's give this little doo-hickie a try. I'm in.
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Old 08-07-2012, 11:12 AM   #3033
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Often Asked Question...Did I Miss The Answer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt View Post
PS,
In your answers to Barry you mentioned, again, Cool and Smooth. I have an IIce Air that i bought from another Inmate (I've run the tests, it drops the temp as you say) but am waiting until Smmoth and Cool. Give us an idea, what's the timing?
RB
JJ [Marketing],

I might have missed the answer to the often asked question: "When will the Smooth and Cool go on sale?"

So when will they? [Even a month, quarter or year would be great!] Ultimately it is what it is...

Thanks,

Phil
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Old 08-07-2012, 02:59 PM   #3034
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I installed my IICE Air over the weekend, and rode around 200 miles with it today. My initial impressions....

The bike seemed to warm up quicker. Not sure why, but there it is. Riding into work this morning on the highway, there was little difference to be felt. Maybe a little smoother from takeoff, but that could easily be the placebo effect.

Different story riding home. Air temperature right around 88, and nothing but familiar backroads. Butt dynos are notorious for their lack of calibration, but the bike certainly felt punchier. 55mph in 6th gear felt smoother, and mileage seemed to be a bit better overall, but it's way too early to tell. Noticeably less stumble when I blip for downshifts, I'm thinking that a really anal-retentive throttle body sync will clear the last of that up.

I pushed the bike as hard as I could with that awful K60 rear tire slip-sliding all over the place, and the motor seemed both stronger and smoother. Again, this could be the placebo effect, or it could be that I was just in a really good mood today, but the bike felt fantastic (other than the "holy-shit-the-swingarm's-loose" feel of the K60).

For shits and giggles, I may throw it on a friend's dyno next week to see if I'm full of it or if the IICE Air is actually making a difference.

Either way, I'm glad I got it, and I'm looking forward to the rest of the system.

Edited to add: If I may make a suggestion though, it would be helpful if there was basic documentation included with the part. Nothing fancy, just a Xeroxed page with pictures stating, "For R Bikes:", etc. A diagram of the jumper positions would be nice too. Yes, I know that information is available here, just sayin'......
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'05Train screwed with this post 08-07-2012 at 03:24 PM
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Old 08-07-2012, 06:25 PM   #3035
johnjen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallowa View Post
JJ [Marketing],

I might have missed the answer to the often asked question: "When will the Smooth and Cool go on sale?"

So when will they? [Even a month, quarter or year would be great!] Ultimately it is what it is...

Thanks,

Phil
I don't believe we have a target date set yet.

JJ
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Old 08-07-2012, 06:48 PM   #3036
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Quote:
Originally Posted by '05Train View Post
I installed my IICE Air over the weekend, and rode around 200 miles with it today. My initial impressions....

The bike seemed to warm up quicker. Not sure why, but there it is. Riding into work this morning on the highway, there was little difference to be felt. Maybe a little smoother from takeoff, but that could easily be the placebo effect.

Different story riding home. Air temperature right around 88, and nothing but familiar backroads. Butt dynos are notorious for their lack of calibration, but the bike certainly felt punchier. 55mph in 6th gear felt smoother, and mileage seemed to be a bit better overall, but it's way too early to tell. Noticeably less stumble when I blip for downshifts, I'm thinking that a really anal-retentive throttle body sync will clear the last of that up.

I pushed the bike as hard as I could with that awful K60 rear tire slip-sliding all over the place, and the motor seemed both stronger and smoother. Again, this could be the placebo effect, or it could be that I was just in a really good mood today, but the bike felt fantastic (other than the "holy-shit-the-swingarm's-loose" feel of the K60).

For shits and giggles, I may throw it on a friend's dyno next week to see if I'm full of it or if the IICE Air is actually making a difference.

Either way, I'm glad I got it, and I'm looking forward to the rest of the system.

Edited to add: If I may make a suggestion though, it would be helpful if there was basic documentation included with the part. Nothing fancy, just a Xeroxed page with pictures stating, "For R Bikes:", etc. A diagram of the jumper positions would be nice too. Yes, I know that information is available here, just sayin'......
Thanks for the report, Train.

Regarding the jumper settings photocopy, in the meantime maybe you can print out the illustration?
It looks like a big picture, but it prints out business card size.

As you pointed out, the illustration below is linked from the first post of this thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...7#post16533527




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Old 08-07-2012, 07:15 PM   #3037
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside View Post
Thanks for the report, Train.

Regarding the jumper settings photocopy, in the meantime maybe you can print out the illustration?
It looks like a big picture, but it prints out business card size.

As you pointed out, the illustration below is linked from the first post of this thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...7#post16533527



I copied this image to MS Word and then scaled it into a variety of sizes and printed out the page...
by luck one of them was the right size to fit inside the lid of the unit ... so it's pasted in there for future reference....
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Old 08-07-2012, 07:31 PM   #3038
'05Train
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRWooden View Post
I copied this image to MS Word and then scaled it into a variety of sizes and printed out the page...
by luck one of them was the right size to fit inside the lid of the unit ... so it's pasted in there for future reference....
That's a heckuva idea.
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Old 08-07-2012, 07:35 PM   #3039
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRWooden View Post

I copied this image to MS Word and then scaled it into a variety of sizes and printed out the page...
by luck one of them was the right size to fit inside the lid of the unit ... so it's pasted in there for future reference....
Inside the cap? I would need a jeweler's loupe to read it! 

An easy way to remember it is, the jumper pointing to the wires is 20.
Clockwise is more, counter-clockwise is less. Like a radio volume knob.

Although you can, typically you do not need to adjust it, except when using it with the IICE Cool.
Having said that, I don't want to steer you away from trying the different settings.


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Old 08-07-2012, 07:56 PM   #3040
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Quote:
Originally Posted by '05Train View Post

Butt dynos are notorious for their lack of calibration, but the bike certainly felt punchier. 55mph in 6th gear felt smoother, and mileage seemed to be a bit better overall, but it's way too early to tell. Noticeably less stumble when I blip for downshifts...

I pushed the bike as hard as I could with that awful K60 rear tire slip-sliding all over the place, and the motor seemed both stronger and smoother. Again, this could be the placebo effect, or it could be that I was just in a really good mood today, but the bike felt fantastic

For shits and giggles, I may throw it on a friend's dyno next week to see if I'm full of it or if the IICE Air is actually making a difference.
It most definitely makes a difference. Though a dyno isn't going to show you the new found part-throttle crispness and refinement provided by the IICE Air. The wide-open-throttle dyno run being the blunt instrument of the motor development world.

Trust your butt dyno. The long muscles of the upper leg are a very precise gauge of relative changes in acceleration.


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Old 08-07-2012, 08:13 PM   #3041
'05Train
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside View Post
It most definitely makes a difference. Though a dyno isn't going to show you the new found part-throttle crispness and refinement provided by the IICE Air. The wide-open-throttle dyno run being the blunt instrument of the motor development world.

Trust your butt dyno. The long muscles of the upper leg are a very precise gauge of relative changes in acceleration.

A dyno will show the AFR/Lambda, and that's certainly not a blunt instrument. An overlay with and without the offset should show what that 20* is doing.

Regardless, I'm not unhappy with it.
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Old 08-07-2012, 08:39 PM   #3042
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Quote:
Originally Posted by '05Train View Post

A dyno will show the AFR/Lambda, and that's certainly not a blunt instrument. An overlay with and without the offset should show what that 20* is doing.

Regardless, I'm not unhappy with it.
Thanks Train, I'm getting you are pleased, and I wholeheartedly support the testing. I'm just calibrating the common perception of the tools is all.

A Lambda cell is perhaps the bluntest of all instruments when used in a dynamic environment. But that isn't the common perception is it.

The desire to know the dynamic instantaneous Air Fuel Ratio is strong. So strong that it creates a belief that fitting a Lambda cell to the exhaust will provide the desired dynamic readings.

From your ride report, the operating conditions where you mention feeling improvements are occurring at dynamic throttle and part throttle. It isn't possible to connect those dots with a dyno run.

But the butt dyno, as you have seen, is easily capable of detecting relative dynamic changes in acceleration.


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Old 08-08-2012, 04:28 AM   #3043
roger 04 rt
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Since 05Train likes the product and has some dyno time, isn't there some test that could be devised with a Brake dynamometer to show the effect that's being felt?
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Old 08-08-2012, 05:39 AM   #3044
'05Train
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Yeah, I'm unclear on that, as I've been tuning bikes and cars at part-throttle for years.

The IICE Air works during open-loop only, which means that you ought to be able to see the effect it's having on AFR/Lambda at WOT, as well as at part throttle.
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Old 08-08-2012, 07:04 AM   #3045
roger 04 rt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by '05Train View Post
Yeah, I'm unclear on that, as I've been tuning bikes and cars at part-throttle for years.

The IICE Air works during open-loop only, which means that you ought to be able to see the effect it's having on AFR/Lambda at WOT, as well as at part throttle.
AFR is relatively easy to measure with a wideband O2.

Here is a plot of AFR with and without an IAT shifting device set at 20C. It can be measured in Open Loop. The top plot is without the IAT shift and the bottom is with 20C shift. The red dotted line is at 14.7 the blue dotted line at 13.8. Trying to measure it after the bike has run Closed Loop is harder.

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