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Old 08-09-2012, 03:05 AM   #3061
johnjen
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Now I don't want this to come off wrong or be misinterpreted etc. But you guys do know that Poolside designs these systems, from the ground up, right?

He knows about this stuff from the inside out because in order to design a functional EFI system you have to know what to expect from the inputs, and how those inputs represent/reflect reality.

That being said he also hasn't taken the time to write up a complete description of everything he talks about. So he condenses the explanation, which also leaves out a huge amount of info. To design a system as complex as an engine management computer, and write the digital code to make it work, requires that you understand how it functions under all possible operating conditions, and all possible (and not possible) failure mode conditions, while still operating safely and passing all regulations including emissions.

So in other words, what he's posting is coming from a degree of understanding which is beyond what he has written about here in this thread. There simply isn't time to attempt to lay it all out in readily understandable terms. Even the effort to explain it techno jargon would be an enormous undertaking, but then many simply wouldn't understand it then either. And what would be the point in that?

And again I hope that this doesn't come across as being snobbish etc. but he really does grasp this shit to a level and a degree, all the way down to the nit picking details, because well that's what it takes.

JJ
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Old 08-09-2012, 09:46 AM   #3062
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What JJ said

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjen View Post
...you guys do know that Poolside designs these systems, from the ground up, right?
In addition to having the patience of a frickin' saint?
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Old 08-09-2012, 04:48 PM   #3063
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JJ, I can only speak for myself, but I'm really pleased with what Poolside's created. No antipathy about that on my part, I can assure you.

I understand how fuel injection works, I understand how the IICE Air works, and I'm glad that Roger posted his chart to clearly illustrate that.
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:31 PM   #3064
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrysingfeenix View Post
In addition to having the patience of a frickin' saint?
Yeah there is that too

JJ
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:58 PM   #3065
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Quote:
Originally Posted by '05Train View Post
JJ, I can only speak for myself, but I'm really pleased with what Poolside's created. No antipathy about that on my part, I can assure you.

I understand how fuel injection works, I understand how the IICE Air works, and I'm glad that Roger posted his chart to clearly illustrate that.
Yeah I understand.

But I was attempting to point out that there is a major difference between understanding how they work and what it takes to design and make a system work from the ground up. And I too, thought I knew what was going on inside the unit as well, until he started to explain the specifics to me. I wound up throwing most of what I thought I knew, out the window.

And during all of this I'm furiously figur'n on how to 'splain all of this without sounding like a know it all, because I know just a little bit more than just enough to be dangerous. Which is doubly precarious.

JJ
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Old 08-09-2012, 09:24 PM   #3066
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrysingfeenix View Post

In addition to having the patience of a frickin' saint?
I don't know, I'm pretty sure all you folks are the saints. Putting up with these delivery and development times and all. It means a lot to me I tell you what.


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Old 08-09-2012, 09:31 PM   #3067
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjen View Post

And I too, thought I knew what was going on inside the unit as well, until he started to explain the specifics to me. I wound up throwing most of what I thought I knew, out the window.
Your talking about the ECU, right?

And during all of this I'm furiously figur'n on how to 'splain all of this without sounding like a know it all, because I know just a little bit more than just enough to be dangerous. Which is doubly precarious.
I don't know, you're a lot better than the average Marketing division. 


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Old 08-09-2012, 09:42 PM   #3068
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjen View Post

And I too, thought I knew what was going on inside the unit as well, until he started to explain the specifics to me. I wound up throwing most of what I thought I knew, out the window.
Your talking about the ECU, right?

And during all of this I'm furiously figur'n on how to 'splain all of this without sounding like a know it all, because I know just a little bit more than just enough to be dangerous. Which is doubly precarious.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside View Post
I don't know, you're a lot better than the average Marketing division. 
Well I couldn't throw out any of the marketing knowledge to make room for the inner workings on the EFI, so I had to compromise and throw out all the old EFI info along with purging some other stuff to make enough room but I can't remember what else I tossed anymore… I think.

Well no, that's not right either…

It's all just a big blur now…

JJ
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Old 08-10-2012, 12:58 AM   #3069
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205 205 205

In other news I still like mine but my fuel economy seems inversely proportional to my fun twist mechanism... That is all. having way too much fun on vacation to do math or even remember where the recorded data is at to do the math with. Winning!
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Old 08-16-2012, 08:48 AM   #3070
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside View Post
I don't know, I'm pretty sure all you folks are the saints. Putting up with these delivery and development times and all. It means a lot to me I tell you what.


What is the latest on IICE COOL?
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Old 08-16-2012, 04:32 PM   #3071
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjen View Post
Let me ++ on the GS-911 as a means of checking the operation of the IICE Air. But if you are handy with a DVM and know what you are looking for you can check the resistance of the output as well.

But let me add that these units are encased in carbomite and short of a fire or bomb going off there is no way they are going to "somehow flipped back to the setting that does not alter the throughput signal"… (just kidding about the carbomite but it might as well be…)

JJ
I thought there was a way for the user to change the settings on the device somehow using a computer or something but maybe I misunderstood. I was wondering if that guy that was not seeing the expected results had somehow changed something or his particular device was faulty. However the devices are electronic components right? They sometimes fail or are faulty right?

I am a software architect and follow the mantra of trust but verify. A key part of my job is isolating issues which usually means making sure the individual parts are doing their respective jobs. I thought that surely there is a way to give the device a given input and see that it is in fact modifying that signal on the output as expected. Such a test would certainly rule out issues with the device doing it's job correctly and point to issues with his bike using those modified values properly.

Anyway, I was just curious. I am always curious if nothing else, lol.
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Old 08-16-2012, 04:42 PM   #3072
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Oh wait, I see... changing the setting is done with jumpers. I was guessing settings were changed by sending commands to the device. I was not on this thread when I posted... I take it someone moved my post over here or I got confused about the thread I was in. I was posting in response to the guy whining about his devise in the vender section... lol.
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Old 08-16-2012, 04:56 PM   #3073
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DriftDragon View Post

Oh wait, I see... changing the setting is done with jumpers. I was guessing settings were changed by sending commands to the device. I was posting in response to the guy [posting] about his devise in the vender section...
That's it DD, the jumper changes between 4 different settings. One setting is the stock Air Temp Sensor, the other three settings use IICE Air components. It is highly unlikely that any of the four sensors (1 on the bike, and 3 in the IICE Air) are not working, let alone all of them.

I'm local to the guy you're referring to. We'll be getting together at some point so I can take a look at the IICE Air, and his bike. I'm bringing a GS-911 and a netbook.


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Old 08-17-2012, 11:13 AM   #3074
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So I read the techno posts a bit closer and am much more edumacated now... but all that did was giv eme more questions... lol. By the way, the tech explanations are great!

The one thing that was a little vaque was your answer on the Power Commander... So I still wonder... does a power commander conflict with the ICEAir or would it still make sense to use a power commander as well? If I understand it right the power commander could be used to add additional fine tuning to what the ICEAir does? I ask because I am considering an after market exhaust and see some advising to get a power commander as well to take advantage of the exhaust. However I also heard it's better to let the onboard computer adapt to the new exhaust on it's on so I am getting conflicting info. The onboard system does do some internal tuning over time right?

Or is it that the Power Commander works mostly in the steady throttle function area? I am curious which of the functional areas the power commander plays a role in.

One other question of curiosity... not that it's too essential but I noticed the box for tip out was not colored... does IceAir not impact that function?
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Old 08-27-2012, 07:57 PM   #3075
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My IICEE-AIRE continues to perform very well.

It's especially appreciated for engine-lugging lane-splitting on local freeways.
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