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Old 11-29-2010, 08:18 AM   #1
LasseNC OP
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Airhead: How much current across the poles to turn the starter?

Okay, weird question I know, so here is the story.

I have been offered to go to Africa on a motorbike trip and in that regards I need to part with my R60/6.

I live about 100 miles away from my bike, but luck would have it that an interested buyer lives only a few miles from my bike, and I had to go there today anyway.

The bike hasn't been started for 3 months or so and I have had no charger hooked up to it.

Sounds like the relay is clicking away and the starter turns slow, like half a turn sometimes.

Before I put on the charger: 11.58 volts

After it charged a while: 12.43 volts

Still sounds like the relay clicks.

Also tried jumpercables from a car battery to my battery, which did not but clicks from the relay.

How much current is needed? 12.6-12.7? I am asking this because I am going back to my home this evening and would like to do one last attempt so I can call the buyer and let him know that it starts up now.

Kind regards, Lasse
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Old 11-29-2010, 02:56 PM   #2
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Amps

It isn't he volts as much as it is the amps. The voltage is an indicator of the batteries' health, but the starter puts a serious load that requires a healthy battery. Check that all the connections are good and clean. If it still has issues, it is most likely the battery not having the capacity to spin the starter. An R60 should not be too hard to spin, but if the battery has been left discharged for a while, it rarely can rcover well.
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Old 11-29-2010, 03:04 PM   #3
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You need to leave the charger on until the battery is fully charged. Probably overnight at least. Then try it. While the battery is charging, clean all the connections. If it doesn't spin freely the next day you probably have a bad battery.
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Old 12-04-2010, 05:13 AM   #4
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Had it to 14.3volts with a new battery and new acid, charged overnight still lots of clicking.

The charger is only doing 0,6 mA though, so I switched charger to one that is variable from 0 to 4, so now it is charging with 1amp.
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Old 12-04-2010, 08:05 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LasseNC View Post
Had it to 14.3volts with a new battery and new acid, charged overnight still lots of clicking.

The charger is only doing 0,6 mA though, so I switched charger to one that is variable from 0 to 4, so now it is charging with 1amp.
It's obviously not the battery.
14.3 volts is plenty.
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Old 12-04-2010, 08:10 AM   #6
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It's obviously not the battery.
14.3 volts is plenty.
The volts is up, but the capacity needs too as well.

Edit: The clicking from the relay is obvious, could be a dead relay, checked the grounds.
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Old 12-04-2010, 08:34 AM   #7
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Those contacts on the /6 relay can get really corroded. Be sure to make sure they're bright and shiny.
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Old 12-04-2010, 08:36 AM   #8
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Those contacts on the /6 relay can get really corroded. Be sure to make sure they're bright and shiny.
Relay in the starter? Dumb question I know, but are the relays in the starter /6 specific? Or are you simply referring to another relay which I don't know about? :)
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Old 12-04-2010, 12:02 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by LasseNC View Post
Relay in the starter? Dumb question I know, but are the relays in the starter /6 specific? Or are you simply referring to another relay which I don't know about? :)
I'd gotten the idea previously that your relay was clicking.

Now it's true the starter solenoid is a relay as well, and I guess you could have been talking about that (not knowing the terminology).

The starter relay is mounted to the left side of the frame under the gas tank. Listen for the click when pressing the starter button and you'll find it. It's got about 8 wires running to it.

If it's the starter that's clicking, you might have bigger problems. For one, DO NOT press the start button if the starter is clicking. What that does is arc the contacts of the solenoid which corrodes it and makes it difficult to flow electricity. You may now have (on top of the original problem) a solenoid that needs rebuilding.

When the starter clicks, it means the starter isn't getting enough power to turn over the engine. When the starter begins to draw the amperage, the current to the solenoid drops which allows it to relax, which cuts the power to the starter motor. But when it relaxes, there's again enough power to activate the solenoid (without the starter motor on line) and the cycle begins all over again. And so it goes, over and over.

The solution is to find out where the current got lost. Is the battery weak? Even though it checks out at 13 or 14 volts, it could have low capacity and not deliver enough current to turn over the motor.

Or there could be bad connections - maybe a bad ground cable, or the large positive feed from the battery, or the leads themselves. Make sure all connections are bright and shiny.

Also, the starter grounds through it's mounting. Make sure it's tight and clean.
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Old 12-04-2010, 12:08 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wirespokes View Post
I'd gotten the idea previously that your relay was clicking.

Now it's true the starter solenoid is a relay as well, and I guess you could have been talking about that (not knowing the terminology).

The starter relay is mounted to the left side of the frame under the gas tank. Listen for the click when pressing the starter button and you'll find it. It's got about 8 wires running to it.

If it's the starter that's clicking, you might have bigger problems. For one, DO NOT press the start button if the starter is clicking. What that does is arc the contacts of the solenoid which corrodes it and makes it difficult to flow electricity. You may now have (on top of the original problem) a solenoid that needs rebuilding.

When the starter clicks, it means the starter isn't getting enough power to turn over the engine. When the starter begins to draw the amperage, the current to the solenoid drops which allows it to relax, which cuts the power to the starter motor. But when it relaxes, there's again enough power to activate the solenoid (without the starter motor on line) and the cycle begins all over again. And so it goes, over and over.

The solution is to find out where the current got lost. Is the battery weak? Even though it checks out at 13 or 14 volts, it could have low capacity and not deliver enough current to turn over the motor.

Or there could be bad connections - maybe a bad ground cable, or the large positive feed from the battery, or the leads themselves. Make sure all connections are bright and shiny.

Also, the starter grounds through it's mounting. Make sure it's tight and clean.
That was a very fulfilling reply, and I am confident that I understood it all.

The clicking is not coming from the relay mounted on the frame, but from the solenoid on the starter, which you suggested could corrode it. Is it dismantable, or a no-go?
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Old 12-04-2010, 02:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LasseNC View Post
That was a very fulfilling reply, and I am confident that I understood it all.

The clicking is not coming from the relay mounted on the frame, but from the solenoid on the starter, which you suggested could corrode it. Is it dismantable, or a no-go?
If you are resonably handy, you should be able to take it apart and clean it of corrosion or crud. Before doing that though, I'd try jump starting the bike, as I am still betting on a bad battery - there's not a ton of room for standard jumper cables and such so be careful.
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Old 12-04-2010, 02:25 PM   #12
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If you are resonably handy, you should be able to take it apart and clean it of corrosion or crud. Before doing that though, I'd try jump starting the bike, as I am still betting on a bad battery - there's not a ton of room for standard jumper cables and such so be careful.
Well I bought a new battery, I might not have made that clear enough :)

We did try jumpstarting too, to no avail, so the starter COULD be the culprit?
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Old 12-04-2010, 02:38 PM   #13
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Well I bought a new battery, I might not have made that clear enough :)

We did try jumpstarting too, to no avail, so the starter COULD be the culprit?
Or the motor is frozen.
It happens.
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Old 12-04-2010, 02:43 PM   #14
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It has done some revolutions, so its not frozen, but the revs weren't as fast as I liked, which leads me to a bad earth as I have read another user has had problems with on the board here.

Edit:

Will try taking out the plugs and see what happens.
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Old 12-04-2010, 03:46 PM   #15
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When my old Guzzi had a dodgy starter solenoid, I used to carry a spanner tucked into my boot which I would use to short across those big terminals on the solenoid to start the bike.

It's a little harder to get at on the BM, but if you can do it, it might help isolate the problem.
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