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Old 01-13-2005, 06:35 PM   #16
Guzz
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Just want to add that sometimes you may need to ream out the hole it bit more than 2 strokes. If you notice that it takes an excessive amount of effort to put the string plug in, you might cut the string plug in half and you have to start over. If so, like I said before, just ream out the tire a bit more.

I had this the last time I had to patch my tire, but I used the stock reamer from under the seat. And went through 2 of the plugs that came with the bike (they suck BTW).
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Old 01-13-2005, 07:19 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside
Progressive Suspension plugs




I took a look at the Prog. Susp. tire plug link, RC. This is the first time I've seen them. How are they installed?
They come with a very small tool that doubles as a reamer and inserter. Its the same thing really you just ream out the hole and then push the plug in. They come with rubber cement but it is optional because they have the red goop under a plastic peel that you remove before inserting. Once installed and the tire is heat cycled a few times they acutally melt into the tire and become one with it. After a few hundred miles you can't even find where you plugged it.

Great write up though. I am going to try the string type to see which I like better. I have some extra wheels for my VFR that I keep track rubber on. I have a worn our rear on my extra wheels that I could practice with and make some holes in.
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Old 01-13-2005, 08:42 PM   #18
scooteraug02
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Here is the type of patch I think the tire manufacturers recommend.

From Dunlop:
Some punctures in motorcycle tires may be repaired.

Dunlop recommends only permanent plug-patch repairs of small (maximum 1/4-inch diameter) tread area punctures from within the dismounted tire by a qualified tire repair shop or motorcycle dealer. Never perform an exterior repair and never use an inner tube as a substitute for a proper repair. Speed should not exceed 50 mph for the first 24 hours after repair and the repaired tire should never be used over 75 mph. Check inflation pressure after tire cools for at least three (3) hours following run-in, or sooner if air loss is suspected.

No form of temporary repair should be attempted because secondary damage caused by a penetrating object may not be detected and tire or tube deflation may occur at a later date.

Dunlop does not recommend the use of liquid sealants. These are a form of temporary repair, and they may adversely affect ply material and mask secondary damage caused by a penetrating object. Reliance upon sealants can result in sudden tire failure and accident.
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Old 01-13-2005, 08:51 PM   #19
Andrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poolside
And sure, I realize that tire patching/plugging is a potentially volatile topic.
You want volatile, let's start talking about rubber cement! Anyway, I must be missing something, but how does the string stay in the tire when you pull out the insertion tool? Seems like you slip the string through the eye of the needle, but retracting the needle will pull out the string...
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Old 01-14-2005, 12:25 AM   #20
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A half a twist of the insertion tool usually does the trick... Well it works on the insertion tool I use.

I also like to leave at least an inch of the rope hanging out so I can move the rope around in the hole. Sometimes I even jam some of the rope back in the hole to help seal it. Especially if the hole isn't nice and round. A small bladed screwdrivers is my tool of choice...

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johnjen screwed with this post 01-14-2005 at 12:34 AM
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Old 01-14-2005, 12:28 AM   #21
deangs
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Andrew, if you look closely the end of the needle is open. It looks like it is an eye but it actually just comes to a point so it can be easily inserted into the hole so when you pull the tool out the string slips through the opening. You can get this kit at any auto parts store like Kragen, keep one in your cage too if you have one, I do.

Awesome post by the way.
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Old 01-14-2005, 02:20 AM   #22
WrongJohn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scooteraug02

Here is the type of patch I think the tire manufacturers recommend.

From Dunlop:
Some punctures in motorcycle tires may be repaired.

{blah blah blah blah}
Sounds like Dunlop is spewing out a bad mix of engineer and lawyer talk to me.

I have used patch from within plug&patch type permanent patches extensively on 4x4's and had no problems provided the damage was such where a patch could do, even if it couldn't (ply damage) I have used them to get to somewhere were I could get new rubber.

I also use the string type patches on off-road and 4x4 autos. One of the tires on my 4x4 had a string patch in it for all but the first week of it's 40,000+ miles. It held air as well as any of the others which is very well.

The key is to know what your fixing, and how bad the damage is BEFORE you start patching things. But if you don't have a spare, and you need that tire to hold air, sometimes your going to patch a tire that is beyond permanent repair so you can get back to civilization where you can get a new tire that will be highway safe. Be it strings or plugs, I would carry a patch kit on my adventure bike if I am going to take it any further from home than the local 7/11 mini-mart. My preference is strings, and when possible to skip the string and do proper inspection and patch from the inside.
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Old 01-14-2005, 03:45 AM   #23
OzRob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WrongJohn
Sounds like Dunlop is spewing out a bad mix of engineer and lawyer talk to me.

I have used patch from within plug&patch type permanent patches extensively on 4x4's and had no problems provided the damage was such where a patch could do, even if it couldn't (ply damage) I have used them to get to somewhere were I could get new rubber.


The key is to know what your fixing, and how bad the damage is BEFORE you start patching things. But if you don't have a spare, and you need that tire to hold air, sometimes your going to patch a tire that is beyond permanent repair so you can get back to civilization where you can get a new tire that will be highway safe. Be it strings or plugs, I would carry a patch kit on my adventure bike if I am going to take it any further from home than the local 7/11 mini-mart. My preference is strings, and when possible to skip the string and do proper inspection and patch from the inside.
String plugs are the best for temporary repairs out in the bush; you can carry at least 10 of them in the tool kit of the GS (and you don't even need glue if you don't have any)., ever tried breaking the bead, to fit a patch from the inside of the tyre 500KM from nowhere and pump it back up with a bycycle pump,?
I once repaired a puncture using the string patch and I rode on the tyre for 13,000KM, I inspected the string plug when I eventually replaced the tyre and on the inside it was held fast to the inside of the tyre, but if you feel like you can fit a patch from the inside when you get home,
OR if you have lots if $$$$$$$ buy a new tyre.
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Old 01-14-2005, 04:35 AM   #24
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I agree the excess MUST be trimmed off. Other wise you may find yourself fixing the same flat three times on the way to the airport at 5:30 in the morning.

DAMHIK

Great write up........
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Old 01-14-2005, 06:17 AM   #25
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Helpful post. Thanks for taking the time, Poolside. Gonna add some to my kit.

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Old 01-14-2005, 06:54 AM   #26
WrongJohn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OzRob
I once repaired a puncture using the string patch and I rode on the tyre for 13,000KM, I inspected the string plug when I eventually replaced the tyre and on the inside it was held fast to the inside of the tyre, but if you feel like you can fit a patch from the inside when you get home,
OR if you have lots if $$$$$$$ buy a new tyre.
My point was you do one or the other, you don't do both. The more you mess with an area of already disrupted tire the more chance you have of problems like a sudden catastrophic failure of the plug/patch/weld, blistering, or delamination (no fun in a SUV or Car, I suspect that much worse on two wheels).

I would also heed the lawyer's (or engineer's) advice and take it easy in terms of speed on a patched tire for quite some time before deciding it's good, and inspect it religiously even after declaring it good.

You string it in the field, or if it can wait, you wait until you have the time to pull the tire off the rim and do the internal patch alternative. You don't do both. Both are effectively permanent if they are done correctly and the damage is contained. I do generally think the internal patches hold air better and keep the belts and rubber around them from being further contaminated, but it's just my antidotal opinion. Once you disrupt the chemistry of the rubber (around the belts) with one I wouldn't dare mess with that particular spot on the tire again, particularly on a radial. If I am out in the wilds, there is NO FREAKING WAY I am pulling the tire off the rim unless I absolutely, positively have to; especially, on a motorcycle where the wheel is going to have to come off the bike to effect a repair (more trouble than pulling a wheel off no-fender buggy.

I had to do that with a dune buggy once-- without the right tools. I wound up doing a pretty good patch to a rear tire with the force that holds the universe together-- duct tape, to patch what was almost a 3 inch cut in the sidewall. It held well enough to keep about 12 pounds of air in the tire which was more than enough to limp back to camp where I had a spare tire and tire irons. But it was a total PITA getting the bead over the rim with only a couple of box-end wrenches and a multi-screw driver, (I only did one half) and even more fun getting it back under. Shortly thereafter, I started carrying a set of tire irons in the tool box, and a spare loose rear tire (in addition to a spare front mounted and inflated.)

Both front and rear used the same wheels, and the size difference wasn't that great. But if I had another serious cut to a rear again, I wanted to be able to do something about it that didn't involve serious McGyver'ing. Fronts were where I had most cuts and punctures on that buggy (which is why I carried an inflated and mounted front spare) until I went with uniform sized BFG TA's all the way around. I lost some ability in terms of rear floatation, and handling, but the TA's could take a lot more punishment and it simplified things in terms of tire failures a lot. I don't think I had any failures with that buggy while it was on TA's now that I think of it. I haven't had a puncture on my tahoe since going with TA-KO's either, except one 3" lag-bolt I picked up in down-town Ballard. I am hoping I can find an equally durable, capable and rugged tire for my future GS. Looks like I can get durable and raod capable, or rugged and generally-capable, but not all at the same time. I think I am going to wind up with tourances regularly on the bike, and keep some TKC's handy.

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Old 01-15-2005, 12:34 AM   #27
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I can't believe that someone would post a picture of a Dog penis disection in on a motorcycle board. Gross.

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