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Old 10-04-2012, 10:45 AM   #2776
SourKraut
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Originally Posted by (none) View Post
Sure there is. look at the diagram, water flows around the valves
I take it back then. I still don't like wethead.
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:47 AM   #2777
JimVonBaden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SourKraut View Post
Except there is no water in the heads. It is a waterboxer.


Of course there is, did you look at the diagrams? The water jacket surrounds the valves. Where do you suppose the valves are?

Jim

Edit, posted too soon!
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:51 AM   #2778
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Sorry if I missed it but is that limited cooling just for extra horsepower and emissions? I know that has been the discussion but that seems to be the minimum.

BMW site claims 57 mpg for the water cooled GS and 51 for the air cooled GSA.

Liquid cooled R1200GS
Fuel consumption per 100 km at constant 90 km/h 57 mpg at a constant 56 mph (4.1 l)
R1200GS Adventure
Fuel consumption per 100 km at constant 120 km/h 51 mpg, at a constant 55 mph

Wet clutch up front, no alternator belt should be low maintenance. No more splitting it in half to lube the spline.
Rubber hoses these days on cars do 10 years 100,000+ miles so reliability shouldn't be a problem. Dropping it on the radiator will be as usual.

More horse same Final Drive (right angle transmission)? Flipping it over must even out the wear.
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:58 AM   #2779
JimVonBaden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scooteraug02 View Post
Sorry if I missed it but is that limited cooling just for extra horsepower and emissions? I know that has been the discussion but that seems to be the minimum.

BMW site claims 57 mpg for the water cooled GS and 51 for the air cooled GSA.

Liquid cooled R1200GS
Fuel consumption per 100 km at constant 90 km/h 57 mpg at a constant 56 mph (4.1 l)
R1200GS Adventure
Fuel consumption per 100 km at constant 120 km/h 51 mpg, at a constant 55 mph

Wet clutch up front, no alternator belt should be low maintenance. No more splitting it in half to lube the spline.
Rubber hoses these days on cars do 10 years 100,000+ miles so reliability shouldn't be a problem. Dropping it on the radiator will be as usual.

More horse same Final Drive (right angle transmission)? Flipping it over must even out the wear.

The valve area is the hottest part of the head/motor. The cooling there allows for more advanced timing, better power and mileage while maintaining emmissions.

As for the FD. It looks similar to the old one, but is designed to handle the heavier K1600 series, and the much higher HP. That, and the use of a single type of FD makes it an obvious choice.

Jim
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:09 AM   #2780
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While we are waiting for them to get to the dealerships they should send one over and schedule it to be ridden 24/7 365. They could make it into a big promotional tour and it would cost less than traditional advertising. Plus they could discover any weaknesses early. Someone set it up.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:14 AM   #2781
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Why would they drop the power output for heated gear and such. I hate to question the mother ship but that doesn't seem like a good idea.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:19 AM   #2782
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Why would they drop the power output for heated gear and such. I hate to question the mother ship but that doesn't seem like a good idea.
I suspect that they've made changes to the bike to reduce its base electrical load. It sounds like they're really leveraging LEDs, which helps. Note that the turn signals, brake and tail and low beam are LEDs, which use far less power than incandescents.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:21 AM   #2783
SidewinderX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scooteraug02 View Post
BMW site claims 57 mpg for the water cooled GS and 51 for the air cooled GSA.

Im getting 50 out of my 12GSA with 8.8 gallons... I cant imagine 57 Mpg with an 8.8 gallon tank......
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:25 AM   #2784
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Originally Posted by burbansk View Post
Like it or not, it is the future. Which makes my 2000 R 1150 GS a priceless work of art. I think that I will keep the old girl and start saving for a new one. Has anyone heard of a price range yet?
I read somewhere that base price will be at or below current base prices....but there are lots of options, so I'm sure it will add up.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:30 AM   #2785
EJ_92606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbasa View Post
I suspect that they've made changes to the bike to reduce its base electrical load. It sounds like they're really leveraging LEDs, which helps. Note that the turn signals, brake and tail and low beam are LEDs, which use far less power than incandescents.
I don't think the turn signals are LED...if you see LED signals in some of the pictures it is because they are accessories. Low Beam LED is optional. High Beam is also LED.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:33 AM   #2786
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Somewhere in the specs I read something about the canbus system being compartmentalized. That might be a hint as to why they can lower the overall output. Electrical guru's chime in...


Quote:
Originally Posted by SpEd View Post
Why would they drop the power output for heated gear and such. I hate to question the mother ship but that doesn't seem like a good idea.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:49 AM   #2787
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Better mpg is definately another byproduct of watercooling.
While the old air/oiled hex/camheads ran at around 110 hp at their max cooling abilities (even if R1200S/HP-S made 122/133hp) the new watercooled engines will be able to run even leaner (more mpg) while making more power without reliability issues due to better cooling abilities of water compared to oil.
Looking at the fact that new new boxer-twin is pretty much a 1/3 of a Porsche 911 engine it is safe to assume that future variants will make up to 150hp safely...
Maybe we will see hydraulic lifters in the future,too.
The only flaw I see in the design of the new GS that the side mounted pipe still robs valuable space of one saddle bag.
I don't know if I ever sell my TB-GS-ADV but I definately know that I will get a new water-boxer...
I already love it...
Yesterday I hated the looks but it did not take long to warm up to it...
More power,no alternator belt,no expensive clutch/seal issues,what's not to love...I'm such a whore...
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:03 PM   #2788
LowOnFuel
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Now it looks like the bike will need to be split in half to replace the alternator instead of the clutch. Am I seeing this right?

LowOnFuel screwed with this post 10-04-2012 at 12:15 PM Reason: fix fu
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:23 PM   #2789
Boxer-lust
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I think you see that wrong because there is a cover that should be easy to access/remove after the plastic tank is off...
Also no alternator belt is definately another big plus !
Like I said all I can see for improvement to make it a "no maintenance engine" like in the cars of today where you only have to replace fluids,filters,sparkplug sans the belt are hydraulic lifters or direct injection for even better mpg.
But if you eber tried the new Scion GT-86 or Subaru BRZ and how slow that thing revs even blipping the throttle I don't know if DI is a good idea...
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:26 PM   #2790
g_e_young
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxer-lust View Post
After looking at the pictures and let it all sink in I must say I like the looks of the new GS as the new engine is as good of a design for a motorcycle engine as it gets !
The 2 cylinder boxer was always a perfect motorcycle engine for everything but roadracing purposes with it's balance,low center of gravity,no crankshaft gyro to affect handling in a negative way,ease of maintenance and unique ability to protect bike and rider in case of mishap.
Now they made the intake runners straighter to get more power and put the clutch where it doesn't cause expensive bills anymore if it needs to be replaced.
No alternator belt anymore that can break or needs to be replaced.
As for accessability it sits under a cover that should beeasy to access after the tank is taken off.
As for the valve adjustment it looks like the cams have to come off because the followers don't slide to the side anymore like in the camheads.But even this should be easy as no timing chain has to come of with the gears driving the cams.
Should be a great engine powering a 135hp/nm R1200RS in the near future...
My guess is that a water-boxer R1200RT and R1200GS-ADV are next for 2014 out in autumn of 2013...
Good points. BMW spent some serious $ engineering this thing. Can't wait to ride it.
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