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Old 02-01-2013, 07:34 AM   #4621
JimVonBaden
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Originally Posted by RichBMW View Post
Does anyone care to reply to my comment here
Rich, that was rider error, not the bike. It was well discussed in that thread.

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Old 02-01-2013, 07:36 AM   #4622
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Originally Posted by RichBMW View Post
Does anyone care to reply to my comment here
Comment what?

My countrymen seem to be pushing the bikes more than they should. If the bike can go 210+ on pavement, doesn't mean you should do that on a rocky desert.
He probably hit something that made him lose a bit of front stability (you can't just "fly" over ALL the rocks), that you can usually fight by giving gas, impossible if you are already near top speed. Instead he seems to have briefly hit the brakes, which was recipe for destruction.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:36 AM   #4623
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Originally Posted by vtbob View Post
I am too.

the water cooling make the Head(valve adjustments) much more temperature stable. the water cooling also takes some of the cooling load off the oil.

I think the shorter intervals is more about keeping the dealer service $$$ coming in...vs real engineering needs of the bike's mechanicals. when is the last time you had your valves adjusted in you bmw car...or any car for that matter.

to days oils...evan the dino are much more temperature and break down tolerant. the synthetics last evan longer.

Most other MC manufacturers seem to be lengthening the intervals....competitive pressure will make BMW do the same too.

Does anyone actually have a service chart, or is this based on what some mag said? Service intervals of 6 K for oil changes makes sense. We would need to see if it is more like the Camhead in that they check the valves at 6K, then every 12K after. I am not convinced that this isn't the case.

Jim

PS On the "tank slapper" situation, has anyone checked to see how the suspensions were set when this happened? Could be innapropriate settings for the riding conditions.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:37 AM   #4624
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Originally Posted by RichBMW View Post
So has nobody EVER had a tankslapper whilst riding the current 12GS off road? I seem to remember a post only last week of a guy riding across the desert on a GSA and wrecking the bike.

That is similar to an incident that happened on Diablo dry lake in Baja last spring in that a rider on a big adventure bike went down in a huge cloud of dust in front of me. I managed just barely not to hit him and got everyone behind me stopped. The rider was curled up just like the guy in this video and was aspirating fluids for a short time. Scary stuff. I was wondering if he was dying of a brain injury in front of me. Luckily he made almost a full recovery but still had some double vision problems. He was on a KTM 990 Adventure and I did not see the crash, only the huge explosion of dust. Maybe the new GS has forks that flex too much. Time will tell. But I am wondering if these big heavy bikes are harder to control once they start to get out of shape due to all that mass. People are mentioning rider error and for sure that may have been the case in both the crash in the video and the one in Baja. I guess my point is that on a lighter bike you probably have a better chance of recovering from an error.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:39 AM   #4625
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Originally Posted by khale View Post
6 years in development and 1 million KM (or miles?) tested for the new GS.
There's an old saying in tech support, it's called PEBKAC "Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair." I'm not ruling out machine error, cause it does happen, but in my experience, inexperienced riding usually causes the error.
If this was a big enough problem in previous versions of the GS, there would be a mega class action and we wouldn't have a GS anymore.
Maybe I'm just being completely ignorant to the situation, but I just don't buy into all the hokus pokus surrounding the new GS. Just my 2 cents.
Irrelevant.
Indeed it could be rider error, but 2 or 3 of 20 (?) experienced riders reporting the same is not a good indicator.
This is not related AT ALL with the current 1200GS (and no there was not such an issue in the current bike), as it has many differences.
Whatever this is, it is new.
We all hope to get PROPER explanation and PROPER resolution (if needed).
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:40 AM   #4626
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Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
Fork brace on a telelever?

Jim

Stanchion Tube brace if you may Sir.

The two guide tubes when are braced better, people have unanimously stated that the bikes front end response becomes better. I have felt the front end actually feeling a bit vague in one of my high speed rides on a trail. It was a rutted and stoned trail and the front end actually felt a bit vague. But non the less I just gave the bike my full commitment and had full confidence on it and it did brought me out safe and sound and fast. I love it for that. Oh by the way, its a 2011 Triple Black GS with no electronics.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:45 AM   #4627
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Originally Posted by navpreet318 View Post
Stanchion Tube brace if you may Sir.

The two guide tubes when are braced better, people have unanimously stated that the bikes front end response becomes better. I have felt the front end actually feeling a bit vague in one of my high speed rides on a trail. It was a rutted and stoned trail and the front end actually felt a bit vague. But non the less I just gave the bike my full commitment and had full confidence on it and it did brought me out safe and sound and fast. I love it for that. Oh by the way, its a 2011 Triple Black GS with no electronics.
I know what a fork brace is, but am having trouble picturing where to put it on a Telelever.

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Old 02-01-2013, 07:45 AM   #4628
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Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
That is similar to an incident that happened on Diablo dry lake in Baja last spring in that a rider on a big adventure bike went down in a huge cloud of dust in front of me. I managed just barely not to hit him and got everyone behind me stopped. The rider was curled up just like the guy in this video and was aspirating fluids for a short time. Scary stuff. I was wondering if he was dying of a brain injury in front of me. Luckily he made almost a full recovery but still had some double vision problems. He was on a KTM 990 Adventure and I did not see the crash, only the huge explosion of dust. Maybe the new GS has forks that flex too much. Time will tell. But I am wondering if these big heavy bikes are harder to control once they start to get out of shape due to all that mass.
It is really really strange how they thin down the tubes when the bike got a bit heavier and with a bit stiffer frame.
It's the only thing I don't like with the new bike (and also if the service intervals don't become longer - but this is minor).
Let see if this becomes a real issue.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:55 AM   #4629
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Originally Posted by Bikeaddict View Post
The way I see it is that where there's a smoke there's a fire. This minor fork issue is definetely an issue since the bike is marketed as an offroad worthy one. And I am no longer convinced that Kevin Ash just went down and got killed. Maybe he was pushing the bike too much, to an extent that most of your average rider wouldn't come close.
I do have some questions with your hypothesis. On a german statement I read they were riding in a group with around 10 bikes. Speed around 100kph (an appropriate speed for the road, not asphalt).
So he surely wasn't pushing it.

Anyways, I am not worried, I will never push it offroad.

However I also wonder what caused the crash.
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Old 02-01-2013, 08:10 AM   #4630
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Why does something have to be worse because it is smaller or thinner? The alloy could be a different composition allowing it to be stiffer but smaller. I doubt thinner forks would cause a tank slap anyway off road. You could feel it on a high speed road bend usually as a weave. Tank slappers are normally down to geometry or suspension, on occasion I have seen tyres do it on sensitive bikes.
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Old 02-01-2013, 08:23 AM   #4631
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Originally Posted by Marki_GSA View Post
Why does something have to be worse because it is smaller or thinner?..
Now, you've just offended the majority big bike members here who ride the behemoths offroad to compensate :)


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Old 02-01-2013, 09:01 AM   #4632
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i am #3 on my dealer's list, right behind EJ in fact......and as of this moment, i will most likely refrain from purchasing the new GS given recent developments (unless there is a resolve of sorts in the near future). i do think that there is a possibility of bias/group think/spillover effect, but the statistics are worrisome (3 out 20 riders reporting the same). could it have been the preload/damping setting on each of the bikes? i'm not sure as i'm not an off-road rider,0 but i do know that a poorly suspended bike could cause such head shakes even on a paved asphalt surface. is the new GS a poorly suspended motorcycle? i don't think so, the components are of high quality, they should not be the root of the cause. the tires, tire pressure? maybe, but you'd think that they might correct for such if so. as others have said, the bike is of new design, specifically the forks (geometry?), frame, chassis, and even wheel size, those make more sense to me as to being a potential culprit of the problem. having said that, how could the head shakes present themselves this late in the game?
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oalvarez screwed with this post 02-01-2013 at 09:12 AM
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Old 02-01-2013, 09:05 AM   #4633
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Originally Posted by Bazgab View Post
If you look later in the catalog it is a completely new model, not a ton different but they are listed and can be seen. Built in carry handle in the top recess of the lid, new mounting/locking system on the box, and some screws built into the sides to install accessory holders/racks. I also noticed the plastic corner protectors on the bottom actual run all the way across the bottom edge of the box, not just on the corner. They have model numbers for the Zega Pro2s listed for many bikes, including the new GS. Nothing comes up on the actual website though, just found in the catalog.

EDIT: Just looked it up, page 1090 of the catalog
Thanks. I didn't know all that. I glimpsed quickly through the catalog with full throttle
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Old 02-01-2013, 09:24 AM   #4634
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Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
how could the head shakes present themselves this late in the game?
That's the golden question everyone wants to know. BMW will sort it out. Doesn't stop me from being on the list to get mine in March/April.
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Old 02-01-2013, 09:30 AM   #4635
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My point is that everyone is jumping on the fact that 2 journo's had a tankslapper on the new model, when people have had tankslappers on the old one. This is nothing new, and certainly isn't a manufacturing error. If you ride too fast off road, and hit a dip, or large stone at speed, you're going to have a problem. Regardless of the bike.
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