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Old 01-03-2012, 06:42 PM   #1216
hillbillypolack
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So if the new Euro emissions is driving BMW to change to a water cooled engine, what about H-D and Ducati with their iconic twins?

Does the emissions standards rule on the entire motorcycle lineup for a total emissions output, or is it a bike-by-bike CO and Db level?
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:00 PM   #1217
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harley is working on one right now.

The radiators will be cleverly hidden, as will the water pipes and pump.

A casual look will not be able to see the difference.

Much as BMW still has fins on the cylinders so will HD

There will not be a Japanese style radiator on the bike, or a V rod style one either

Rod
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:42 PM   #1218
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IT appears that your guys are all wrong

Well it appears that the emissions standard was met by the air/oil whoever said that it met the emissions already was the only guy to say it, everybody on else was saying it has to change including highly esteemed magazines like motorcycle magazine, one said sure rain is wet that it be this coming summer in 2012 and went on to say every little detail including exact hp and how the engine would be cooled beyond the water jacket, they sounded like the knew exactly what they were talking about like it came right from BMW but it turns out none of them were close BMW plans to keep this new DOHC for a little while longer to get back it investment again the dealer said the air hold will not be changed for quite some time however i don know how long quite some time would be, but i know i made the right choice buying a 2012GS this year in late fall for 2 months i was able to run hit very nice weather i found out if you dress right for it.
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:42 PM   #1219
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Originally Posted by tallguy-09 View Post
...at this point, these pics have made the rounds of all related forums... this one shows the legroom.
Looks like the cylinders are higher but also more forward? This should help with available legroom for tall riders, what do you think?

https://skydrive.live.com/redir.aspx...NpH0QC1Ffln9qY

Artistic rendering based on "Motorrad" 01/2012
Looks like it has plenty of legroom to me.
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:49 PM   #1220
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Originally Posted by flightestman View Post
Well it appears that the emissions standard was met by the air/oil whoever said that it met the emissions already was the only guy to say it, everybody on else was saying it has to change including highly esteemed magazines like motorcycle magazine, one said sure rain is wet that it be this coming summer in 2012 and went on to say every little detail including exact hp and how the engine would be cooled beyond the water jacket, they sounded like the knew exactly what they were talking about like it came right from BMW but it turns out none of them were close BMW plans to keep this new DOHC for a little while longer to get back it investment again the dealer said the air hold will not be changed for quite some time however i don know how long quite some time would be, but i know i made the right choice buying a 2012GS this year in late fall for 2 months i was able to run hit very nice weather i found out if you dress right for it.
That is the loooongest sentence I have seen to date.
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:51 PM   #1221
tallguy-09
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Originally Posted by Callisto224 View Post
Looks like it has plenty of legroom to me.
No more banging my shins on the cylinders (intake), with 6'7" I'm definitely appreciating this
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Old 01-03-2012, 09:49 PM   #1222
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Originally Posted by tallguy-09 View Post


Who can read this?

... Cooled ?
Liquid


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Old 01-04-2012, 01:03 AM   #1223
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Originally Posted by rritterson View Post

My biggest complaint with the current bike? The front end is twitchy, on road and off. I went over a botts dot yesterday and got a whole bunch of headshake. None of the changes we've seen seem to address that problem.
Never (never ever!) happens to me. Yesterday I was trail riding in gravel and took my hands off for a laugh loads of times and got no head shake. I'm picking you have a suspension or steering fault that needs fixing.

For others that say the GS is a great road bike... You are right.... but, it is also a GREAT off road bike.... and BMW needs to carry it over to the new bike.
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Old 01-04-2012, 03:09 AM   #1224
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Originally Posted by McFuryMcNugget View Post
I dont agree with this statement.
Its all wrong in fact this design is for a more longtivity of the engine and faster repair if the cylinders blow.

The oil for the engine an gears are as one.

In real life it works like this with oil change.
you can drain the bike from the oil filter to leave the oil in there for the gears.

Or you can drain it from below and take out all the oil engine and gears.

The gears are the main drive system of any bike and with this its always in lube.

This is top engineering.

Gears are the heart of every motor with good gears you get high milage and many do not keep there oil level up in specs
and it becomes a stress factor on the motor. This is now gone with the high tec motor.

The Motor
If you make the Cylinder walls as good as BMW has done to this day the Piston rings should not need to be replaced until ??? 250.000km.

McFury.
Yea right. Made for easier repairs and "if the cylinders blow" It is made for faster repairs and more longevity. It doesn't look like you can repair those cylinders at all. Just like the present boxer cylinders. You have to replace the cylinder because it can't be rebored. You buy another pair of cylinders. With the new engine it looks like you can't even replace them because they are cast in as part of the block. As far as the statement that "this all wrong" I think you have no mechanical background or experience with rebuilding engines and wouldn't recognize a good design from a poor one. Especially BMW engines. If you think that putting the transmission in the same block as the engine so you can "take out all the oil engine and gears" is good for longevity then power too you. Run right out and buy one. I will keep my rebuildable 1150 gs with 155,000 miles on it. It has never had the heads off and when it comes time that I need to rebuild I can! I am not one that trades a bike off every time a new model comes out in a different color. Like I said before, when Cat, Cummins, GM, Ford decide that their engines will last longer with the transmission and engine sharing the same block and oil I will rethink my logic. As for now I still believe in what has worked in the past. I am one of those BMW guys that think my old air head was the most reliable and easiest to service and longest lasting bikes I have owned. I hurt every time I think about selling it.
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Old 01-04-2012, 03:53 AM   #1225
DrunkWombat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KSBEERHUNTER View Post
Yea right. Made for easier repairs and "if the cylinders blow" It is made for faster repairs and more longevity. It doesn't look like you can repair those cylinders at all. Just like the present boxer cylinders. You have to replace the cylinder because it can't be rebored. You buy another pair of cylinders. With the new engine it looks like you can't even replace them because they are cast in as part of the block. As far as the statement that "this all wrong" I think you have no mechanical background or experience with rebuilding engines and wouldn't recognize a good design from a poor one. Especially BMW engines. If you think that putting the transmission in the same block as the engine so you can "take out all the oil engine and gears" is good for longevity then power too you. Run right out and buy one. I will keep my rebuildable 1150 gs with 155,000 miles on it. It has never had the heads off and when it comes time that I need to rebuild I can! I am not one that trades a bike off every time a new model comes out in a different color. Like I said before, when Cat, Cummins, GM, Ford decide that their engines will last longer with the transmission and engine sharing the same block and oil I will rethink my logic. As for now I still believe in what has worked in the past. I am one of those BMW guys that think my old air head was the most reliable and easiest to service and longest lasting bikes I have owned. I hurt every time I think about selling it.

Well Jap bikes have had nikasil bores for nearly 2 decades now. They last forever and are repairable. I think a lot of the water cooled paranoia is unjustified. If evolution and improvement were so evil we would still be riding horses.
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Old 01-04-2012, 03:57 AM   #1226
pmelby
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KSBEERHUNTER View Post
....I will keep my rebuildable 1150 gs with 155,000 miles on it. It has never had the heads off and when it comes time that I need to rebuild I can! I am not one that trades a bike off every time a new model comes out in a different color. Like I said before, when Cat, Cummins, GM, Ford decide that their engines will last longer with the transmission and engine sharing the same block and oil I will rethink my logic.....
Did you enjoy splitting your 1150 in half to replace the clutch?

I can think of at least three good reasons to ditch the dry clutch:
1. More robust, able to operate in the friction zone, without fear of damage
2. No worry about a rear main seal leak destroying the clutch
3. Better access to the slave cylinder (will probably be external)

Cons also come to mind:
1. Engine and clutch/tranny using the same oil

The new boxer motor design is clearly a response to the challenges presented by the competitors, Ducati, KTM, Triumph, Yamaha, etc.

I also think that the oilhead, hexhead, camhead motors and bikes were and are still great machines. There is no reason that the new generation boxer won't be good as well.

cheers,
melby
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Old 01-04-2012, 03:59 AM   #1227
cardoctor1
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linky for the watercooled hd engine

http://www.cyrilhuzeblog.com/2011/06...-heads-patent/
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Old 01-04-2012, 04:09 AM   #1228
McFuryMcNugget
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Crome wall.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KSBEERHUNTER View Post
Yea right. Made for easier repairs and "if the cylinders blow" It is made for faster repairs and more longevity. It doesn't look like you can repair those cylinders at all. Just like the present boxer cylinders. You have to replace the cylinder because it can't be rebored. You buy another pair of cylinders. With the new engine it looks like you can't even replace them because they are cast in as part of the block. As far as the statement that "this all wrong" I think you have no mechanical background or experience with rebuilding engines and wouldn't recognize a good design from a poor one. Especially BMW engines. If you think that putting the transmission in the same block as the engine so you can "take out all the oil engine and gears" is good for longevity then power too you. Run right out and buy one. I will keep my rebuildable 1150 gs with 155,000 miles on it. It has never had the heads off and when it comes time that I need to rebuild I can! I am not one that trades a bike off every time a new model comes out in a different color. Like I said before, when Cat, Cummins, GM, Ford decide that their engines will last longer with the transmission and engine sharing the same block and oil I will rethink my logic. As for now I still believe in what has worked in the past. I am one of those BMW guys that think my old air head was the most reliable and easiest to service and longest lasting bikes I have owned. I hurt every time I think about selling it.
Crome Steel all the way.
If you look at the market spectrum you will soon find out that the old engines are T-Rex creatures ,Gas eating and Fart puffing , Outdated engines.When gas was cheaper then Pepsi.
Climb up to smell the roses. To get better gas milage you need a crome cylinder,Its true they cant be bored out as the old T-Rex cylinders. You just get a new one as well as pistons.
But most just need the pistons since the crome walls on these babys are strong.
The US was a leader in big engines and muscle cars true back in the day. NOT NOW.
I notice you name CAT Cummins Industrial producers of Diesel engines. And only 1 automaker FORD.
Well i have a old Ford with a 302 Cid engine trusted Van and hold up well but a real gas guzzler.
When the engine is running and i have to attach my trailer to the Van i weap over the flow of gas running out my exhaust pipe.And its in top condition.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudolf_Diesel
All new diesel engines do not offer a bore out option.And if you think a integrated or seperate gears box has anything to do with engine Life your wrong.

A gear box is the hearth of the engine.

Engine makes combustion power , Gears take that power thru the gears.

To bore out a cylinder block is totaly outdated and obselite thinking bare in mind in a old fuck as well.

To have Crome cylinder for the Piston is like having a tight wrap around all the time

Happy New Year Baby.

McFury
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Old 01-04-2012, 05:46 AM   #1229
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Originally Posted by DrunkWombat View Post
Well Jap bikes have had nikasil bores for nearly 2 decades now. They last forever and are repairable. I think a lot of the water cooled paranoia is unjustified. If evolution and improvement were so evil we would still be riding horses.
The naysayers appear whenever a new model appears.. and you gotta laugh when you read such thoughts when there's very little known about the new liquid cooled engine. Nothing official has been released, but hey, that's what makes these forums "interesting". Everyone's an expert on the interwebs. Honda's GL1800 Goldwings have no separate engine and transmission oils and I've seen bikes with 200, 300 and even 400,000 miles..

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Old 01-04-2012, 05:53 AM   #1230
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Originally Posted by GB View Post
The naysayers appear whenever a new model appears.. and you gotta laugh when you read such thoughts when there's very little known about the new liquid cooled engine. Nothing official has been released, but hey, that's what makes these forums "interesting". Everyone's an expert on the interwebs. Honda's GL1800 Goldwings have no separate engine and transmission oils and I've seen bikes with 200, 300 and even 400,000 miles..



Speculation is all we have, and some gravitate towards the negative, and some positive. Since we know virtually nothing about this mythical new wethead, we just make stuff up. Also, there are always those who hate change, those who live for change, and those who bitch about both change and a lack of change.

Welcome to the wonderful world of the BMW Motorcycle!
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