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Old 03-07-2011, 10:03 AM   #181
Jettn Jim
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Question Stud ?'s

Hey Paul was gonna PM you but figure your reply could help others.
1- Have you ran studs on a more knobbie tire such as a Dunlop 606? Do the higher knobs cause more problems than the TKC's, with more squirming around?

2- You mention the studs cutting down on treadwear and thats kinda good.

3-Would you say the loss of traction on bare pavement is not worth the tradeoff though?

Reason I ask is I'm gonna ride out to Idaho in a couple weeks and normally I wouldn't use studs... But with the chance of snow in the Rockies and the added wear to my favorite 606's it's looking like a possibility.

4- Or if your/I'm running mostly on bare roads, are the studs only going to cause less traction and offer less +'s?

Thanx for any info, sorry to bother ya in the middle of a kick ass ride Hope today is going GOOD!
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Old 03-07-2011, 10:10 AM   #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmuncher1 View Post
At first when I brought it back to Victoria from Vancouver, I was not sure what to think. The front end felt light in dry and grippy condition and I did not know how it would feel on snow and ice. Our first day going across the Coquahala was the best way from hell to find out. I had said I wanted bad stuff and we got it.. a storm that stopped rigs on their tracks and even the tow trucks that were trying to help them. 6 inch of slush and snow is the worse. No traction and no control. Stopping was hard cause taking off again was challenging. I know how Frosty felt in this and her weight is something I am familiar with. I know how much to squeeze her and how to use my weight to work with hers.
This DID NOT work on the 800! I had no feedback from the front end. It felt vague as if floating on this crap. In a way it was, but I felt I could not use the bars to steers the bike at low speed. 10-15 km/h was incredibly hard to do. Frosty has enough weight on the front end that just me putting my weight back on the seat at times or low on the pegs was enough for us to work well together. Not on the 800
========================
Now that you've had some serious saddle time on the 800, how would you compare it to Frosty?
Here is my honest answer

F800GS


Well! It has been over 3 weeks now and I think it is safe to say I can efficiently compare my Faithful Frosty (650 Dakar) to it.
Of course at the beginning I was jaded with Frosty. After all she has done what no other bike of her size or kind or anything has done
1) She has gone from Victoria BC to Cape Spear Newfoundland, close to 9000 kms without a glitch
2) She has gone from Victoria BC to Goose Bay Labrador and back to Joliette Quebec without a problem. And this; with a sidecar attached to her carrying 120 lbs of survival gear. And in doing so has also been ridden in temperatures down to -61 C without problems.
3) She has done the Frozen Butt Tour, 3000 kms from Baie-Comeau Quebec to Cartwright Labrador and back without problem.

The only thing she had was that ice was forming at the bottom of the air box, clogging the engine case breather hose, which in turn, popped out the hose on top of the valve cover and she spewed oil... It was just messy and has by no means caused a mechanical problem.

So the F800 GS is competing with a formidable adversary..

Handling??

Better on the Dakar for one reason. The front end of the 800 is too light and feels vague at anything than 120 km/h. Not the Dakar. With that said, it does not mean that it dos not handle well. It is just that when you hit soft deep stuff (Snow) on the 800 you go down like right now. The Dakar allows you some play and you can correct.

Power?

No match. The power of the 800 is addictive no doubt. It launches like-well! Like an 800 GS! Power to weight ratio is incredible. I find the acceleration more powerful and more natural than the big 1200. And the Dakar is no match. But I never, in the 115,000 kms I have on Frosty longed for more power. Your call... If one likes to be able to say,” It is nice to have when you need it!” and/or if you like bragging rights around in front of the motel with all the big GS’s parked with their camping gear on? Then, sure!

Comfort?

I find my Dakar more comfortable than the 800 GS. But this does not mean anything, as it is a very unique to you and personal thing. Nothing bar risers, better seat (The High stock one is great for my ass and I love it) and other comfort improving farkles cannot fix.

Fuel consumption?

No match! The Dakar wins. I find it hard to see why such a great bike as the 800 GS would be built with such small range capability. If I ran short of gas in summer at -35 c, I am sure I would run short in summer. I know many 800 owners who say the same thing. Of course it can be corrected with the $2500 auxiliary fuel tanks from TT, but Damn!!!!! That is mucho deneiros Hombre!!!

Finish?

Well! What can I say? It is a BMW and hence top notch.

So to answer the question, “Would I own one to do what I do?”
I have to say yes for two reasons.

1) I would because they do not make the Dakar anymore, and that the 800 GS has really grown on me. I am comfortable on it and I find ways to navigate around its weaknesses. And those weaknesses are not the type that would or should keep anyone from getting one; including me.
2) At one point Frosty will retire and I will/might keep her as my trip around the world bike. If something happened to my 2004 1150 GSA, I would have to replace my touring bike with one bike and it would be the 800 GS. I owned a 1200 GSA at the same time I had my 1150 GSA and sold the 1200.
I trust the 1150 (150,000 kms without problems). I cannot say the same thing about the 1200. My opinion only! It would be without hesitation a 800 because from what I can see it is magnificent on the open generally speaking and is the next best thing to a Dakar for Extreme winter riding.
One last thing! The valve gasket has blown out on both 800’s requiring me to push them back in with a screwdriver once the bike was warm. They now leak oil, bit nothing major. Maybe 3 tablespoons per 2-3 days..
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Old 03-07-2011, 10:24 AM   #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jettn Jim View Post
Hey Paul was gonna PM you but figure your reply could help others.
1- Have you ran studs on a more knobbie tire such as a Dunlop 606? Do the higher knobs cause more problems than the TKC's, with more squirming around?

2- You mention the studs cutting down on treadwear and thats kinda good.

3-Would you say the loss of traction on bare pavement is not worth the tradeoff though?

Reason I ask is I'm gonna ride out to Idaho in a couple weeks and normally I wouldn't use studs... But with the chance of snow in the Rockies and the added wear to my favorite 606's it's looking like a possibility.

4- Or if your/I'm running mostly on bare roads, are the studs only going to cause less traction and offer less +'s?

Thanx for any info, sorry to bother ya in the middle of a kick ass ride Hope today is going GOOD!
I have not, But other guys i know including Keith on the Frozen Butt Tour has. He ran well, but also decided to use the TKC on the next Frozen Butt. The reason is that with the knobs design and spread you have a wider coverage as your wheels turn with the studs. And by this i mean the Aerostich studs. I never used others for long distance stuff.

2- You mention the studs cutting down on treadwear and thats kinda good.
Yes they do. I have on this trip so far over 6000 kms on the TKC's and no sign of wear. I have a set at home with 25k on it and they still have about 50 % left.

3-Would you say the loss of traction on bare pavement is not worth the tradeoff though?
Which lost of traction. I have yet to feel anything that is worth noticing.. If you put the all the way to the edge, i am sure you would lose traction on asphalt. But i do not use them that far on the pattern. On a scale of 10 for traction and s sense of safety and feeling secure? I would give them a 10

Reason I ask is I'm gonna ride out to Idaho in a couple weeks and normally I wouldn't use studs... But with the chance of snow in the Rockies and the added wear to my favorite 606's it's looking like a possibility.
Get some! You will never regret it. get the #06's

4- Or if your/I'm running mostly on bare roads, are the studs only going to cause less traction and offer less +'s?
No! Not at all. I have done almost 10,000 kms on bare asphalt on a set and at no time did I feel I was losing traction. Plus when you brake lock the wheel at night, the sparks show is awesome!
Plus Like I always said, you can remove them easily when you want


Thanx for any info, sorry to bother ya in the middle of a kick ass ride

You are not bothering me at all. isn't that what we do as motorcyclists? help each other and love doing it? Any time Buddy! Hope today is going GOOD!
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Old 03-07-2011, 07:12 PM   #184
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Would more rear shock preload help out the vauge front end feeling in the snow? I know it helps out me on soft gravel roads, especially if I have too much gear in the rear bags.
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Old 03-07-2011, 08:50 PM   #185
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Thumb Thanx

Thanx for the Tips! Much appreciated, ordering studs tonight!
"Plus when you brake lock the wheel at night, the sparks show is awesome!" thats funny $hit!
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Old 03-09-2011, 04:59 AM   #186
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Might be of interest to you

BMW are bring out a new 650...engine looks the same and so does the frame,exhaust etc......

here is a link to a few picshttp://www.bmwblog.com/2010/10/30/the-new-bmw-g-650-gs/
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Old 03-09-2011, 11:15 AM   #187
Jettn Jim
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Question Hopefully last ?

Paul,

One more question....Do you ever use adhesive or do you generally put the studs in dry?

Thanx Jim
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:13 PM   #188
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We made it to Inuvik. We never saw warmer then - 30 C but Man! Was it worth it.. I will be a while without posting as we are entering the Tuk Ice road in two days and spending till then in Inuvik.

Let's jus say that no words can describe the Dempster in winter on two wheels.
Nothing!!



This has been mind numbing.. The scenery, the challenge and the feeling one has is hard to describe. At one point looking at the mountains covered with snow as far as the eyes can see brought tears to my eyes. The realization of how lucky I am to be here doing this and seeing all this was more than I could put in words.
The pictures do not even come close to show what it is really like.



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Old 03-10-2011, 05:42 AM   #189
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I think you are right

Most of us really have no idea what it is like to do what you guys are doing or seeing...your pictures help but you are one lucky guy for sure to be able to handle riding in the weather you are and to see the north at this time of year.

Not sure I would ever tackle this as I truly hate the cold but good on you and thanks for the RR so we can live vicariously through your eyes and words.
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Old 03-10-2011, 02:24 PM   #190
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Almost every pic would make a great screensaver,love'em all!
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Old 03-10-2011, 06:13 PM   #191
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Photos

Your right! I put one on my Blackberry already!
Great RR!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oznay View Post
Almost every pic would make a great screensaver,love'em all!
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Old 03-10-2011, 08:10 PM   #192
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Welll!!! It has been another epic ride…

The ride from Whitehorse to Dawson City was a freaking nice and long and cold one. The temps hovered all day around -25 to -30C. I wanted cold shot for this trip? We got it. But the scenery was really amazing. (Nothing compared to what the Dempster was about to throw at us)
On our way there we stopped at Braeburn Lodge where they served the biggest baddest Cinnamon buns I have ever seen.



The guy who runs the joint though is the most miserable person I have ever met. he is actually known for it. We were told that he does not like anything else but Harley riders. So after we got our food. (We shared a bun and took one to go) I told Joe making sure we were heard that "You would not be out here if you owned an HD as the thing would be in your garage now"
I got no laughter except from our group and the truckers that were there.

These trucks have the "Don't F%$#@ with me" charisma all over them. they are built for this and inspire respect. Having been a trucker myself I can tell you I was drooling looking at them. Those guys are the real thing too. None of these clown who are glorified on the Ice Road truckers program.

While we were there I also made another furry friend. I love dogs..


The road was mainly covered with packed snow (Ice) and the traffic was not that bad. Maybe 10-15 trucks and trucks???? The whole way..




It was a 520 clicks day and I sure felt like it when we got there. We signed in and went to catch some badly some ZZZZZZ’s
The Dawson City Hotel surte is not as busy as in summer when the street is packed with bikes….




What can I say? Really! When we left from Dawson City, it was -31 C. That was OK. But, I m getting ahead of myself here.

Naturally while we were there we had to do the Sour Toe cocktail.
To those who do not know what it is, it is a mummified human toe that is preserved in pickling salt.

To be certified you have to drink it with a cocktail that is higher than 40 % alcohol or what they call proof. It also has to touch your lip to count. Or if you want to be bad ass all the way (Like Me! See Picture) you can put it in your mouth.



I asked Dick the owner of the hotel and the master of the ceremony what would happen if one swallowed it. He just grinned and said that he/she would not be allowed to leave.


After getting certified we wound down and got ready for the day after and the Dempster. Dick the Hotel’s owner told us to put our bikes in his heated shed the day we got there. It was a good idea as Joe’s bike sprouted a leak on the valve cover gasket. We bout some Gluzall and fixed it while it was in the warmth. They are known to have problem with their valve cover gaskets in normal weather. Obviously this will push its limits.
We left the following day and headed to the big D.

Like I said, it was -31C. We were pretty happy to be there. But the day started badly as Joe’s helmet (Zox snowmobile helmet) turns out to be a helmet that does not work in certain conditions. His glasses kept icing up.

As I, on the other hand with my Bombardier BS2V had no issues. This helmet rocks!!!!
We kept trying with different balaclavas to no avail. I told him I would build him a mask once we got to Eagle Plains with Duct tape. This trip is turning into a “Duct tape discovery trip”









The road to Eagle Plains is 370 kms… By midway the temp had warmed up to -25C. It stayed there all the way to Eagle Plains. I will let the pictures do the talking.
We had an awesome dinner at the restaurant and the accommodation was great too. Quiet and clean and the lady at the front and the staff were great. They also told us to put the bikes in the Transport shed.. Perfect!!!!




This place is pretty high and on top of a plateau. The view from it is phenomenal and the sunset was unreal….
My first job was to make Joe a mask that would allow him to ride without frosting his glasses. I made a mask lined with a facecloth that deflected the breathed air away from the helmet, hence not causing condensation, and keeping the inside of the helmet dry. It worked like a ht damn. He mad e to Inuvik no problem.


We fueled in the morning after a great breakfast and were on our way to Inuvik. What the road is like and the scenery is like I cannot put in words. It is like you are in another world. The conditions wee hard as the road had been closed a week and a half ago because of a bad storm. There was a lot of snow drifts and dicey parts.. speeds were anywhere between 30 km/h and 80 km/h. the temps stayed at close to -25 C all day..
It is so beautiful it is alien. Unless you have seen something like this in winter, there are no words that can convey the beauty.
So will let the pictures to the talk.. The ride to Inuvik was a 380 kms of absolute glory. That is all I can say.










And we met some of the locals as well


Once we got to Inuvik, we stayed at the Arctic chalets.



Nice quaint little place where they have dog sleds and snowmobiles and cabins in a-well-arctic settings.
We had a restful night and went to Inuvik the next morning (Today) I will keep this for another post.
Tomorrow we are doing the Tuk ice road. This year they carved it differently because of weather and awful storms.. That is what we were told. We will see.

Iceman Out

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Old 03-10-2011, 09:08 PM   #193
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Thumb Nice pics

Damn after seeing those pics I've gotta ride back up there in the winter...

Looks WAY more Beautiful than in September, very nice!!!!

And Joe.....Nice mask!

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Old 03-11-2011, 04:43 AM   #194
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I still can't get used to pics with the white bike...I'm sure Frosty is gonna toss you off when you get back just for spite!

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Old 03-12-2011, 09:39 AM   #195
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We made it

We made it to Tuk. We left Inuvik at 10 AM yesterday and made it here around five PM.. Not bad for 190 kms.. It was the best evn though the ice road had never been this bad. They had closed it for a week and reopened it a week and a half ago.
Temperatures??? with the windchill it got to -48C/ Yep!!!!

Will post later when I can. There is so much more.. It is painful!! Really is!

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