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Old 05-04-2011, 08:17 PM   #316
lemieuxmc
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Pre-mix is the way to go. If you think it's a hassle get a four stroke... WUSSY!
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Old 05-04-2011, 09:53 PM   #317
Al Tuna
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The suzuki oil pump delivers oil thru tubes to some key points (crank & wrist bearings) in the engine.
cci example
The Suzuki system is not like a yamalube that just directs the oil downstream from the carb.

If you switch to premix you are going to be taking your chances

Suzuki has strenuous warnings that failure to provide adequate oil via the crankcase injector port on the CCI oil injection system on all models (excluding TS/TM 400) will cause main bearing oil starvation, even if proper premix ratio is achieved.

Oil injection system known as POSI-FORCE, which consists of an engine-driven oil pump coupled to the throttle, which is designed to provide the proper amount of oil needed at the current RPM and throttle opening. The pump draws clean oil from a separate oil tank, and pumps it through hoses into the crankcase, where it is injected into the engine from a nozzle located between the intake manifold and the cylinder. A separate oil injection point is also provided for the main bearing(s) and big end rod bearings of the crankshaft. This dual-point injection made the Posi-Force system far superior to the competitions' single point per cylinder systems. Suzuki would continue to use this system on many of their two-stroke motorcycle designs for many years.

Jenna, the pump is gravity feed... So the oil tank must be at a higher elevation than the pump, in order for the pump to prime it's self.

PS. The oil tank has to have a vent somewhere, make sure it's not restricted.
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Al Tuna screwed with this post 05-05-2011 at 06:47 AM
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Old 05-05-2011, 06:31 AM   #318
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I rebuilt many of crankshafts in my day when riders said screw the injection and run premix, it WILL kill the bearings in these motors as they are designed for the injection.
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Old 05-05-2011, 06:43 AM   #319
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Just found this post and I'm sure it will help me in trying to get a 67 X6 back up and running. I'm impressed hardwaregrrl I hope I can muster the patience needed, probably won't, too ADD. I also saw you have been off to Labrador. Had a day of business in St. John's NF last year so I took my daughter and three dogs in a truck camper from New Mex and will likely go back this year via Lab.
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Old 05-05-2011, 08:46 AM   #320
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There are people that are stern standing on both sides. If they put it there, it must be for a reason so I'm keeping it as it FUCKING WORKS!!!!!! I am an asshole, I didn't put the drill in reverse as the shaft spins counterclockwise.....dipshit. Pics to prove.
Good on ya! (still envious of you for finding this thing!)
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Old 05-05-2011, 08:05 PM   #321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Tuna View Post
The suzuki oil pump delivers oil thru tubes to some key points (crank & wrist bearings) in the engine.
cci example
The Suzuki system is not like a yamalube that just directs the oil downstream from the carb.

If you switch to premix you are going to be taking your chances

Suzuki has strenuous warnings that failure to provide adequate oil via the crankcase injector port on the CCI oil injection system on all models (excluding TS/TM 400) will cause main bearing oil starvation, even if proper premix ratio is achieved.

Oil injection system known as POSI-FORCE, which consists of an engine-driven oil pump coupled to the throttle, which is designed to provide the proper amount of oil needed at the current RPM and throttle opening. The pump draws clean oil from a separate oil tank, and pumps it through hoses into the crankcase, where it is injected into the engine from a nozzle located between the intake manifold and the cylinder. A separate oil injection point is also provided for the main bearing(s) and big end rod bearings of the crankshaft. This dual-point injection made the Posi-Force system far superior to the competitions' single point per cylinder systems. Suzuki would continue to use this system on many of their two-stroke motorcycle designs for many years.

Jenna, the pump is gravity feed... So the oil tank must be at a higher elevation than the pump, in order for the pump to prime it's self.

PS. The oil tank has to have a vent somewhere, make sure it's not restricted.
This all makes a lot of sense, my only question is where does the oil go after it is used to lube the crank? When you change the crankcase oil do you leave it a little low to account for the extra oil that will be introduced to the system? Doesn't the 2t oil thin down the other oil?
Just curious.
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Old 05-05-2011, 08:19 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by Whitey1 View Post
This all makes a lot of sense, my only question is where does the oil go after it is used to lube the crank? When you change the crankcase oil do you leave it a little low to account for the extra oil that will be introduced to the system? Doesn't the 2t oil thin down the other oil?
Just curious.
It is also burned in the combustion mixture and exits out the exhaust. The crank seals keep it separated from the trans oil.
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Old 05-05-2011, 08:26 PM   #323
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It is also burned in the combustion mixture and exits out the exhaust. The crank seals keep it separated from the trans oil.


Now it makes perfect sense! Thank you.
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Old 05-06-2011, 03:59 AM   #324
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2 stroke fun for 200 bucks. ironic title. no fun and no $200

don't worry it'll all be worth it once it's done.
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Old 05-06-2011, 07:37 AM   #325
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2 stroke fun for 200 bucks. ironic title. no fun and no $200

don't worry it'll all be worth it once it's done.
Ha! I know, but at the time I thought it would just need 50 dollars worth of TLC. But it is still fun, as learning often is.
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Old 05-06-2011, 08:47 AM   #326
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When it's running, we can hit the trails! I'm dropping bearings back in my transmission and crank and reassembling this weekend. So glad I don't have an oil inject unit to deal with :)
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Old 05-06-2011, 07:08 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by PFFOG View Post
I rebuilt many of crankshafts in my day when riders said screw the injection and run premix, it WILL kill the bearings in these motors as they are designed for the injection.

How does my little Suzuki M31 two stroke get lube to the crank since it runs strictly premix?
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Old 05-06-2011, 07:41 PM   #328
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How does my little Suzuki M31 two stroke get lube to the crank since it runs strictly premix?
Probably not a CCI style injection.
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Old 05-06-2011, 09:34 PM   #329
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How does my little Suzuki M31 two stroke get lube to the crank since it runs strictly premix?
The crankcase is part of the intake tract. Anything coming from the carburetor goes there first before being pumped up the transfer ports into the combustion chamber. The bearings get what they need from the oil in the fuel while it's down there. This is why two strokes of even moderate performance can't survive with bushings at the wrist pin or big end of the connecting rod. Bushings (and plain bearings) take considerable lubrication, while roller bearings (big end) and needle bearings (wrist pin end) need very little.
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Old 05-06-2011, 09:49 PM   #330
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................ The bearings get what they need from the oil in the fuel while it's down there. This is why two strokes of even moderate performance can't survive with bushings at the wrist pin or big end of the connecting rod. ..................
Not true with CCI, as the LH bearing is SHIELDED!! The air fuel mix is shrouded from the mix, and the lower end bearing is also shielded by smaller slits in the rod, than a pre-mix motor.

Look at the diagrams or take one apart, it is very obvious that disconnecting the injection will lead to failure of the bearings.
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