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Old 09-21-2011, 08:08 AM   #1
selecus OP
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20k Valve adjustment necessary?

Hey Gang,

I currently have about 14k kms on the bike, I'm heading south to TDF from Montreal in a couple weeks, by the time I get to Houston I'll be approaching 20K kms, wondering if I should bother with the valve adjustment service before I cross into Mexico.

On previous bikes, every time I've brought it in for valve adjustment, everything has been fine, no adjustment was necessary...usually money well wasted. So I'm wondering how many of you brought the 8GS in and it actually needed adjustment. Money is tight for the trip, so I could obviously do without the expense...

Thanks!
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Old 09-21-2011, 09:05 AM   #2
reinerka
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I'm now at 40K miles and have yet to adjust a single valve.

Shim under bucket don't wear that easily (read adjustments are rare) but not unheared off. For piece of mind I would still have them do the check for piece of mind. Nothing can be worse on such a trip than to worry if you did the right thing. It's like leaving with worn out tires and not being sure they carry you home again.

On our GL1800 (same shim design) it took about 70K miles until the first adjustment was needed. Then it was almost like a recurring theme as in the course of the next 50K miles EVERY shim needed to be changed (12 total). The process would recurr after about another 70K miles.....

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Old 09-21-2011, 09:41 AM   #3
Camel ADV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by selecus View Post
Hey Gang,

I currently have about 14k kms on the bike, I'm heading south to TDF from Montreal in a couple weeks, by the time I get to Houston I'll be approaching 20K kms, wondering if I should bother with the valve adjustment service before I cross into Mexico.

On previous bikes, every time I've brought it in for valve adjustment, everything has been fine, no adjustment was necessary...usually money well wasted. So I'm wondering how many of you brought the 8GS in and it actually needed adjustment. Money is tight for the trip, so I could obviously do without the expense...

Thanks!
YES, CHECK THE VALVES!

You're at 14,000km now, Montreal to TDF is 30,000km-ish so 44,000km without at least checking them is taking a big chance. If money is tight enough that you're concerned about the couple hundred to get the clearances checked/adjusted then dealing with a motor that needs a complete head overhaul due to burnt valves is definitely going to stress your budget!

Also, if you need shims, they will likely be easier/faster to get in North America than at a dealer farther into your trip.

Check them yourself if you're really worried about spending the money.

Step by step valve adjustment

Cory
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Old 09-21-2011, 09:47 AM   #4
ScienceOfDirt
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Have them put the valves in the center of the tolerance if you have them checked even if they're in spec. That puts you furthest from trouble in my book.
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Old 09-21-2011, 12:05 PM   #5
selecus OP
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Well guess that settles it, I'll get it done, thanks for your input everyone...
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Old 09-21-2011, 05:29 PM   #6
MikeMike
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Local dealer here quotes at least a two week wait for shims as they don't stock them, imagine that.
Now you know why I get so "encabronado" with them.
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Old 09-22-2011, 06:51 AM   #7
TheCowboy
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50,000+ miles - no valve adjustments... she is running just fine and I have no plans to do a valve adjustment just yet... hey, just sayin....

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Old 09-22-2011, 07:17 AM   #8
FredRydr
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Originally Posted by MikeMike View Post
Local dealer here quotes at least a two week wait for shims as they don't stock them, imagine that.
Now you know why I get so "encabronado" with them.
Shims could be overnighted from the distribution center for the cost of a flat-rate envelope. Doesn't make sense. Someone's being lazy.

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Old 09-22-2011, 08:42 AM   #9
Camel ADV
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Originally Posted by Cowboy2 View Post
50,000+ miles - no valve adjustments... she is running just fine and I have no plans to do a valve adjustment just yet... hey, just sayin....

TheCowboy
No one said an adjustment would be required. I'm at 67,000km and haven't had any out of spec but I still check them every 15,000-20,000km.

Quote:
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Shims could be overnighted from the distribution center for the cost of a flat-rate envelope. Doesn't make sense. Someone's being lazy.

Fred
Mike is in Mexico.
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Old 09-22-2011, 11:14 AM   #10
reinerka
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Local dealer here quotes at least a two week wait for shims as they don't stock them, imagine that.
Now you know why I get so "encabronado" with them.
That is strange, unless they have yet to adjust a bike. Normally dealers would keep the old shims and use them on another bike when needed as the shims don't really wear out.

When I used to need shims for the GoldWing I walked to the service department (not the parts department) and got what I needed immediately (they didn't stock any shims in the parts department). If I would have swapped the shims they would have given them for free (not the $8 they normally cost). They had all sizes in abundance....

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Old 09-22-2011, 11:23 AM   #11
uraberg
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Originally Posted by ScienceOfDirt View Post
Have them put the valves in the center of the tolerance if you have them checked even if they're in spec. That puts you furthest from trouble in my book.
You may want to reconsider this. Since normal wear will always decrease the valve clearance, setting the clearance at the wide end of spec is a better way to go. Really, only carbon buildup may increase the valve clearance, but this usually manifests with noticeable power loss, and is not necessarily harmful to components. Running zero clearance is where you start to see real damage.
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Old 09-23-2011, 11:08 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by uraberg View Post
You may want to reconsider this. Since normal wear will always decrease the valve clearance, setting the clearance at the wide end of spec is a better way to go. Really, only carbon buildup may increase the valve clearance, but this usually manifests with noticeable power loss, and is not necessarily harmful to components. Running zero clearance is where you start to see real damage.
What are you basing that logic on?

Most every overhead cam engine the wear is between valve rocker arm and cam lobes. This wear will cause the valve clearance to increase with wear rather than decrease. As the wear in the valve train removes metal from the cam lobes and the rocker arm follower the shims will need to increase in thickness to keep the valve clearance in specification.

The only way the valve clearance can decrease is if the valve is forced up into valve seat. If this is happening then you have a bigger problem as this will dictate you removing the head and replacing the valve seats as the valve seats should be made of hard enough material to prevent the valve from being forced upwards.
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Old 09-24-2011, 07:14 AM   #13
MikeMike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reinerka View Post
That is strange, unless they have yet to adjust a bike. Normally dealers would keep the old shims and use them on another bike when needed as the shims don't really wear out.

When I used to need shims for the GoldWing I walked to the service department (not the parts department) and got what I needed immediately (they didn't stock any shims in the parts department). If I would have swapped the shims they would have given them for free (not the $8 they normally cost). They had all sizes in abundance....

Reiner
That is at a normal dealership. I have a suspicion that they have yet to actually adjust the valves on an F800 or 650 at this local dealership. Yes, they can do a check with a simple "go/no go" method like they were supposed to have done on my F650 at the 20k service. However, when I asked them what the measurements were they had no idea what I was talking about. I told them that if they measured each valve clearance they should have recorded it as a service to the customer and noted the measurements on the service order. They told me they have never done that. The chief mechanic has not completed his factory training and has a gaggle of wannabees working with him. I am now going to use another dealer for service but it is a 400km ride and I will only use them if absolutely necessary.
My bike is out of warranty (though they didn't honor many claims I had but that is another story), a friend of mine has the same bike but with more miles so we are going to do his valve check first. If they need adjusting, he will probably take it to the dealer 400kms away for that. BMW service appears to vary from the sublime to the ridiculous throughout the world and I am unfortunately stuck with a dealer at the wrong end of that linear measure!
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Old 09-24-2011, 02:30 PM   #14
itsatdm
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These are not a shim on bucket or shim under bucket valve system. This is a conical "shim cap" that fits on top of the valve stem. The cam lobe connects to a following lever connected to the valve stem
Typically any wear tightens the valve clearance. I do not know how much wear occurs to the "cap" an I doubt they are measured and saved. They are cheap and would not bother with discards. I thought it important enough to have the dealer to do them to ensure warranty problems, though ther has been very little wear reported.
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Old 09-24-2011, 05:17 PM   #15
vtbob
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FWIW I has my 12000mile/20k service done and the valves needed no adjustment.

The cost is getting to the valves to check them...doing to soon is clearly a waste of money IMHO

I would not worry about your trip...do it Save the money and get it done when you get back

enjoy

ps the dealer said doing the next check at 24000 miles/40 is the proper interval
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