ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Old's Cool > Airheads
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-21-2013, 09:25 AM   #1
freud OP
Adventurer
 
freud's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Location: Mexico City
Oddometer: 77
R65 1980 Proyect

Hello, last week we bought a 1980 R65 and the proyect has begun.
A good friend of mine is helping me so he will appear in some photos.

I say we because is a proyect of my GF and I. She drives G650gs and I have a F800Gs and we wanted to reuse a bike, so we started looking for a bike to bring back to full life.

The first shot is of the bike how we got it.


The second is a first proyection of what we are after, there are some parts missing, I know :) It was something I made in photoshop while looking at a movie.



And the third is the bike in the garage in its actual condition.


freud screwed with this post 10-21-2013 at 09:48 AM
freud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2013, 09:36 AM   #2
freud OP
Adventurer
 
freud's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Location: Mexico City
Oddometer: 77
I just got a multimeter to start testig it all but right now I'm struggling with with some electrical components.

Turn signals and hazard light not working.
Instrument backlight not working.
Tachometer not working.
Speedometer (has no cable, only the housing) not working
The bike won't start unless it's in Neutral and the clutch is pulled.
Stop Lights are not working.



I have the haynes diagram but it seems insufficent as it does not mention where diodes or relays should be placed and what kind of them are to be used.

I started checking the harness that goes to the front and many cables were in bad condition, well, all thad had a connection or division, in the connections corrosion had done its evil, i'm trying to fix that. The cables are very corroded, i tried to clean them up but dirty as they are i can't weld them so i used pressure connections. Some terminals are not conecting.





I don't know yet if the key cylinder is the original but apparently not and it had some cables bridged.



The relays I've tested are working (the three small ones shown at the left), but haven't checked all of the relays.


There's a big one I have not tested in the middle.(I believe it's a relay)
The relay module located in the fuse case is unchecked, the fuses are ok.

At least the headlamp turns on (the ingnition key switch has 3 position only: center is off, left is on without lights and right is on with lights) But seems weird.

The bike starts easlily and runs and stops. The front brakes are worse than the rear ones so maybe there's something wrong with the front one, I don't know as i haven't ridden anything to compare with. I has an ATE caliper.

Anyone konws of an effective method to clean the cables to be able to weld them?

What can I use to clean the terminals on the conections?

Is there a full diagram that includes diodes and relays?


Thanks.

freud screwed with this post 10-21-2013 at 09:55 AM
freud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 01:47 AM   #3
Plaka
Brevis illi vita est
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Oddometer: 4,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by freud View Post
I just got a multimeter to start testig it all but right now I'm struggling with with some electrical components.

Turn signals and hazard light not working.
Instrument backlight not working.
Tachometer not working.
Speedometer (has no cable, only the housing) not working
The bike won't start unless it's in Neutral and the clutch is pulled.
Stop Lights are not working.



I have the haynes diagram but it seems insufficent as it does not mention where diodes or relays should be placed and what kind of them are to be used.

I started checking the harness that goes to the front and many cables were in bad condition, well, all thad had a connection or division, in the connections corrosion had done its evil, i'm trying to fix that. The cables are very corroded, i tried to clean them up but dirty as they are i can't weld them so i used pressure connections. Some terminals are not conecting.





I don't know yet if the key cylinder is the original but apparently not and it had some cables bridged.



The relays I've tested are working (the three small ones shown at the left), but haven't checked all of the relays.


There's a big one I have not tested in the middle.(I believe it's a relay)
The relay module located in the fuse case is unchecked, the fuses are ok.

At least the headlamp turns on (the ingnition key switch has 3 position only: center is off, left is on without lights and right is on with lights) But seems weird.

The bike starts easlily and runs and stops. The front brakes are worse than the rear ones so maybe there's something wrong with the front one, I don't know as i haven't ridden anything to compare with. I has an ATE caliper.

Anyone konws of an effective method to clean the cables to be able to weld them?

What can I use to clean the terminals on the conections?

Is there a full diagram that includes diodes and relays?


Thanks.
get a Clymenr manual to go with your Haynes. yes, the haynes was cheaper, but it doesn't cover as much.

learn the wiring diagram backwards and forwards. Break it down into the important circuits, there are not many, then it is pretty easy to understand---only a couple tricky points. The bit with it wanting the clutch pulled in even if it's in neutral is one of the tricky points---the neutral switch isn't working.

untill you have ALL the connections clean and correct you don't know what's going on. Do this first. Somewhere around the end of the winter when you are done you can start sorting out what is broken and why. Fill out your profile, it will help.

Cleaning corroded wire is very difficult. I sometimes use fine sandpaper, some times use an air eraser, baking soda and a BIG shop vac to suck up the soda before it can get into things.

identify components by the color code of the wiring going to them. That BIG relay is the voltage regulator. You have only a single diode, part of the starting circuit, maybe a couple hidden in some relays you can live without once you know what they do, and your diode board or rectifier---you don't play with that. just clean the connections..

You are very lucky to have this project, and for so little money too!. You will be the top expert here on the electrical system in no time at all.
Plaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 07:15 AM   #4
Pokie
Just plain Pokie.
 
Pokie's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2013
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Oddometer: 693
I use Oatly Liquid Soldering Flux for cleaning and soldering corroded wires, it also works great for cables. Dip a Q-Tip into the flux and wipe it on the wire before trying to solder, works great! If you are soldering a really badly corroded wire or cable, dip the wire or cable straight into the liquid flux and it will clean everything inside as well. I bought it at the hardware store.
Pokie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 08:54 AM   #5
rambozo
Gnarly Adventurer
 
rambozo's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: N. Ireland
Oddometer: 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokie View Post
I use Oatly Liquid Soldering Flux for cleaning and soldering corroded wires, it also works great for cables. Dip a Q-Tip into the flux and wipe it on the wire before trying to solder, works great! If you are soldering a really badly corroded wire or cable, dip the wire or cable straight into the liquid flux and it will clean everything inside as well. I bought it at the hardware store.
+1

I usually sand the wire a bit and use liquid flux, works great
rambozo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 10:35 AM   #6
freud OP
Adventurer
 
freud's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Location: Mexico City
Oddometer: 77
I was given, by a local friend, a clymer diagram.

I located two gremlin eggs:



The diode is leaking in both directions and the relay (VW by the way) is not working, both were inside in the fuse box, this may be one less problem.

I'll keep udating
freud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 10:49 AM   #7
Plaka
Brevis illi vita est
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Oddometer: 4,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokie View Post
I use Oatly Liquid Soldering Flux for cleaning and soldering corroded wires, it also works great for cables. Dip a Q-Tip into the flux and wipe it on the wire before trying to solder, works great! If you are soldering a really badly corroded wire or cable, dip the wire or cable straight into the liquid flux and it will clean everything inside as well. I bought it at the hardware store.
The Oatey #11 is an acid flux. It is extremely corrosive, both acid and chlorides---that's why it cleans so well. Check the MSDS. Unless every last bit of the stuff is removed, it will cause far worse corrosion than you started with. if it wicks up the wiring inside the jacket it will promote more corrosion up there, eventually causing some rather difficult to find failures. See that 10-20% hydrochloric acid? Ya, keeps right on chewing up the copper until it's exhausted.

(I know, except for you. it's the net after all...).


Only Rosin type fluxes should b used for electrical work unless you have the gear to get an acid flux cleaned off---which is harder than getting the corrosion off in the first place.
Plaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 10:51 AM   #8
Plaka
Brevis illi vita est
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Oddometer: 4,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by freud View Post
I was given, by a local friend, a clymer diagram.

I located two gremlin eggs:



The diode is leaking in both directions and the relay (VW by the way) is not working, both were inside in the fuse box, this may be one less problem.

I'll keep udating
Get the Clymer manual.

It isn't fair to keep asking questions that people just look up in their Clymer manuals. RTFM you know?
Plaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 11:21 AM   #9
freud OP
Adventurer
 
freud's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Location: Mexico City
Oddometer: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaka View Post
Get the Clymer manual.

It isn't fair to keep asking questions that people just look up in their Clymer manuals. RTFM you know?
Why all the hate?

If it bothers you so much, don't do it, sorry if it bothers you so much, but I can't get a Clymer manual locally I have to wait unitl it arrives by mail in a couple of weeks, I don't even know what's in the manual, in the meantime internet has a lot of things and forums which I intend to use.
freud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 11:32 AM   #10
Plaka
Brevis illi vita est
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Oddometer: 4,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by freud View Post
Why all the hate?

If it bothers you so much, don't do it, sorry if it bothers you so much, but I can't get a Clymer manual locally I have to wait unitl it arrives by mail in a couple of weeks, I don't even know what's in the manual, in the meantime internet has a lot of things and forums which I intend to use.
Not hate, but lots of us know more about what you are headed into than you do. We (I) also see plenty of flailing from people who don't get manuals. (why??)

I said to fill out your profile. There is a reason. if you want to be effective at gathering information, people need to know at least roughly where you are.

You have made some sort-of errors so far. not really mistakes, but just things you don't understand well (like that VW relay). Not a big deal or I would have commented. it will all work out when you understand the circuits---and you will.


I can't get a Clymers locally either. Or a M14 x 1.25 die for that matter. Takes a week or so to have that stuff shipped. Or I can maybe drive 40 miles into the city and find them somewhere.
Plaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 11:55 AM   #11
freud OP
Adventurer
 
freud's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Location: Mexico City
Oddometer: 77
Fair enough, I updated my profile, but I can't get the manual in the country either. From amazon takes a couple of weeks or three times the money of the manual just for the shipping, so I preffer to have it in a couple of weeks.

I don't imply that the relay is not working just because it's a VW, I know there are several VW and other brands which offer suitable pieces, but I tested the relay and it's stuck. I implied that some of the previous owners had already used an alternative piece for that particular relay.

Maybe it's even repairable, but sow far I'm sure I found two parts out of order,

freud screwed with this post 10-22-2013 at 12:01 PM
freud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 12:06 PM   #12
Plaka
Brevis illi vita est
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Oddometer: 4,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by freud View Post
Fair enough, I updated my profile, but I can't get the manual in the country either. From amazon takes a couple of weeks or three times the money of the manual just for the shipping, so I preffer to have it in a couple of weeks.

I don't imply that the relay is not working just because it's a VW, I know there are several VW and other brands which offer suitable pieces, but I tested the relay and it's stuck. I implied that some of the previous owners had already used an alternative piece for that particular relay.

Maybe it's even repairable, but sow far I'm sure I found two parts out of order,
It's a standard relay, dozens of different ones will work. That VW/Audi one is likely a Bosch, which will be good quality. Somebody made a good move there. Look for a little wiring diagram on the side of it. the terminal numbers are the same on all. In a pinch you can open them up and try to save them. A broken coil wire is hopeless, but sometimes you can free up corroded (not burnt) contacts and get them working again---at least for awhile.

If your starter is starting the bike the starter relay (probably the one in the metal can) is working. that's the critical one.
Plaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 02:44 PM   #13
freud OP
Adventurer
 
freud's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Location: Mexico City
Oddometer: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaka View Post
It's a standard relay, dozens of different ones will work. That VW/Audi one is likely a Bosch, which will be good quality. Somebody made a good move there. Look for a little wiring diagram on the side of it. the terminal numbers are the same on all. In a pinch you can open them up and try to save them. A broken coil wire is hopeless, but sometimes you can free up corroded (not burnt) contacts and get them working again---at least for awhile.

If your starter is starting the bike the starter relay (probably the one in the metal can) is working. that's the critical one.
The bike is running fine. But it has many electrical gremlins.

The crucial stuff works:
Engine runs.
Battery is charging.
Generator, Pressure High beam lights are working fine.
Headlamp turns on and switches to high and low beams do their job.


Hazard lights and turn signals not working, and no current is being delivered to the harness where they are plugged. The Original turn signal are long gone and in the fron lines, there was a massive short circuit that destroyed the cables, now that part's been removed and fixed.

Tachometer is not responding

The instrument lights are down.

Stop lights are not working, not the front nor the rear. i havent checked the rear brake switch the front one could be dead, the lines are fine. I'll check it today, if not I understand theres a VW that suits. I have the master cylinder in the handlebars not under the tank, and the sensor is located in the line splitter for the optional dual brake setup.

I inspected yesterday near the gear shift pedal ant there's a mess of cables.
Neutral, must be dead, clutch seems to be working.

I'l buy another flasher relay as I guess they are cheap and get the diode, I remember having read somewhere in bmwmotorcycletech.info that most 30amp diodes can do the job.

The relay seems like a copy, the quality is not very good and there's no diagram.

I leave home at 8:30a.m. and arrive home at 9:30p.m. so I only have 2-3 hours for the bike a day at most, sleeping roughly 6.5 hours a day,fortunately there's a weekend every week :)

Thanks.
freud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 02:58 PM   #14
Plaka
Brevis illi vita est
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Oddometer: 4,556
Quote:
Originally Posted by freud View Post
The bike is running fine. But it has many electrical gremlins.

The crucial stuff works:
Engine runs.
Battery is charging.
Generator, Pressure High beam lights are working fine.
Headlamp turns on and switches to high and low beams do their job.


Hazard lights and turn signals not working, and no current is being delivered to the harness where they are plugged. The Original turn signal are long gone and in the fron lines, there was a massive short circuit that destroyed the cables, now that part's been removed and fixed.

Tachometer is not responding

The instrument lights are down.

Stop lights are not working, not the front nor the rear. i havent checked the rear brake switch the front one could be dead, the lines are fine. I'll check it today, if not I understand theres a VW that suits. I have the master cylinder in the handlebars not under the tank, and the sensor is located in the line splitter for the optional dual brake setup.

I inspected yesterday near the gear shift pedal ant there's a mess of cables.
Neutral, must be dead, clutch seems to be working.

I'l buy another flasher relay as I guess they are cheap and get the diode, I remember having read somewhere in bmwmotorcycletech.info that most 30amp diodes can do the job.

The relay seems like a copy, the quality is not very good and there's no diagram.

I leave home at 8:30a.m. and arrive home at 9:30p.m. so I only have 2-3 hours for the bike a day at most, sleeping roughly 6.5 hours a day,fortunately there's a weekend every week :)

Thanks.
What diode? I think you may be using the wrong term here. What is the wire color to and from the thing? A diode will be rated in Watts, not amps.

Quote:
I leave home at 8:30a.m. and arrive home at 9:30p.m. so I only have 2-3 hours for the bike a day at most, sleeping roughly 6.5 hours a day,fortunately there's a weekend every week :)
NO EXCUSES!!. Sleep less, wire more. Women weaken wiring!.
Plaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2013, 05:06 PM   #15
Jon-Lars
Jon-Lars
 
Jon-Lars's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Location: Beverly
Oddometer: 537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaka View Post
What diode? I think you may be using the wrong term here. What is the wire color to and from the thing? A diode will be rated in Watts, not amps.
Actually, diodes are specified in volts and amps, not watts.
__________________
Cheers, Jon-Lars Sorenson
Beverly, WA
http://www.facebook.com/BMWR90S

Jon-Lars screwed with this post 10-22-2013 at 05:59 PM
Jon-Lars is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 04:56 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014