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Old 10-30-2011, 02:42 PM   #226
Ginger Beard
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Originally Posted by lemieuxmc View Post
........

But should conceding to bad behavior be acceptable ?

Should people just give up rights because others feel a need to be bullies ?

Why should cyclists roll over and piss on themselves like a frightened dog just because assholes within our society feel the need to act like bratty children on a playground ?
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Old 10-30-2011, 02:54 PM   #227
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You might think that "taking the lane" prevents them from running you over, but that is just like my dog thinking that his barking at the oncoming cars is what makes them stop at the crosswalk. He doesn't realize that the people in the cars noticed the red light, he thinks they were impressed by his barking.

Like I said before, asserting your right to use the lane only works on conscientious, considerate and coherent drivers. Perhaps "open carry" would be more effective at enlightening bad drivers?

I never say that people who get hit "had it coming", I simply try to point out that being more aware, and dare I say... cautious, would prevent many crashes on motorcycles (and cars, bicycles, aircraft, etc.).
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Old 10-30-2011, 03:38 PM   #228
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The proper attitude when cycling -- either motorbike or pedalbike -- is as follows:

Quote:
My attitude is, anyone can run you down and get away with it. Why give some drunk the chance to plaster me against a car? That's why I don't even own a bike light, or one of those godawful reflective suits. Because if you've put yourself in a position where someone has to see you in order for you to be safe -- to see you, and give a fuck -- you've already blown it.
The proper way to assertively take a lane:

Quote:
The problem is, if the two drivers at the front of a line aren't sufficiently aggressive, it doesn't matter how tough the people behind them are. The whole avenue will just sit there until it collectively boils over. And horn honking wasn't helping, though a hundred or so motorists were giving it a try.

When i got to charlesgate west, where comm ave was cut off by the torrent pouring down that one-way four-laner, I found an underpowered station wagon from Maine at the head of one lane, driven by a mom who was trying to look after four children, and a vintage Mercades in the other, driven by an old lad who looked like she'd forgotten her own address. And half a dozen bicyclists, standing there waiting for a real asshole to take charge.

What you have to do is take it one lane at a time. I waited for a twenty-foot gap in traffic on the first lane of Charlesgate and just eased out into it.

The approaching BMW made an abortive swerve toward the next lane, causing a ripple to spread across Charlesgate as everyone for ten cars back tried to head east. Then he throbbed to a halt (computerized anti-lock braking system) and slumped over on his horn button.

The next lane was easy; some Camaro-driving freshman from Jersey made the mistake of slowing down and I siezed his lane. The asshole in the BMW tried to cut behind me, but half the bicyclists, and the biddy in the Benz, had the presence of mind to lurch out and block his path.

Within ten seconds, a huge gap showed up in the third lane, and I ate it up before the Camaro could swerve over. I ate it up so aggressively that some Clerk Typist II in a Civic slowed down in the fourth lane long enough for me to grab that one, too. And then the dam broke as the Chadian army mounted a charge and reamed out the intersection. I figured BMW, Camaro, and Civic could shut their engines off and go for a walk.

Pedestrians and winos applauded. A young six-digit lawyer, hardly old enough to shave, cruised up from ten cars back and shouted out his electric sunroof that I really had balls.

I said, "Tell me something I don't know, you fucking android from Hell."
All hail Neal Stephenson!
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Old 10-30-2011, 03:46 PM   #229
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Originally Posted by bwalsh View Post
Substitute the word "motorcycle" instead of "bicycle" in your rant and get back to us.


This general attitude of "I'm in a bigger vehicle than you so you should get out of my way" or "you shouldn't be out here on the road" is lame...
Substituted. No problem. At least with my motorcycles, I have a healthy loudness handle, superior brakes and better road holding than a bicycle; and most cars for that matter. If I'm vulnerable to injury on my lightweight vehicle why would I want one that under-performs cars and trucks?

The vehicles I choose to use on the road allow me to assert myself if my safety is at risk. My bicycles does not which leaves me at the mercy of others and while the legal system may favor the intrepid bicyclist, physics favor heavier vehicles. That's my take and I'm sticking to it.

You can do what you want.

What do you say about registering and insuring bicycles and riders for sharing public roads?
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Old 10-30-2011, 04:13 PM   #230
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Originally Posted by erkmania View Post
Substituted. No problem. At least with my motorcycles, I have a healthy loudness handle, superior brakes

I've got a Hayes hydraulic disk on the front my stump jumper.

why would I want one that under-performs cars and trucks?

Uhhh, because it's legal.

The vehicles I choose to use on the road allow me to assert myself if my safety is at risk. My bicycles does not which leaves me at the mercy of others and while the legal system may favor the intrepid bicyclist, physics favor heavier vehicles. That's my take and I'm sticking to it.

I don't remember if I mentioned it on this thread but I was almost hit by someone...and do NOT ride bicycles on the road.

You can do what you want.

Cool!

What do you say about registering and insuring bicycles and riders for sharing public roads?


Like I've said before, I don't ride or even own a street bike so I'm not in a position to answer that question. But as someone who does share the road with cyclists I think it is a dumb idea. Why? It's such a small percentage.
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Old 10-30-2011, 04:20 PM   #231
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Originally Posted by erkmania View Post


What do you say about registering and insuring bicycles and riders for sharing public roads?
Are you cool with registering your shoes and being forced to carry insurance on them ?

Seriously, you want to charge cyclists for being victimized by other motorists ? With that type of logic maybe we can start a campaign to force quire boys to carry molestation insurance.
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Old 10-30-2011, 04:50 PM   #232
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Originally Posted by wishin4woods View Post
Are you cool with registering your shoes and being forced to carry insurance on them ?

Seriously, you want to charge cyclists for being victimized by other motorists ? With that type of logic maybe we can start a campaign to force quire boys to carry molestation insurance.
Insuring shoes is funny. You're a comedian, right?

It's pretty hard to lose control of your shoes and cause calamity unless you're into suicide and flinging yourself into the path of an oncoming car. As I said, I saw the outcome of a bicyclist that was traveling too fast, lost control of his bicycle and take out a motorcyclist. I'm sure the act wasn't intentional, but why shouldn't THAT bicyclist be insured and be able to compensate his victim for HIS loses?

I respect your desire to show that bicyclists are the only victims, but I've seen otherwise. Bicyclists, on rare occasions, victimize others. They/we should be insured for that. How hard is that to understand?

If you hurt someone and it's your fault then why would you be reticent to help them recover to health? I don't get that.

I hate insurance like the next guy, but I don't want some poor schmuck taking me out and leaving me injured without an ability to pay my mortgage.
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Old 10-30-2011, 04:54 PM   #233
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As a kid, I learned to look both ways before entering the road, and that all roads were not equal. Some roads I could ride my bicycle on to get to school, home, a friend's house, etc. Some roads could even be used for kickball, skateboarding, 500, touch football, etc. Some were for motor vehicles only. Somehow, I never got killed, hit, screamed at, etc., until asshole cagers started trying to drive in the bike lanes, or "buzz" (or otherwise harass)cyclists riding down the right side of the right lane.

Register and insure bicycles? You Einsteins wanna explain how a 5-15yr old is gonna pay registration and insurance, especially with no government ID? In the state of FL, many motorcyclists don't even have to have insurance. A buddy of mine has a street-legal 50cc chopper that he doesn't even need a license for.

Should we register and insure skateboards, rollerblades, rollerskates, wheelchairs, walkers, mobility scooters, and our spandex walking tights too?

I rather prefer reforming our driver licensing/education first, to a mix of the Italian system and the German system...no license needed until your first collision, then you have to go for training until you're a damn ice-rally champion or something...with re-testing every year. 'Can't rally-race on ice competently enough? Can't stop causing collisions? Can' stay sober/awake/attentive behind the wheel? Can't stop harassing other road users? You're on a bicycle until you can demonstrate otherwise.
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Old 10-30-2011, 05:36 PM   #234
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Originally Posted by Balanzed View Post
Man, you 'Merikans need to learn some road culture! All your fucking anger, bicyclist, motorcyclist, cagers and pedestrians are all one big knot of anger waiting to spew. I have been driving semis, cage, motorcycle and my bicycle and the aggressiveness towards me on/in any of those vehicles are astounding to me.
Where the fuck are you going in such a hurry? Sheesh!

Apart from that, when I'm on my motorcycle and meet any of those idiot spandex clad ass wipes I give them as much room as is safe for the both of us. When I'm on my bicycle I stay as far to the right as I can, but the shoulders in the US is not always a nice place to be for a bicycle especially after a hard winter. When I'm in a car and there's no good sight lines I'll stay behind them till I can pass and I don't give a hoot how slow they're going, I only have to push down on a pedal to go faster, no strain on me whatsoever and even if I had to stay behind them for 2-3 minutes it'll only delay me at my destination by....wait...plus and plus is equal to...2-3 minutes! Yeah, that'll ruin my day!

Calm the hell down out there in traffic people. Close to 40.000 US people are killed in traffic every year just trying to get from point A to point B.
Well said! No shit, what's 2 or three minutes compared to possibly killing someone? Why can't we be calm, courteous, and share?

I'm an avid bicyclist and have also been motorcycling for 49 years now, about the same time I've been bicycling. I think the number one thing to keep in mind is just common courtesy and safety. Giving a cyclist 3 feet of separation is OK if the speed difference is 20 mph, but if you're blowing by at +50 or +60 then that just ain't enough. Even if you don't bicycle, try standing or walking along the road as a car whips by at 60 mph and see how much you like it. Slow down and give the cyclist as much room as it takes to be safe.

I've ridden 1000's of miles on bicycles through a lot of different national parks (including Yellowstone and Grand Teton when I lived in Wyoming) and now live just a few miles from the Blue Ridge Parkway and bike there a lot. I'm continually amazed how many people are in such a ferking hurry to get through the park even when on vacation that they are willing to run a cyclist off the road rather than slow down and get to the next attraction or vista 2 minutes later. Aren't you there to enjoy the place, what's the damned rush?? That said, I totally agree that cyclists have the responsibility to ride safely and courteously as well - I've ridden in groups that weren't and did not like it, so I don't ride with those people any longer.

Doug
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Old 10-30-2011, 08:07 PM   #235
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Originally Posted by erkmania View Post
Insuring shoes is funny. You're a comedian, right?

It's pretty hard to lose control of your shoes and cause calamity unless you're into suicide and flinging yourself into the path of an oncoming car.
Evidently not. Dumbass and/or clumsy pedestrians cause plenty of calamity on a regular basis.

You don't live in a major city with a lot of both pedestrian and vehicular traffic do you?

*Edited to add: Nope. You're allegedly in San Diego. Compared to NYC or Chicago, NOBODY walks in SoCal. As light as SD traffic is, I could probably blaze through downtown SD surface streets at damn near freeway speeds. 'Last I saw, cops actually ticket for jaywalking in SoCal too. They'd need an army of traffic cops on every downtown block to curtail the number of pedestrians jumping off of curbs without right of way in the busier major cities.

Quote:
If you hurt someone and it's your fault then why would you be reticent to help them recover to health? I don't get that.

I hate insurance like the next guy, but I don't want some schmuck taking me out and leaving me injured without an ability to pay my mortgage.
We cyclists feel the same way about irresponsible cagers, but additional laws haven't worked so well to protect US from THEM, have they? Now the insurance laws are just another ticket the cops can write to collect revenue, and more money that the insurance industry can charge the public, and more settlements that the lawyers can make a bundle on...off the backs of the people responsible enough to care if they're legal to be on the road. Don't have a license, don't have insurance, don't have a legal right to be in the country, and don't care? No problem. The system will often let you go without even trying to hassle you. The people trying to be somewhat responsible will foot the bill for ya.

Liability insurance for a vehicle less likely to do damage than a motorcycle, or even a moped, shouldn't be forced upon kids who aren't even old enough to handle a paper route.

I'm of the opinion that bicycles should be allowed on the sidewalks...with pedestrian-present and obscured-sightline speed limits. A 30lb bicycle hitting a pedestrian at 5-10MPH is a lot less likely to do serious damage than a 3000lb vehicle hitting a cyclist at 30+MPH.

Kommando screwed with this post 10-30-2011 at 08:43 PM
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Old 10-30-2011, 08:39 PM   #236
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San Diego is a great place to ride your bicycle, but there are still plenty of morons that will ruin your whole day (by running your ass over!).

About 2 years ago I happened to be in Little Italy when a "Critical Mass" rolled by. I thought, Very Impressive... I'll just watch them go by and check it out. It was cool until some old gal pulled up to the 4-way stop and thought that the cyclists would pause and let her through. She saw a break in the line of bikes and started to pull out, when suddenly she was surrounded by cursing cyclists who flipped her off, slapped the hood and fenders of her Buick and verbally abused her for a few minutes until the group had passed. Fortunately, she just sat there with a dazed expression on her face and didn't freak out, punch the gas, and run over half a dozen urban hipsters on their fixies.

Never forget, assholes are everywhere!

Personally, I'm not worried because I have a plastic Jesus right there on the dashboard of my car.
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Old 10-30-2011, 08:51 PM   #237
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Originally Posted by lemieuxmc View Post
San Diego is a great place to ride your bicycle, but there are still plenty of morons that will ruin your whole day (by running your ass over!).

About 2 years ago I happened to be in Little Italy when a "Critical Mass" rolled by. I thought, Very Impressive... I'll just watch them go by and check it out. It was cool until some old gal pulled up to the 4-way stop and thought that the cyclists would pause and let her through. She saw a break in the line of bikes and started to pull out, when suddenly she was surrounded by cursing cyclists who flipped her off, slapped the hood and fenders of her Buick and verbally abused her for a few minutes until the group had passed. Fortunately, she just sat there with a dazed expression on her face and didn't freak out, punch the gas, and run over half a dozen urban hipsters on their fixies.

Never forget, assholes are everywhere!

Personally, I'm not worried because I have a plastic Jesus right there on the dashboard of my car.
You just sat there and watched, instead of saying something to them and/or calling police?

If I saw some woman getting assailed or menaced by a group, I wouldn't blame her for gassing it out of there, especially if they were blowing a stopsign to instigate the incident.

BTW, you really should upgrade to the plastic Hula Jesus for the dash.
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Old 10-31-2011, 05:59 AM   #238
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As a group, the San Diego bicyclists are the biggest bunch of douchebags I've ever seen. That's saying alot, bearing in mind we're talking about bicyclists here.
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Old 10-31-2011, 08:49 AM   #239
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Originally Posted by erkmania View Post

I saw the outcome of a bicyclist that was traveling too fast, lost control of his bicycle and take out a motorcyclist.
How many times have you seen or heard of that happening?

So anyone who skis, snowboards, rides a skateboard at a skate park, etc. ad nauseum(sp?), there are literally hundreds of examples of where one person could injure another in a public place/setting, should they be insured before being allowed to participate in said sport/activity?
I've heard of many people being injured or killed in ski slope accidents caused by others but not too many bicyclists terrorizing the streets.
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Old 10-31-2011, 09:21 AM   #240
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but not too many bicyclists terrorizing the streets.
You haven't been to a university campus lately
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