ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > The perfect line and other riding myths
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-17-2012, 11:21 AM   #796
LittleRedToyota
Yinzer
 
LittleRedToyota's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Oddometer: 2,074
Quote:
Originally Posted by _CJ View Post
Jesus, I wish that were the law everywhere. It would negate 90+% of the gripes I hear from drivers.
i'm curious what gripes you hear from drivers that would be negated by a rolling stop law?
LittleRedToyota is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 11:26 AM   #797
_CJ
Retrogrouch
 
_CJ's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Location: The 719, Yo.
Oddometer: 1,312
Quote:
Originally Posted by perterra View Post
I would only suggest what JVB does may be none of your concern, quit trying to control others and worry about your own shit.


__________________
.
.
Moto since 2011, DR350
MTB since 1991, Full-Rigid Steel 1x8
_CJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 11:39 AM   #798
JimVonBaden
"Cool" Aid!
 
JimVonBaden's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Alexandria, VA
Oddometer: 48,186
Quote:
Originally Posted by _CJ View Post
Jealous?

I'm sure you've never gone even one mile over the speed limit though....or rolled a stop sign when nobody was around. :

Weather or not a particular cyclist does or does not break the law is none of your concern. Mind your own business and quit trying to control what others do. You can only control your own actions and how you respond to others actions. Bitching and moaning about it isn't going to improve the quality of your life, or change the behavior of others. I can guarantee your argument won't hold water when you're standing in front of the judge trying to defend yourself for the harassment or assault of a cyclist.
You missed the point. I am not jealous, and am not a rules fanatic. I just fail to see why some advocate breaking the rules for bicycles. My motorcycle can easily pass on locations that cars can't, and I do. I don't expect the laws to change to reflect that reality.

By the way, why so bent on this and accusing me of some "harassment"?

Jim
JimVonBaden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 04:30 PM   #799
singletrackslayer
Legalize singletrack
 
singletrackslayer's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2011
Location: Morningwood, CO
Oddometer: 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by perterra View Post
they are special
I'm starting to believe your short bus theory . . .
__________________
This is Motorado . . .
singletrackslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 04:43 PM   #800
fallingoff
Banned
 
Joined: Jun 2011
Location: syd oz
Oddometer: 3,677
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
You missed the point. I am not jealous, and am not a rules fanatic. I just fail to see why some advocate breaking the rules for bicycles. My motorcycle can easily pass on locations that cars can't, and I do. I don't expect the laws to change to reflect that reality.

By the way, why so bent on this and accusing me of some "harassment"?

Jim

dear jim have you ever commuted on a push bike
across a large city
its like a motorbike
you learn tactics
to keep yourself safe
one of them is keep moving
hard to stop
put foot down
then go again
takes time
put you in danger longer
frustrates other road users

empathy is not a silly word jimmy

next time i will try
to keep it shorter

cheers

a real live person

fallingoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 06:24 PM   #801
JimVonBaden
"Cool" Aid!
 
JimVonBaden's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Alexandria, VA
Oddometer: 48,186
Quote:
Originally Posted by fallingoff View Post
dear jim have you ever commuted on a push bike
across a large city
its like a motorbike
you learn tactics
to keep yourself safe
one of them is keep moving
hard to stop
put foot down
then go again
takes time
put you in danger longer
frustrates other road users

empathy is not a silly word jimmy

next time i will try
to keep it shorter

cheers

a real live person

So

Rules

For others

Not you

Got

it.

Jim
JimVonBaden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 06:37 PM   #802
fallingoff
Banned
 
Joined: Jun 2011
Location: syd oz
Oddometer: 3,677
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
So

Rules

For others

Not you

Got

it.

Jim
dear jimmy
rules are guide lines
so we can get along
manners are the grease of society
i'm sure you and i
break rules/laws everyday
i try not to inconvenice other people
you still must learn empathy jimmy
i will break a law if my life is on the line
ie red light with a truck 6 inches away from my back tyre
i'm sure if you have any motorcycling experience
you would understand this.
same as a pushbike
sometimes breaking the law `to stay alive
i'm not condoning breaking laws/rules for the sake of it
now that would be silly jimmy
its like trying to take off my writing style
its quite funny
but i am handicapped
ie slightly dislexic/autistic
would you do the same to someone in a wheel chair
now that was below the belt by me and you jimmy

so read think understand other road users
we want respect as riders
we must give respect back

cheers
fallingoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 09:39 PM   #803
Rekd
Bitter Clinger
 
Rekd's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: So Cal
Oddometer: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gummee! View Post
What happens if you already own at least one? I don't want to be old, fat, and miserable so I deal with idiots in cars.

We'll put it this way: I have had a few pairs of wheels that ran $1500+. Then add tires at $80/ea. End up hitting a hole 'just wrong' and you get to pay out the nose. I don't expect you to hit potholes in your car, why expect me to ride my wheels that are MORE expensive in the crap?

M


Quote:
Originally Posted by jas67 View Post
Um... the road that I LIVE ON. Which I need to ride to get to anywhere else. What should I do, load my bicycle into the car, and drive to Maryland (from Hershey, PA) to find a road with a safe shoulder, every time I want to ride?
I know you're all hung up on slamming anyone who dares say bad things about cyclists, but shut up and read...

I'm talking about riders who have PERFECTLY GOOD, CALIFORNIA TAXPAYER APPROVED bike lanes that are NOT dirty, NOT full of pot holes, and PLENTY wide enough to ride 3 bikes side by side without being in the fucking road, and some idiot, (and by "some" I mean close to half of the ones I've seen) thinks it's his right to be IN 70 MPH TRAFFIC.

If you don't have room to ride safely with traffic in certain areas yet insist on doing it that's on you, not on me. If Joe Blow comes around the corner and doesn't see you because his face is buried in a text message it's going to be YOU that loses, not the car.

Man you guys are stubborn.
Rekd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 12:19 AM   #804
fallingoff
Banned
 
Joined: Jun 2011
Location: syd oz
Oddometer: 3,677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rekd View Post
I know you're all hung up on slamming anyone who dares say bad things about cyclists, but shut up and read...

I'm talking about riders who have PERFECTLY GOOD, CALIFORNIA TAXPAYER APPROVED bike lanes that are NOT dirty, NOT full of pot holes, and PLENTY wide enough to ride 3 bikes side by side without being in the fucking road, and some idiot, (and by "some" I mean close to half of the ones I've seen) thinks it's his right to be IN 70 MPH TRAFFIC.

If you don't have room to ride safely with traffic in certain areas yet insist on doing it that's on you, not on me. If Joe Blow comes around the corner and doesn't see you because his face is buried in a text message it's going to be YOU that loses, not the car.

Man you guys are stubborn.
yeh

your right
those cyclists
sh%t me
fallingoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 05:49 AM   #805
filmfan
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2011
Location: live free or die
Oddometer: 478
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rekd View Post
I know you're all hung up on slamming anyone who dares say bad things about cyclists, but shut up and read...

I'm talking about riders who have PERFECTLY GOOD, CALIFORNIA TAXPAYER APPROVED bike lanes that are NOT dirty, NOT full of pot holes, and PLENTY wide enough to ride 3 bikes side by side without being in the fucking road, and some idiot, (and by "some" I mean close to half of the ones I've seen) thinks it's his right to be IN 70 MPH TRAFFIC.

If you don't have room to ride safely with traffic in certain areas yet insist on doing it that's on you, not on me. If Joe Blow comes around the corner and doesn't see you because his face is buried in a text message it's going to be YOU that loses, not the car.

Man you guys are stubborn.
You're right, it's dumb to mix it up with cars if you don't have to.

OTH, the sort of bike lane you're talking about is pretty rare.

The "right to be dumb" may not be in the constitution, but it may as well be. There are plenty of people, piloting all sorts of vehicles, who don't fail to pass up an opportunity to exercise that right.
filmfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 05:57 AM   #806
Rekd
Bitter Clinger
 
Rekd's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: So Cal
Oddometer: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by fallingoff View Post
yeh

your right
those cyclists
sh%t me
I read one of your posts a few days ago. Do yourself a favor... don't bother writing anything to me, I won't be reading it. All I get out of your posts is carriage return infested blathering that probably sounds really cute in your head but is difficult to read at best. Quite frankly, when I read your post it gave me a headache.

Not trying to be offensive, just saying I'm not going to read your posts.

Later.
Rekd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 06:02 AM   #807
Rekd
Bitter Clinger
 
Rekd's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: So Cal
Oddometer: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by filmfan View Post
OTH, the sort of bike lane you're talking about is pretty rare.
No. They're not rare at all. They're stinkin' everywhere. On average they're wide enough for two bikes side by side with plenty of room to spare.

And the idiots that ride outside the oversized bike lanes without cause are not rare either.
Rekd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 06:07 AM   #808
mrt10x
Dumba$s Jarhead
 
mrt10x's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: Woodland Park, CO
Oddometer: 3,179
We are stubborn because we simply don’t agree that the majority of riders behave in this way. I am from SoCal, I grew up riding in Orange County, I went to college in San Diego and I have spent 7 of my 22 years in the Marines stationed in San Diego. I rode thousands of miles around San Diego in my last 4 year stint there from 2003-2007. On a normal 70-100 mile weekend ride from Poway to the coast then up PCH I would have to leave the "bike lane" literally hundreds of time per ride to avoid glass, sand, drains, or poorly maintained access covers. Why is “bike lane” in quotations? Because what you often view as a bike lane is in fact simply a shoulder, or safety lane. Just because there is a white line on the edge of the road, and another 3-4 feet of tarmac to the right of that line, does not mean this is a true bike lane. A bike lane would not have raised or sunken access points/man holes, or massive drainage grates, and would be swept by the street sweepers. There are actually far less true bike lanes than you think. This doesn’t even take into account the dozens and dozens of miles where I would forced into “traffic lanes” because cars were parked in the “bike lanes.”

We are stubborn because for every one of us whom you see running a stop sign or riding the white line, or drifting into a lane of traffic, we see a cager who thinks we should be riding on the sidewalk, or riding into oncoming traffic, or who will throw water at us from a passing open window, or throw firecrackers at us, or empty bottles. It is a combative relationship on the road and on the web.. so be it. I will continue to ride as I deem necessary to keep myself safe. I defy your ability to see what I am trying to avoid as you pass me in your cage or even on your motorcycle, and I reject your supposition that there are numerous riders who simply ride in the traffic lanes when there are serviceable bike lanes to be had... no experience rider would purposefully ride closer to the danger unless it is warranted by road/lane conditions. What is passable on a beach cruiser or mountain bike, or on a leisurely ride to work is not nearly as passable on a carbon fiber 700x21 wheel traveling at 25mph.

What I am a little surprised at is the combative attitude from other two wheel travelers. Motorcycle riders do things everyday that stretch the rules of the road to better protect themselves. Riding defensively on a bicycle, which lacks the motorcycles ability to power out of dangerous situations, often means riding aggressively. Now I know that sounds odd, how can aggressive riding be defensive? It allows you to maintain control of the environment you are riding in.. and I know as motorcyclists you understand this. You may reject a cyclists right to use the road on an equal level as a motorized vehicle..Luckily we have the law on our side, at least in CA. The rules, of course, apply to all. I choose to break some of those rules IOT make my ride safer and more efficient, the same way I do in my truck and on the motorcycle where I routinely run 5-10mph over the speed limit. If I get pulled over for rolling through a stop sign I will pay the price, just like I do if I get pulled over for speeding in my truck or on my motorcycle, hell I got a speeding ticket on my bicycle once. I personally will not run a stop sign if there are other cars in the area. I know that there are plenty of cyclists who will run all stop signs, I have no excuse for them.. but don’t paint all cyclists with your broad brushed hatred just because some of us are rude and ignorant… it is the same type of generalized hatred that non-motorcyclists paint you with their misguided generalizations.

I try to avoid these pointless threads, and I am sorry that I got involved in this one.. same reason I never venture into jomamma.. I don’t expect you to ever understand why cyclists do what they do, what I find surprising is that motorcyclists, who are painted by misguided broad brush generalizations by cagers, are just as biased towards bicyclists. If you think cagers are ignorant because they can never understand why you do what you do on your motorcycle, maybe you could benefit from trying to apply the same understanding you wish you could get from cagers, towards your fellow two wheeled travelers.
__________________
We are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of "security." And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine - and before we know it our lives are gone.
mrt10x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 06:10 AM   #809
Jim Moore
Beastly Adventurer
 
Jim Moore's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Jax, FL
Oddometer: 12,412
Quote:
Originally Posted by jas67 View Post
At least here in PA, often times the surface to the right of the white line is un-rideable for anything but a full suspension mountain bike. If you're on a skinny-tire road bike, forget it -- too damned rough, and often lots of gravel. Oh, and on a lot of the roads I ride, there is about 6-12" of paved surfaee to the right of the white line, and that often goes to zero abruptly. Add to that the stupid continuous drunk-alert rumble strip on that white line that will vibrate you right off your bikek when you cross it, and I often just end up staying just to the left of the white line. It is hard to notice these differences when blasting down the road on your car (or motorcycle) at 55-60 MPH.

Other states are different. Our neighboring state to the south, Maryland has wonderful biking lanes, often with a 6-8 foot wide smooth paved shoulder that is a joy to ride on -- which I do use if I'm lucky enough to be on such a road.
That makes perfect sense. One of the few posts in this 50+ page thread that does.
__________________
Jim Moore
Jax, FL

Pay the lady, PirateJohn, you thieving piece of garbage.
http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=949341
Jim Moore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 06:16 AM   #810
Rekd
Bitter Clinger
 
Rekd's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: So Cal
Oddometer: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt10x View Post
We are stubborn because we simply don’t agree that the majority of riders behave in this way. I am from SoCal, I grew up riding in Orange County, I went to college in San Diego and I have spent 7 of my 22 years in the Marines stationed in San Diego. I rode thousands of miles around San Diego in my last 4 year stint there from 2003-2007. On a normal 70-100 mile weekend ride from Poway to the coast then up PCH I would have to leave the "bike lane" literally hundreds of time per ride to avoid glass, sand, drains, or poorly maintained access covers. Why is “bike lane” in quotations? Because what you often view as a bike lane is in fact simply a shoulder, or safety lane. Just because there is a white line on the edge of the road, and another 3-4 feet of tarmac to the right of that line, does not mean this is a true bike lane. A bike lane would not have raised or sunken access points/man holes, or massive drainage grates, and would be swept by the street sweepers. There are actually far less true bike lanes than you think. This doesn’t even take into account the dozens and dozens of miles where I would forced into “traffic lanes” because cars were parked in the “bike lanes.” We are stubborn because for every one of us whom you see running a stop sign or riding the white line, or drifting into a lane of traffic, we see a cager who thinks we should be riding on the sidewalk, or riding into oncoming traffic, or who will throw water at us from a passing open window, or throw firecrackers at us, or empty bottles. It is a combative relationship on the road and on the web.. so be it. I will continue to ride as I deem necessary to keep myself safe. I defy your ability to see what I am trying to avoid as you pass me in your cage or even on your motorcycle, and I reject your supposition that there are numerous riders who simply ride in the traffic lanes when there are serviceable bike lanes to be had... no experience rider would purposefully ride closer to the danger unless it is warranted by road/lane conditions. What is passable on a beach cruiser or mountain bike, or on a leisurely ride to work is not nearly as passable on a carbon fiber 700x21 wheel traveling at 25mph. What I am a little surprised at is the combative attitude from other two wheel travelers. Motorcycle riders do things everyday that stretch the rules of the road to better protect themselves. Riding defensively on a bicycle, which lacks the motorcycles ability to power out of dangerous situations, often means riding aggressively. Now I know that sounds odd, how can aggressive riding be defensive? It allows you to maintain control of the environment you are riding in.. and I know as motorcyclists you understand this. You may reject a cyclists right to use the road on an equal level as a motorized vehicle..Luckily we have the law on our side, at least in CA. The rules, of course, apply to all. I choose to break some of those rules IOT make my ride safer and more efficient. If I get pulled over for rolling through a stop sign I will pay the price, just like I do if I get pulled over for speeding in my truck or on my motorcycle, hell I got a speeding ticket on my bicycle once. I personally will not run a stop sign if there are other cars in the area. I know that there are plenty of cyclists who will run all stop signs, I have no excuse for them.. but don’t paint all cyclists with your broad brushed hatred just because some of us are rude and ignorant… it is the same type of generalized hatred that non-motorcyclists paint you with their misguided generalizations. I try to avoid these pointless threads, and I a sorry that I got involved in this one.. same reason I never venture into jomamma.. I don’t expect you to ever understand why cyclists do what they do, what I find surprising is that motorcyclists, who are painted by misguided broad brush generalizations by cagers, are just as biased towards bicyclists. If you think cagers are ignorant because they can never understand why you do what you do on your motorcycle, maybe you could benefit from trying to apply the same understanding you wish you could get from cagers, towards your fellow two wheeled travelers.

First of all, thanks for your service.

I don't think it's the 'majority' of riders, but it is getting very close to half around here. It's a lot. If you see more than a couple of single riders on a commute it's a sure bet one of them will be out in traffic or damned close to it when they've got plenty of room.

And I'm not talking about people that come out into traffic to avoid a hazard on the lane every mile. I'm talking about riding out there.

As to your last statement, you're wrong (at least in my case). I do all three so my gripe is with general stupidity. Including my own some times when I get on my wife's bike (GSXR600) and go much faster than I should be. At least I was smart enough to buy myself a slow commuter (KLR650) because I know I'm being stupid and do things to reduce the level of stupidity.

The cyclists around here are getting stupider. Not smarter.
Rekd is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 06:20 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014