ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Old's Cool > Airheads
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 03-13-2012, 10:46 AM   #31
H96669
A proud pragmatist.
 
H96669's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
Oddometer: 4,515
If like my bike, one is slightly larger that's the drain at the fuel cap. The other is the tank vent.I haven't really finished cleaning all that but....both pipes are free now.





Took me half an hour just to unplug the drain, they both take sharp turns inside the tank.

No "nipple" altough it may look like there is one from the corrosion build up at the bottom.

Sorry too far for me, altough I have a pretty good idea what's in that tank of yours, I like playing with the Borescope. Most shops should have one of them by now, a few minutes of their time you'd get an answer.

I could ,I guess , tell you where the tank vent ends up at the top BUT.....I don't particularly like sticking the Borescope into that one, I have already seen the slowly failing "Red Coating" and I know that if only "a litttle" comes off it is only a matter of time before it all peels out.

Should I add that some of that "Iron Oxide" may find its way passed the OEM filters, I have seen that before, rusty looking crap sitting at the bottom of the bowls, and you may not want that into your engine. On this bike I have here the PO added some inline fuel filters, not the cheap plastic ones, them are metal with a replaceable filter and look like they'd do a proper job at filtering the very fine stuff the OEM filters may not.

Start at the top...work your way down.

Grocery stores have something like that, also the commercial cleaning supplies distributors, may take a few days but should get rid of most, if not all that rust.Too bad no pics of what I did last week comparing to other more expensive products, but....very impressive and cheap.

__________________
Have tools, will travel!
H96669 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 07:03 PM   #32
alvincullumyork OP
I wish I was cool
 
alvincullumyork's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: South Atlanta
Oddometer: 1,472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wirespokes View Post
I don't follow your terminology. Breather line - is that one of the two lines exiting the bottom of the gas tank? One is the cap drain, the other is the tank vent. But the hose just presses onto the tubing - there are no nipples.

These are the tube I was talking about sorry my lack of knowledge. So to clean these out I guess some tie wire(aka bailing wire) back and forth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by H96669 View Post
If like my bike, one is slightly larger that's the drain at the fuel cap. The other is the tank vent.I haven't really finished cleaning all that but....both pipes are free now.

I was going to order some acid magic but I think I will try the vinegar first and try and save some money. Either way I am going to get the POR 15 kit and do everything right.
alvincullumyork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 09:12 PM   #33
H96669
A proud pragmatist.
 
H96669's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
Oddometer: 4,515
You don't really want to know how crafty I had to be to clean that drain pipe do you? Must have been plugged solid for a couple inches. And if plugged I think some rain water will get into the tank...not good.

Lots of WD 40 in the hole to hopefully loosen up the crud, them some brass snare wire with a very small 90 degree at the end, maybe no more than 1/16" and lots of twist/turns just trying to get passed the bend.Tipping the tank over so I wouldn't push stuff farther in. What else did I put in there?...carb cleaner, a long drill bit turned by hand to get started...lots of compressed air and suction ....Big Big Phew when it finally unplugged.

Guitar strings are the best BTW but I did not have any of them.

Now I should fill the pipe up with vinegar to clean the rest, let it sit for a couple days, refill with rust converter to soak up the rest of the corrosion then dump that and let it dry. Then send some lube down there once in a while. Pesky that pipe...Phew!

Some of the Rust Converters are very good, namely the Tannic Acid based ones we use at work all the time. I have always wondered if they couldn't be used to convert rust inside a tank. Quick one, just sloshing it around and then dump and dry. Not sure if the polymer resin they turn the rust into would resist gasoline/ethanols....I have just the thing to try that tomorrow...I like testing stuff like that.
__________________
Have tools, will travel!
H96669 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 04:37 AM   #34
JZed
Adventurer
 
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Nw South Carolina
Oddometer: 44
Tank Cleaning

Al

I had similar issues with Red Koat flakes plugging the pet cock filters on my R100GS. After cleaning the tank about 4 times, the problem has mostly gone away. I cleaned the tank by filling it about half full of Hot water with a little bit of Dawn dish soap and then shook the BeeGeebers out of it. Rinsed it and filled it with Hot soapy water, shake and rinse. Repeat. I did a final rinse with 99% isopropyl alcohol and then let it dry out. Since then I do a good tank cleaning every couple of years and ride the bike enough to keep the gas in the tank fresh. Some folks will use a phosphate type metal prep solution to coat the talk with a light rust resistant coating.
Enjoy your GS. It is a fine machine.

JZed
JZed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 07:38 AM   #35
alvincullumyork OP
I wish I was cool
 
alvincullumyork's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: South Atlanta
Oddometer: 1,472
H96669,

If you are right about rain water getting into the tank due to the plugged line that would explain a lot. Also guitar strings is a very clever idea to clean them out.

JZed,

My plan for my tank cleaning is

1. Shake it up with the gas that it has in it now several times and pour it out and check for water. Maybe I will make some more napalm. Anyone got any Styrofoam they don't want?
2. Take it to a car wash and use the pressure sprayer with car soap to get all the petroleum products out.
3. A thorough rinsing back home with the garden house.
4. Cleaning vinegar to hopefully get rid of rust and the rest of the tank lining.
5. POR 15 motorcycle kit

I know some of my steps will be repeated in this process but I want to nuke it.

Now if only some one would take my finals for me and put some hours on my time card.
alvincullumyork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 12:23 PM   #36
squiffynimrod
maximum shrinkage
 
squiffynimrod's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Flatskatchewan
Oddometer: 1,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by alvincullumyork View Post
4. Cleaning vinegar to hopefully get rid of rust and the rest of the tank lining.
5. POR 15 motorcycle kit
When I stripped my tank prior to POR-15 I threw in some handfuls of old nuts and bolts prior to shaking it up. Really helped get rid of stuff.
__________________
Posting all the bikes you have or have owned in this spot is stupid.
squiffynimrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 03:24 PM   #37
H96669
A proud pragmatist.
 
H96669's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
Oddometer: 4,515
If you want to do the POR15, and you should, their kits will come with all the cleaners. However I think one of the kits, maybe "Heavy Duty" does state that their cleaner will take off the red coating, not that mine back then was hard to remove, just peeled right off.I think that good premium gas with all the cleaners in it did that over a winter.

Nowadays I always use regular for storage and dump a bunch of engine oil in it, then shake the bike once in a while to spread it around.Of course I dump the gas in my bushcar in the spring, but I dump all my old gas after 3 months anyway, chainsaw,lawnmowers etc etc...!

Don't be surprised if there is corrosion even at the top of the tank, all it takes is moisture, the one I have here is showing some strange pits up there when I stick the Borescope in there through the petcock holes.

Darn forgot about putting some 'rust converted" parts in the gas bucket. I have both types of converters here, but the one that's Phosphoric Acid based does contain "Alcohol" so may be a concern with Ethanol in the long run. Dunno....Out the door to test all that, I do have a gallon of corn juice somewhere.

Got a recipe for that "Napalm"? Lots of old styrofoam here....!
__________________
Have tools, will travel!
H96669 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 06:41 PM   #38
alvincullumyork OP
I wish I was cool
 
alvincullumyork's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: South Atlanta
Oddometer: 1,472
Quote:
Originally Posted by squiffynimrod View Post
When I stripped my tank prior to POR-15 I threw in some handfuls of old nuts and bolts prior to shaking it up. Really helped get rid of stuff.
I have read this is in several of the other tank restoration threads and is still might be part of my process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by H96669 View Post
If you want to do the POR15, and you should, their kits will come with all the cleaners. However I think one of the kits, maybe "Heavy Duty" does state that their cleaner will take off the red coating, not that mine back then was hard to remove, just peeled right off.I think that good premium gas with all the cleaners in it did that over a winter.

Nowadays I always use regular for storage and dump a bunch of engine oil in it, then shake the bike once in a while to spread it around.Of course I dump the gas in my bushcar in the spring, but I dump all my old gas after 3 months anyway, chainsaw,lawnmowers etc etc...!

Don't be surprised if there is corrosion even at the top of the tank, all it takes is moisture, the one I have here is showing some strange pits up there when I stick the Borescope in there through the petcock holes.

Darn forgot about putting some 'rust converted" parts in the gas bucket. I have both types of converters here, but the one that's Phosphoric Acid based does contain "Alcohol" so may be a concern with Ethanol in the long run. Dunno....Out the door to test all that, I do have a gallon of corn juice somewhere.

Got a recipe for that "Napalm"? Lots of old styrofoam here....!
In several other tank restoration threads I have read that the the cleaner and rust converter in the POR 15 are good but not great so I just went to the local hardware store and bought one gallon of Acid Magic. This will replace the cleaning vinegar step in my process.

Do you know if the petcocks, there filters, and plastic tubing can withstand the Acid Magic or should I find some corks? Same question for the gas cap? Well I guess since I'm asking do you (or anyone else for that matter) have a detail specific method for the use of an acid like Acid Magic?

The best I can find is this thread, post #13 by CycleDoc59. I am sending him a pm to see if he will give a more thorough explanation.
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=700598

New process for now.

1. Shake it up with the gas that it has in it now several times and pour it out and check for water.
2. Take it to a car wash and use the pressure sprayer with car soap to get all the petroleum products out.
3. A thorough rinsing back home with the garden house.
4. Acid Magic to hopefully get rid of rust and the rest of the tank lining.
5. POR 15 motorcycle kit

Now to get some sleep it has been a roller coaster day.

Thanks again all.
alvincullumyork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 08:08 PM   #39
alvincullumyork OP
I wish I was cool
 
alvincullumyork's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: South Atlanta
Oddometer: 1,472
CycleDoc's response.


I use the Acid Magic straight. It won't hurt the tank if it comes out as soon as the
rust is dissolved. Acid really likes rust (iron oxide). For it to work, all petrol products
have to be removed first. Strong detergent of most any type will work, then rinse the tank
well and pour in the acid; a quart of so is usually enough. Then I watch it work with a small
flashlight, checking it from time to time and rolling it around. Then I dump the acid, rinse the
tank and dry it with a hair dryer. It must be totally dry.....

Acid magic is "safe" muriatic acid, but it is also not as potent as muriatic and not as aggressive
in attacking rust; thus no dilution.
alvincullumyork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 08:44 PM   #40
H96669
A proud pragmatist.
 
H96669's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
Oddometer: 4,515
Acid magic...had to Google that, that's pretty strong Muriatic Acid made safer somehow. Interesting...!

Still...get some corks you'll need them for the Por15. Or maybe just some rubber hose plugged with a bit of wood dowel.Looking back...that's probably what I did then. And in the meantime you can take the petcocks apart and clean them, just pop the black plastic On/Res/Off thing off, you'll see they unscrew and can be cleaned.

I don't see my cap here but I think it is galvanised on the inside??? If so no acids on that.

Half a pound of drywall screws, them are sharp, pointy and cheap. Good scrubbing action.Throw them in there at first even with the gas in there, then get them out with a magnet at the end. Tape the whole tank on the outside just in case, you don't want to add any nicks and scratches to it.
__________________
Have tools, will travel!

H96669 screwed with this post 03-15-2012 at 04:10 PM
H96669 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 06:34 AM   #41
ignatz72
call me iggy
 
ignatz72's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Mid-South, M-town
Oddometer: 626
When I used Evap-o-rust on my tank, I did a test on my old petcocks... Thankfully! They turned a really dark gray and the switch arm actually dissolved. So I would use cork or some other method to seal the tank there.

Also beware of trying to clean up the tank threads for your gas cap. I lost a bit off of my lower threads of the tank using the relatively mild Evap-o-Rust. Your gas cap should be removed too.
__________________
Current: 93 R100GS, 03 XR650R
Prior: 73 CB350, 77 R100/7, 83 R100RT, 04 XR650L
I love every motorcycle I've owned and even some that I haven't.
ignatz72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 04:08 PM   #42
H96669
A proud pragmatist.
 
H96669's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
Oddometer: 4,515
Quote:
Originally Posted by ignatz72 View Post
When I used Evap-o-rust on my tank, I did a test on my old petcocks... Thankfully! They turned a really dark gray and the switch arm actually dissolved. So I would use cork or some other method to seal the tank there.

Also beware of trying to clean up the tank threads for your gas cap. I lost a bit off of my lower threads of the tank using the relatively mild Evap-o-Rust. Your gas cap should be removed too.
Just what I compared the Stripping Vinegar to....Evaporust. Same parts same soaking time. I'll stick with the Vinegar from now on, cheaper and as effective and for really stubborn stuff I do have full strenght Muriatic Acid or the Phosphoric and lots of Baking Soda in the shop.

Darn consumer products, they really try to make the stuff look safe when it really isn't sometimes.Hard to get the MSDSs out and them being mostly from the US don't show much. That's supposed to change to put us inline with the rest of the world where they have to show much more of the product composition. Less of that "Propriatory" stuff.

Know thy chemicals!

These guys there sure dug up the dirt on Evaporust....

http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/showthread.php?t=42280
__________________
Have tools, will travel!
H96669 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2012, 05:42 PM   #43
alvincullumyork OP
I wish I was cool
 
alvincullumyork's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: South Atlanta
Oddometer: 1,472
So I bought one gallon of Acid Magic and some screws and sloshed that around in the tank. It got rid of a lot of the original tank liner but there was still a lot left so I went and bought two gallons of Muriatic acid and some nuts. That stuff is potent! but there is still a lot of tank liner still in there.

My next idea is to throw a gallon of paint stripper in there to see if that will final get rid of the rest of it.

Any thoughts?
alvincullumyork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2012, 04:17 PM   #44
H96669
A proud pragmatist.
 
H96669's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
Oddometer: 4,515
I wonder if you shouldn't swith to a Caustic based cleaner such as oven cleaners and such. I think you are getting there with the paint stripper that's what most of them are, Caustic based.

Makes me also wonder what is the Por-15 "Por-Strip" that comes with the Heavy Duty kit.

http://www.por15.com/Data%20Sheets/h...pair%20kit.pdf

Little digging for the MSDS and yes it it a Paint Stripper, mostly Methylene Chloride.....Caustic allright that.
http://www.frost.co.uk/media/uploads...RStripMSDS.pdf

In any case all precautions apply in mixing chemicals, you really have to neutralize one product before going to another, Napalm may be fine but others sure ain't.
__________________
Have tools, will travel!
H96669 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2012, 11:08 PM   #45
Ulyses
Studly Adventurer
 
Ulyses's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Oddometer: 976
This is what everyone needs: a brother to fix the bike for them while they are gone. Ha. Man, I'm begining to think we should have bought a different bike. How's the tank looking now?
Ulyses is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 03:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014