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Old 03-05-2012, 11:46 AM   #31
2speed
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The last thing I would do is pull it apart.

These things are dead simple. Spark and gas and it starts.

If you can't move the distributor, it's most likely timed right. It will start and run without the vac line to the distributor.

$150 and you can get a rebuilt carb or $15 and you get a kit. I would suggest running it off a lawnmower gas tank because who knows what's in the car's gas tank.

Once it starts, replace all the rubber parts. Fuel pump, vac lines, vacuum caps, hoses, etc.
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Old 03-05-2012, 12:58 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmitchell57 View Post
Based on what i'm experiencing right now and a lot of the comments, I may just pull the engine apart and take a look at it to see what i'm dealing with. Friday night I tried to pull the distributor and it won't come loose from the engine. I can't figure why. So, rather then screw it to hell by pulling on it relentlessly, I'll start breaking down the engine to get it all sorted out. This way I can look at the innards and assess from there. If the internals are fucked, I'll look at other options. If they are good, i'll refresh seals, bearings, and what ever else I need to look at and go from there.
The distributor won't pivot in its bore, or the distributor won't come up when you pull on it?

There are machined supports in the block and on the distributor body that can get gunked up and keep the distributor from coming out. You might have to change the oil, then get the engine good and warm to soften the gunk enough to let it pop loose. I don't think you'll be disassembling it very far with the distributor in the way. At this point I'm not sure you need to, though. I'd still replace the points, condenser, and rotor and plug the vacuum leak either with a plug or by attaching it to the vacuum advance before going much farther with it. You should also do a compression/leakdown test if you think there may be a mechanical issue, but that can come later if you don't have a compression tester handy.
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Old 03-05-2012, 01:24 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
The distributor won't pivot in its bore, or the distributor won't come up when you pull on it?

There are machined supports in the block and on the distributor body that can get gunked up and keep the distributor from coming out. You might have to change the oil, then get the engine good and warm to soften the gunk enough to let it pop loose. I don't think you'll be disassembling it very far with the distributor in the way. At this point I'm not sure you need to, though. I'd still replace the points, condenser, and rotor and plug the vacuum leak either with a plug or by attaching it to the vacuum advance before going much farther with it. You should also do a compression/leakdown test if you think there may be a mechanical issue, but that can come later if you don't have a compression tester handy.
The distributor will spin, but won't come out of the block. It moved about 1/16 of an inch after a bit of prying, but that's it. No game! gar! I start back on it here this afternoon and hopefully have good news. We'll see.
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Old 03-05-2012, 02:16 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmitchell57 View Post
The distributor will spin, but won't come out of the block. It moved about 1/16 of an inch after a bit of prying, but that's it. No game! gar! I start back on it here this afternoon and hopefully have good news. We'll see.
Don't know about them Fords ones, but I know that some won't move up ,or go down ,unless they are at right place on the camshaft.

Try turning the engine by hand as you pull up.

And why I like to put everything at TDC, no compromise...no errors!
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Old 03-05-2012, 02:23 PM   #35
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The distributor hold down "foot" must be completely removed-just in case it's not.

Why pull the dist anyway? Mudgepond says it looks ok at this point

+1 on the alternate fuel source -it's guaranteed to have tank rust if original tank.

Plug vac line-work choke by hand-for now-check out other systems.
JMHO
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Old 03-05-2012, 02:29 PM   #36
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A compression test will tell all the story you need to know at this point. The tester is inexpensive. If they are reasonably the same, and over about 90 psi then i9t should run Ok, If the are all 50 and adding oil takes them to 120, you will burn massive oil. If one or 32 is zero, and the rest are goodish, then it needs to come apart. Spend some money on a tester.

Harbor freight has them cheap. 19.95

Rod
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Old 03-05-2012, 03:01 PM   #37
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If the distributor's stuck, it's probably all sludged up inside. 50 years ago, oil was crap, and the crankcase ventilation was primitive at best. The 221 engine wasn't one of Henry's stellar ideas, and it only lasted a few years before it was abandoned. The 260 was a little better except when they made it the standard V8 in the 2 ton 1963 Galaxies.
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Old 03-05-2012, 04:43 PM   #38
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Well, the distributor is still stuck. No love on that part. I've soaked it down w/ some carb cleaner and PB Blaster and I'll let it sit for a little while. I'll go back and look at it every so often to see if I need to apply some more. Hopefully it'll come free. Bad news is I am to far into pulling it to go back now, so I'm in for the long haul. Worst case, I'll have it dragged somewhere to get it properly extracted.
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Old 03-05-2012, 04:56 PM   #39
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You're burning daylight friend. It doesn't need pulled...you are wasting time, points/ condenser/ cap/r otor/ wires/ plugs...that is the max you need to do for the ignition system. Rebuild the carb and you should be set.

OK, here is the Mudgepondexpress "how to time a points Ford" lesson.

1) Mark the distributor body where the #1 cylinder wire goes. It has to be close but not perfect. I like to mark it on the lip with a magic marker.

2) Make sure it is coming up on Top Dead Center. Yours sould be easy since the distributor looked right. As you are hand cranking around the engine (15/16 bolt in the middle of the balancer, use a 3" extension and a ratchet). As you view it, the crank should rotate towards the drivers side. Bring it up to 8 degress BTDC (dont put it at TDC). Rotor should point towards the carb.

3) Install your new points and condenser and set the gap best you can. It has been too long to remember the gap...look it up on the web. Since you pulled the rotor to change the points, put the new one on now.

4) Have all the wiring hooked up (points to condeser and to coil).

5) turn the key on.

6) Rotate the distributor clockwise (i.e. your #1 mark mvoing towards the rotor), turn it slow, very slow.

7) Listen carefully and you will hear a "POP". Tighten down the distributor, you are done and timed at 8 degress BTDC.

8) Put the cap on and fire that mother up!



4 ins
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Old 03-05-2012, 05:04 PM   #40
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Why are you too far? You haven't even pulled it out of the oil pump drive hex yet?

If you have to remove it, PB Blaster and start twisting it back and forth, gently pulling up at the same time. After a little effort you will have cut that ring of burnn't oil off the bottom of the dist body and it should pull out.

I really don't see the need to pull it...you can do everything when it is in place (one of the best parts of a Ford).

As a side note...all Ford V-8 distributors use the same parts (cap/points/condenser/rotor). I mean all...272, 292, 312, 221, 260, 289, 302, 351W, 351C, 351M, 400M, 429, 460, 331, 352, 360, 361, 390, 406, etc. You can change one to electronic ignition and never remove it from the car. If you want better electonics, use the latest cap adapter, cap and rotor...you get the stud cap with a much better connection and wider spaced lugs.

Good luck...go easy..no need to waste $.

Kenny

Kenny
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Old 03-06-2012, 11:24 AM   #41
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Ditch the condensor, points, etc...
Get this:
http://www.pertronix.com/prod/ig/ignitor/default.aspx

First mod I did to my '67 Camaro's inline 6.
It's easy to install.
It helped it start and run better.
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Old 03-06-2012, 12:04 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudgepondexpress View Post
You're burning daylight friend. It doesn't need pulled...you are wasting time, points/ condenser/ cap/r otor/ wires/ plugs...that is the max you need to do for the ignition system. Rebuild the carb and you should be set.

Listen to this guy or you are into a money pit.

They are simple machines and will either run well or be stuffed, in which case you get to decide how big your budget is. If you start pulling random bits apart you will dig a huge hole for yourself.
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Old 03-06-2012, 01:47 PM   #43
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Had I read this on thursday I'd be on the boat of leaving it alone. However, I convinced myself that since I couldn't spin it to adjust the timing I needed to pull it. So, i've been doing that. By reading the shop manual, all it should have taken is marking a couple things, loosening up the clamp and pulling it out. I already had another NIB sitting there waiting. Well, after pulling on it a bit it came up slightly. After that I disassembled the distributor so it's just a case and center shaft. After pulling a bit more i realized the only reason the casing was spinning now was because is separated from the portion of the distributor case that was seized up in the block. I feel like a retard saying I did this, but shit happens. So, regardless, I've got an excellent learning experience behind and ahead of me and i need to put a new one in now.

I've been soaking it in PB Blaster and Choke / Carb cleaner. I'm hoping this will help clear things up. I'll ocasionaly apply heat to it, but the unusual area it's in doesn't help w/ getting heat all the way around to break it free.

I'll do compression checks this afternoon to see what it looks like. If that's good, I'll keep soaking the distributor until it free's up. In the meantime I'll work on the brakes, electrical and other moving parts. I can really do much w/ the transmission until the engine is running with exception of draining, cleaning or replacing screens or filters, and putting it back together.

So, on to get working on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudgepondexpress View Post
Why are you too far? You haven't even pulled it out of the oil pump drive hex yet?

If you have to remove it, PB Blaster and start twisting it back and forth, gently pulling up at the same time. After a little effort you will have cut that ring of burnn't oil off the bottom of the dist body and it should pull out.

I really don't see the need to pull it...you can do everything when it is in place (one of the best parts of a Ford).

As a side note...all Ford V-8 distributors use the same parts (cap/points/condenser/rotor). I mean all...272, 292, 312, 221, 260, 289, 302, 351W, 351C, 351M, 400M, 429, 460, 331, 352, 360, 361, 390, 406, etc. You can change one to electronic ignition and never remove it from the car. If you want better electonics, use the latest cap adapter, cap and rotor...you get the stud cap with a much better connection and wider spaced lugs.

Good luck...go easy..no need to waste $.

Kenny

Kenny
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Old 03-06-2012, 03:38 PM   #44
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Here's the compression results

1 - 125
2 - 121
3 - 129
4 - 98
5 - 110
6 - 108
7 - 120
8 - 99

There's more then a 20 psi variation between some of them. The shop manual says that's bad and a possible rebuild should be reviewed.
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Old 03-06-2012, 03:47 PM   #45
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At this point you need to put oil in every cylinder and repeat the test. If you have an oil can with a pump, one squrit in every hole. If you do not then you need to go to wal mart and get one of the oil mixing hypodermics they have in the automotive section, or buy some aquarium hose. You put about one tablespoon of oil in the injector, or suck up about 6 inches of oil in the tube and put into the cylinders. If the readings go up it is bad rings, but it will run. If the readings don't change or get worse then you have bad valves. That said it is high enough to run, maybe not well but it will run.

Get it running is my recommendation and see how it does without taking or working on anything else,

Otherwise money pit.

Rod
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