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Old 04-10-2012, 01:00 PM   #196
atpalmer
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I'm a big fan of MTGMTT.
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Old 04-10-2012, 02:42 PM   #197
ricochetrider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwards View Post
This subject has been debated on every motorcycle forum I have ever been on. Same with oil. It never ends well.

If you wan't to wear it - wear it. If you don't - don't.
Agreed. Dead subject. Everyone has an opinion on ATGATT. Seems the lines always fall in the same general areas:

The full on ATGATT bunch,
The sometimes this or that crew,
The partial gear crew (FF Helmet & jacket, gloves, & boots),
The No Helmet crowd, and
everyone else.

I personally wear most of the gear most of the time- I don't own any pants with armour in them, but plan to get some. My "riding" pants are leather, currently, and always have been. My next leather jacket will probably have some armour in it. I have textile, waxed cotton, and leather jackets, full face and partial coverage helmets, boots and gloves of all sorts.

Another thing:

I don't "dress for the the crash". I find the very statement absolutely ludicrous. To me, an accident is just that- accidental. I NEVER act as though one will happen to me- I don't dress for the crash, I don't dress to saw my finger off, I don't dress to run my car into a tree, and I don't dress to fall off a structure. I don't dress to get hit by lightning, and I don't dress to get sucked into a tornado. As far as I'm concerned, my abilities (in general) by FAR are better than that, for me to go around dressing for, or preparing for disaster. Fuck that. So while that doesn't mean it will never happen, I ACT as though it won't. Because I KNOW that I am not going to cause MYSELF harm. (on purpose) I have two things going for me- CONFIDENCE AND FAITH. In MY abilities, in my equipment, and in the "Powers That Be".

Do I wear protective clothing when it's prudent? Of course I do.

These opinions are not necessarily those of the management, and YRMV.
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Old 04-11-2012, 06:22 AM   #198
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Do you think ATGATT would have saved him about 3.3 million per year???


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Old 04-11-2012, 08:01 AM   #199
Wuwei
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Do you think ATGATT would have saved him about 3.3 million per year???
No, but better judgment would have.
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Old 04-11-2012, 08:48 AM   #200
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Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post

Neither did I miss it nor is it related to what I said.
Sure it is. THAT is the argument that convinces 15 year olds who think they'll live forever: wear gear, ride again sooner.
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Old 04-11-2012, 09:10 AM   #201
TrashCan
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No, but better judgment would have.

That is usually always the case isn't it?
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Old 04-11-2012, 10:08 AM   #202
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Originally Posted by daveinva View Post
Sure it is. THAT is the argument that convinces 15 year olds who think they'll live forever: wear gear, ride again sooner.
Still not related to what I said.
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:14 AM   #203
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Personally I'm a MOTGMOTT and ATTGSOTT. I try to dress for what I'll be doing. For example, if I'm riding to the park for a hike, I'll wear hiking boots, not motorcycle boots. For around town, I'll often wear jeans instead of armored MC pants. I know the risk and I'm willing to take it for the convenience. I usually do 2 or more short rides almost every day commuting to work or running errands around town. For a longer ride, it's usually all the gear.

For you ATGATT preachers who like to call those aren't stupid, just remember that most non riders think you are stupid just for riding a bike in the first place. Everyone has a different tolerance for risk. To call someone willing to take greater risks than you, when you are already taking a risk by riding, is pretty hypocritical. Also, if you preach ATGATT but wear a black helmet and/or jacket, you are a hypocrite because wearing something Hi Vis would be safer. You are compromising safety for looks as opposed to those who compromise safety for convenience.

There is no doubt that wearing all the gear is safer, but there is more to life than being as safe as possible. I always recommend wearing at least most, if not all, the riding gear since it is the safest choice. Someone who thinks they are just as safe in a T shirt, shorts and flip flops is an idiot but I won't call someone stupid if they know the risks and are willing to take them.
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:41 AM   #204
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Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
Someone who thinks they are just as safe in a T shirt, shorts and flip flops is an idiot but I won't call someone stupid if they know the risks and are willing to take them.
Well said.

I usually wear all the gear. Occassionally I wear jeans with armour underneath instead of leathers or textile pants.

I couldn't care less what someone else wears - unless they're family or on the back of my bike.

I only get annoyed when someone wears less gear but then rationalizes it with pithy and stupid statements. If you choose to wear running shoes and a t-shirt after due consideration of the risks, go ahead. And I wouldn't criticize you for doing so, notwithstanding that I may not agree with your choices or risk assessment.

The only thing that really makes me see red is when the rider is protected and the passenger is not.
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Old 04-11-2012, 12:03 PM   #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
There is no doubt that wearing all the gear is safer, but there is more to life than being as safe as possible. I always recommend wearing at least most, if not all, the riding gear since it is the safest choice. Someone who thinks they are just as safe in a T shirt, shorts and flip flops is an idiot but I won't call someone stupid if they know the risks and are willing to take them.

That is exactly when a person is exibiting stupid behavior. If you do not understand the risks, you are ignorant. If you know them and ignore the risks, then you are stupid.

Jim

PS I couldn't care less, on the other hand, if someone wants to be stupid, and I won't usually call them stupid, but that doesn't change the fact that they are.

PPS I am "stupid" sometimes as I do not always wear ALL the gear.
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Old 04-11-2012, 12:04 PM   #206
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Originally Posted by Griffin44 View Post
Well said.

I usually wear all the gear. Occassionally I wear jeans with armour underneath instead of leathers or textile pants.

I couldn't care less what someone else wears - unless they're family or on the back of my bike.

I only get annoyed when someone wears less gear but then rationalizes it with pithy and stupid statements. If you choose to wear running shoes and a t-shirt after due consideration of the risks, go ahead. And I wouldn't criticize you for doing so, notwithstanding that I may not agree with your choices or risk assessment.

The only thing that really makes me see red is when the rider is protected and the passenger is not.
+1 on that. If my wife is on the back and wearing jeans, I'll wear jeans too. I figure I should be taking the same risk she is.
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Old 04-11-2012, 12:23 PM   #207
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Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
That is exactly when a person is exibiting stupid behavior. If you do not understand the risks, you are ignorant. If you know them and ignore the risks, then you are stupid.

Jim
By that line of logic anyone that rides a motorcycle is stupid. We need a "stupidity gradient" thread.
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Old 04-11-2012, 12:30 PM   #208
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Full face helmet, armored jacked, gloves all the time.

Hiking boots or MC boots, depending on what I feel like.

Armored pants on long rides always, short rides (< 5 miles) only when it is not too hot.

The only time I will preach to someone about wearing gear, is when they have made it obvious that they never even considered it. (And there are plenty of those out there.)
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Old 04-11-2012, 12:41 PM   #209
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I commute every day, full one piece suit, setup adventure boots, gauntlet gloves, full face helmet. Now if I ride 2 miles to the store I might wear workboots, jacket, jeans, gloves and helmet, but that is the least gear I will wear. So like some of you, there are times I will ride without armored pants, but that's it. I've been down a couple times and I was glad to have the gear on.
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Old 04-11-2012, 12:56 PM   #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
That is exactly when a person is exibiting stupid behavior. If you do not understand the risks, you are ignorant. If you know them and ignore the risks, then you are stupid.

Jim

PS I couldn't care less, on the other hand, if someone wants to be stupid, and I won't usually call them stupid, but that doesn't change the fact that they are.

PPS I am "stupid" sometimes as I do not always wear ALL the gear.
So anyone who takes risks is stupid???

If I want avoid doing anything risky I will need to quit my job and hide out in a sterile room. If I do that I may risk dieing of boredom. Therefore, no matter what I do, by your definition, I'm Stupid...... and so is everyone else!
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