ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > The perfect line and other riding myths
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-31-2013, 08:59 PM   #1261
Paebr332
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Apr 2012
Location: Shippensburg, PA
Oddometer: 929
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
Why do Rugby players not get concussions a lot more frequently than NFL players then if it is not the Peltzman effect?

You want to say I am wrong but dont come up with an alternative theory.

Saying that you are immune to the peltzman effect is like saying that you are not human
The Peltzman Effect, like the Dunning-Kruger Effect, is a psychological phenomenon that can be overcome by being made aware of the tendency. The three laws of motion are NOT psychological in nature but are immutable laws of the universe. No amount of self awareness can overcome these laws. In a motorcycle crash the rider WILL be contacting a hard surface or surfaces in a violent manner. Good gear can mitigate the effect of the impact(s).
Paebr332 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2013, 09:48 PM   #1262
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoTex View Post
ATGATT is overrated, if you own it and never use it and never need it.

ATGATT is rated if you own it and wear it and it saves your skin.

ATGATT is underrated if you need it and don't have it on.
You can't "own" atgatt. Even more you can't "own but not use it".
You are constantly missusing the phrase.
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 03:27 AM   #1263
Vertical C
Beastly Adventurer
 
Vertical C's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: Sydney Australia
Oddometer: 2,392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paebr332 View Post
The Peltzman Effect, like the Dunning-Kruger Effect, is a psychological phenomenon that can be overcome by being made aware of the tendency. The three laws of motion are NOT psychological in nature but are immutable laws of the universe. No amount of self awareness can overcome these laws. In a motorcycle crash the rider WILL be contacting a hard surface or surfaces in a violent manner. Good gear can mitigate the effect of the impact(s).
I am aware o it and still affects me. So not true.
Vertical C is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 06:45 AM   #1264
MotoTex
Miles of Smiles
 
MotoTex's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Location: Tool Shed
Oddometer: 1,599
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
I am aware o it and still affects me. So not true.
True for YOU doesn't make it true for everyone.

Have you considered seeking professional help?

Just kidding. I remember feeling this way with gear on in my late teens and early twenties. But I was immediately aware of it and adjusted my riding style accordingly. Eventually I was able to don the gear and no longer find myself experiencing this effect.

Knowledge is power. You may have more control over this than you realize.
__________________

This is The Internet. Confirm for yourself anything you may see while visiting this strange and uncertain land.


MotoTex screwed with this post 09-01-2013 at 06:58 AM
MotoTex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 08:27 AM   #1265
O.C.F.RIDER
Loose nut behind h/bars
 
O.C.F.RIDER's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Hewitt,New Jerseystan, OBAMANATION
Oddometer: 4,877
It seems this "Peltzman Effect" thing, would apply to me also! At the advanced (dirt riding) age of 54, with the advent of fantastic knees braces, Leatt Braces, boots that are better than ever, I'm riding faster than I ever have and a big reason is because I feel so well protected. Didn't help my wrist much last December though! SNAPPOLA! If I had been riding without all the stuff, I can assure you I wouldn't have been going as fast.
But on the other hand, on the street I'm a AATGATT guy. All very good gear, except, like lots of others.........jeans. Well, in June I got bit........




I stepped-off my ZRX in a right-hander at somewhere between 90-100mph (don't waste your time preaching at me, I've been riding, racing, and sometimes crashing for 46 years) after discovering a patch of sand.
Legs.......
First two pics show the aftermath of Speed+Pavement+Shitty old BDU's= A lot of meat loss.
Torso......
Third pic is right elbow after wearing through the rather thick leather of a once very nice Vanson jacket. If I hadn't had it on, I can only imagine how much skin would have been left on Clinton Road.
Paws.....
Fourth pic is after wearing through a really nice pair of Tecnik road-race gloves.
Noogin.......
No pics of bashed head, or my helmet (I'll get some up later), but the 2 week old Arai Vector looks like it was dragged behind a car for a couple of miles and the shield MELTED from dragging along Clinton Road for a bit. It was quite the light show in there as all the stuff in the front of the bike was getting ground away!
Feets & ankles....
You can see my ugly foot in the pic, but it didn't get any uglier from the crash, and ankles didn't get ground away either thanks to good over the ankle Hiking boots.
In summation, ATGATT is NOT overrated!!!!!!!! If I HAD been wearing good pants, I wouldn't STILL (2 1/2 months later) have a oozing leg that's keeping me from dirt riding. But, that being said, had there been a car coming at just the wrong moment (for me), all the gear in the world wouldn't have kept me from getting torn into little chunks. So there is a bit of good old fashioned LUCK involved too.
Do I still ride in jeans?
Yes.
But just around town, or short hops. Still doesn't make sense I suppose as the big crash happened about 5 miles from the house.
But going out for a "ride", it's a beautiful brand new 2-piece Spidi suit scored on ebay for the princely sum of..........................(you won't believe this) $250!!!!!!!!!! Oh, and a pair of top shelf Alpinestar boots too.
In the dirt?
Never, ever, NOT, ATGATT! Period. Crashes happen too easily, and sometimes the crash doesn't even have to happen to blow a knee out or knock yourself onto Queer St..

CW

__________________
http://www.theshining.info/
KTM 950 Adv. "S"...'06 KTM 525 EXC...
'76 MV Agusta 750 America S...'84 Honda VF1000...
'75 Kawi 900 Z1...'90 Kawi ZX11...'03 Kawi ZRX 1200...'01 VOR 400E
O.C.F.RIDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 09:03 AM   #1266
Boon Booni
Red Clay Halo
 
Boon Booni's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: Richmond, Va
Oddometer: 13,318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
I am aware o it and still affects me. So not true.
Your personal lack of self control is not a problem for everyone else.
__________________
Where the fuck...
Where the fuck is the bike?
You gotta be shitting me.
Where the fuck is the road?
Boon Booni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 10:41 AM   #1267
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.C.F.RIDER View Post

All very good gear, except, like lots of others.........jeans. Well, in June I got bit........
I stepped-off my ZRX in a right-hander at somewhere between 90-100mph
Impressing! I knew atgatt was overrated, but not that it was SO overrated.
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 10:53 AM   #1268
O.C.F.RIDER
Loose nut behind h/bars
 
O.C.F.RIDER's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Hewitt,New Jerseystan, OBAMANATION
Oddometer: 4,877
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
Impressing! I knew atgatt was overrated, but not that it was SO overrated.
???
I'm not "getting" it.

CW
__________________
http://www.theshining.info/
KTM 950 Adv. "S"...'06 KTM 525 EXC...
'76 MV Agusta 750 America S...'84 Honda VF1000...
'75 Kawi 900 Z1...'90 Kawi ZX11...'03 Kawi ZRX 1200...'01 VOR 400E
O.C.F.RIDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 11:07 AM   #1269
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,297
I'm just surprised and impressed how minor your injuries after a 90...100mph crash with jeans were. I thought gear would make more of a difference or better to say I would have expected your knee to be missing or something.
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 11:14 AM   #1270
randyo
Beastly Adventurer
 
randyo's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Northern NewEngland
Oddometer: 1,604
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
I'm just surprised and impressed how minor your injuries after a 90...100mph crash with jeans were. I thought gear would make more of a difference or better to say I would have expected your knee to be missing or something.
I lowsided once at 70mph, slid 175 feet on wet grass, it was so much fun, I almost wanted to get up and do it again but knew better it might not work out the same the next time
__________________
RandyO
IBA # 9560
07 VeeStrom
99 SV650
82 XV920R
A man with a gun is a citizen
A man without a gun is a subject
randyo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 11:30 AM   #1271
MotoTex
Miles of Smiles
 
MotoTex's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Location: Tool Shed
Oddometer: 1,599
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.C.F.RIDER View Post
???
I'm not "getting" it.

CW
Public Service Announcement

After scratching my head over WR's litany of drivel, and several unfruitful attempts at intelligent discourse with WR, he earned a coveted place on my "Ignore List" (first and only FF there) and reading this thread has been much easier since.

To place an FF on Ignore, just select to view their profile and look for "User Lists" dropdown. Select "Add to Ignore List" and you're done!

Quick and easy.

After which his posts look like this to me.

Thank you so much for posting up quickly so I could use it as an example.
__________________

This is The Internet. Confirm for yourself anything you may see while visiting this strange and uncertain land.


MotoTex screwed with this post 09-01-2013 at 12:19 PM
MotoTex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 11:56 AM   #1272
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoTex View Post
attempts at intelligent discourse
I really would be happy if he tried that.
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 12:57 PM   #1273
O.C.F.RIDER
Loose nut behind h/bars
 
O.C.F.RIDER's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Hewitt,New Jerseystan, OBAMANATION
Oddometer: 4,877
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
I'm just surprised and impressed how minor your injuries after a 90...100mph crash with jeans were. I thought gear would make more of a difference or better to say I would have expected your knee to be missing or something.
To be sure, the injuries could have been much worse, but as it is, 2 1/2 months later I still have about a half-dollar size piece of drooling, oozing, sometimes still bleeding, chunk that's trying to reunite with the rest of my skin. With proper gear, that most likely wouldn't be the case. I may have still gotten burned through leather's, but I wouldn't be missing lots of meat.
Also, there's a certain "art" to keeping one's self from being broken up worse that's learned through road-racing crashes. You learn, well it becomes reflex, to keep your limbs tucked in tight as you can. Less flailing about of those bits usually means less pins, plates, and such.
All that, PLUS, luck was very much on my side. Never discount plain ol' luck.

CW
__________________
http://www.theshining.info/
KTM 950 Adv. "S"...'06 KTM 525 EXC...
'76 MV Agusta 750 America S...'84 Honda VF1000...
'75 Kawi 900 Z1...'90 Kawi ZX11...'03 Kawi ZRX 1200...'01 VOR 400E
O.C.F.RIDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 01:03 PM   #1274
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.C.F.RIDER View Post
To be sure, the injuries could have been much worse, but as it is, 2 1/2 months later I still have about a half-dollar size piece of drooling, oozing, sometimes still bleeding, chunk that's trying to reunite with the rest of my skin.
That's a VERY VERY tiny prize for a 90...100mph crash without gear (at that part of your body).
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2013, 03:19 PM   #1275
JimVonBaden
"Cool" Aid!
 
JimVonBaden's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Alexandria, VA
Oddometer: 50,579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Incredulous View Post
My God this thread brings out the stupid:screwy:
Your name appears to fit!

Jim
JimVonBaden is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 04:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014