ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Thumpers
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-03-2009, 03:46 PM   #16
Luke
GPoET&P
 
Luke's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: Idiotville, OR
Oddometer: 4,117
Quote:
Originally Posted by makazica
Thanks Luke....that's the answer I was looking for. Now it makes sense.
Do I really have to remove the spring to measure its length or is it good enough to go with the specifications listed for my spring.....?

Thanks again!
M.
My stock spring was within one of mm of the spec. The 27mm number should be regarded as a starting point for tuning, anyway, so getting it exactly right isn't so important.

For tuning it's much easier to measure the distance from the shock upper casting to the top preload collar, and use that number in your notes.
Luke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2009, 02:19 PM   #17
makazica
Studly Adventurer
 
makazica's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2008
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Oddometer: 742
Luke,

would you be a mate and tell me how much do you weight and what is the distance between the upper starting point of the threads and the upper locking collar on your bike...

As you can see from my posts, I'm deep into tuning my suspension while not being the most educated suspension guy around.

I weight around 95 kg (200 pounds??), my bike is a '01 Adv and on my spring it says 66-260.

Ideally, I'm looking for somebody round same weight who is going to tell me the distance mentioned above to make my life easier....

Thanks!
M.
makazica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2009, 02:33 PM   #18
meat popsicle
Ignostic
 
meat popsicle's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Circumlocution Office of Little Dorrit
Oddometer: 14,178
makazica,

I don't think you should use other folks' numbers because things differ between everyone's bikes that influence static and dynamic sag. You should adjust your shock's preload to conform to KTM's sag guidelines, or the guildelines of a good suspension tuner.

My own work on this is chronicled HERE.
__________________
Kronreif Trunkenpolz Mattighofen LC4 640

Its not so much staying alive; its staying human that counts.
meat popsicle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2009, 03:28 PM   #19
Luke
GPoET&P
 
Luke's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: Idiotville, OR
Oddometer: 4,117
Quote:
Originally Posted by makazica
Luke,

would you be a mate and tell me how much do you weight and what is the distance between the upper starting point of the threads and the upper locking collar on your bike...

As you can see from my posts, I'm deep into tuning my suspension while not being the most educated suspension guy around.

I weight around 95 kg (200 pounds??), my bike is a '01 Adv and on my spring it says 66-260.

Ideally, I'm looking for somebody round same weight who is going to tell me the distance mentioned above to make my life easier....

Thanks!
M.
My shock is not stock at all- I changed the extended length and the spring.

On both the '02 and '97 shocks with stock everything the number should be about 25mm. However, KTM changed the internal and external spacers from year to year, so there's no guarantee that it's right for the '01. The fact that the '97 and '02 are about the same is coincidence. The total length of the shocks differ by 10mm.
Luke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 12:24 AM   #20
makazica
Studly Adventurer
 
makazica's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2008
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Oddometer: 742
Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
makazica,

I don't think you should use other folks' numbers because things differ between everyone's bikes that influence static and dynamic sag. You should adjust your shock's preload to conform to KTM's sag guidelines, or the guildelines of a good suspension tuner.

My own work on this is chronicled HERE.
Yeah, I expected somebody is going to say what you sad, but actually I'm not looking for other people's sag numbers ( as some members did before ).

What happened is, I started messing with preload a couple months back and now I can't find the paper I wrote the measurements on....

I was hoping for somebody around the same weight to give me, for example, the number of visible threads above the upper locking collar to start setting preload from scratch. I'll go with what Luke's mentioned.... 25 mm.

My intention is to get four settings (me on the bike for the roads; me and my gf on the roads; me, my GF loaded with luggage on the roads and me on the bike for trail riding)...yup, I know....it would be easier to buy a BMW gsa, a Ducati 1098, a BMW r1200r and keep the ktoom for the trails.........not happening....

Also, the trick with turning the spring with your hands is a great one....the stupid KTM tool is useless....i'm not going to post a pic of my locking collars, BTW. what is the price for a new set of collars...? A friend messed them up......

Cheers!
m.
makazica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 07:42 AM   #21
meat popsicle
Ignostic
 
meat popsicle's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Circumlocution Office of Little Dorrit
Oddometer: 14,178
makazica

never priced the collars, but they should make them out of kryptonite so superman can even hurt 'em. Mine were unfazed by some thoughtful coaxing with a big standard screwdriver and a hammer.

Ah a starting point. Well, you can (can you?) adjust the preload/sag with the shock on the bike, so you are putting it on the centerstand, adjusting preload, taking it off the centerstand, checking sag, and repeating. I didn't find the routine too bad. Not like adjusting the chain...

Regarding your intentions: sag recommendations are always a range, so they allow for changes in weight from fuel (6.7 gallons to zero is alot of weight change), gear changes (not shifting... but what you wear/carry), and maybe even a passenger. Some have said they have to adjust sag between solo and two-up touring w/luggage, so maybe you could get some settings for those - but they may always be "starting points" since things change over time as the shock internals wear, as well as the suspension parts.
meat popsicle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 08:51 AM   #22
Zerodog
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: SLC, UT
Oddometer: 1,233
I just checked out this thread. There is no way to get the stock spring to ride the way you want. At 200lbs you weigh about 150lbs too much for that spring on that bike.

An 8.4 will give you what you are looking for. It is ideal for you alone with gear. It will be a lot better with the passenger. Nothing will be ideal for your situation though. It is such a wide range of weight. But DS bikes are all about compromise.

The collars can be fixed up. I have sanded them down before and squared up the notches a bit on more than one 640 shock. The problem is the shock needs to be pulled apart to get the collars off. You just do it when you get a service done.
Zerodog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 10:55 AM   #23
Tempo
Stumptown Native
 
Tempo's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon
Oddometer: 684
I very highly recommend working with Zerodog on this, esp. for the heavier guys (no offense makazica ). I should note that I'm not affiliated with Zerodog in any way, just a satisfied customer. But he knows a lot about the 640s suspension...

For about $215 I swapped my rear spring for an 8.6 -- which is more than this thread's author would need -- and it's a whole lot better. Likewise up front, I went with a .52 springs it no longer rides like meat's caddy.

FWIW my 'dry weight' is about 195 lbs.
Tempo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 12:58 PM   #24
meat popsicle
Ignostic
 
meat popsicle's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Circumlocution Office of Little Dorrit
Oddometer: 14,178
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tempo
...

For about $215 I swapped my rear spring for an 8.6 -- which is more than this thread's author would need -- and it's a whole lot better. Likewise up front, I went with a .52 springs it no longer rides like meat's caddy.

FWIW my 'dry weight' is about 195 lbs.
My caddy has been resprung, but it still is plush... interesting what the right spring weight and (lack of excessive) preload will do for handling.

Zerodog is a very useful fella, but makazica is on the other side of the world so... anyways, I went with one of Zerodog's 250mm length 8.0 springs (stock is 260mm but many have found this length requires excessive preload just to mount it). If you get a spring makazica try to get a 250mm length and something in the neighborhood of an 8.0 spring weight.
meat popsicle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 02:15 PM   #25
makazica
Studly Adventurer
 
makazica's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2008
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Oddometer: 742
Thanks everybody....it seems that you came up with the answer I was looking for, actually, with the answer I feared I'd get. No matter what I did with my sag numbers in the past months the bike felt far from what I would expect from WP suspension.

Tomorrow I'll check out my options for a new spring...will report.

Zerodog, just out of curiosity, what would you charge for a full suspension service (front and back) & a spring that I need....

Thanks mates, what ever I do with my bike...it seems I always end up here and get the right answers...even if I dont like them...

Cheers!
M.
makazica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 03:19 PM   #26
Zerodog
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: SLC, UT
Oddometer: 1,233
I will shoot you a PM. But Meat said you were far away? Are you in the US?
Zerodog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2009, 11:45 PM   #27
makazica
Studly Adventurer
 
makazica's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2008
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Oddometer: 742
Zerodog, yeah, shoot me a PM....I'm asking just to compare prices.
As meat said, I'm across the world....Zagreb, Croatia....Europe.

No way that I could send my suspension to you....shipping would kill me.

Cheers!
makazica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2009, 07:08 PM   #28
mikeprod92211
Desert Rat
 
mikeprod92211's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2004
Oddometer: 589
Makazica,
Zerodog je odlican majstor!
On je uredio moj 2000 LC4E da je sada kao nov!
A ja sam 220 lbs (malo tezi od tebe).
Njegove preporuke su vrlo precizne, i stvarno covek zna o cemu govori!
__________________
LC4 Rider
mikeprod92211 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2009, 10:09 PM   #29
Tempo
Stumptown Native
 
Tempo's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon
Oddometer: 684
What he said.
Tempo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2009, 08:21 AM   #30
mikeprod92211
Desert Rat
 
mikeprod92211's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2004
Oddometer: 589
Laugh

Tempo...
Just a comercial plug for Zerodog's comments in Makazica'x native language!
__________________
LC4 Rider
mikeprod92211 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 02:16 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014