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Old 02-14-2013, 02:20 PM   #2221
Jaimoto
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Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
MCN obviously means that the KTM has a fatter torque curve.
That's my thought.

Back on pricing ... I just saw the price here in Chile:

990: $23,241
1190: $24,510
1190R: $24,806

Not bad.
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Old 02-14-2013, 02:26 PM   #2222
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Seems KTM are going to have pretty much world pricing. Australian prices look good also. I was at local BMW dealer yesterday and they have droped prices for the new GS , not by as much as they should but still unlike Ducati whose price is in the $35,000 $US mark for the Multi.
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Old 02-14-2013, 02:32 PM   #2223
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Re the Weight

The Ducati fueled weight of 220 Kilos compares to 230 kgs for the KTM , I have used different sources. The Ducati weight however is for the non ABS and Standard suspension. I also note that the KTM figures for power are 110 Kw, which is .5 higher than Ducati. All subject to who is telling the story. For me I don't care to much , the power of both is very good , my interest in the KTM is about different factors , mostly the issues that drive me mad with Ducati .
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Old 02-14-2013, 02:46 PM   #2224
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here in the UK the stock 1190 is a 1100 more than a stock GS and specking one up to a similar GS is more expensive,
AT those prices they will struggle to infiltrate the GS clan,
BMW seemed to hang back a while after the launch before announcing their pricing, funnily enough just after KTM
personally I would have the KTM every time but I think they have their work cut out justifying the price (here in the UK)
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Old 02-14-2013, 03:42 PM   #2225
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Originally Posted by Tiggersteve View Post
here in the UK the stock 1190 is a 1100 more than a stock GS and specking one up to a similar GS is more expensive,
AT those prices they will struggle to infiltrate the GS clan,
BMW seemed to hang back a while after the launch before announcing their pricing, funnily enough just after KTM
personally I would have the KTM every time but I think they have their work cut out justifying the price (here in the UK)
I must admit, I was surprised to see that the GS was cheaper. Although the KTM is still cheaper than a Multi, yet Ducati seem to sell a lot of those!

KTM do seem to have got the styling wrong on the base 1190- far too bland. The R looks good though!
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Old 02-14-2013, 05:24 PM   #2226
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Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
MCN obviously means that the KTM has a fatter torque curve.
This!

It is the area under the curve that matters in application. Peak numbers are nothing but one data point. Unless you have a CVT to always run engine at that point, you are ignoring reality by over simplifying the comparison.

The fueling of the RC8R (dual spark same engine in 1190adv) is leaps and bounds better than MTS1200 so I imagine even if on dyno they are even, the katoom will feel (be) faster just rolling on the throttle under most conditions.
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:56 PM   #2227
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I get it now. MCN is simply parrotting a claim from KTM, which says on one of its web pages for the bike:

"The new 1190 Adventure sets the standard for the whole travel segment: 150 hp with a weight of only 230 kg fully tanked give rise to a power-to-weight ratio previously unheard of in this class and hence to unrivalled ride dynamics."

So, obviously KTM does not consider the Multistrada to be a member of the class.

They are saying that it is a lot more powerful than a GS or an Adventure 990 and a lot lighter than an Explorer, Stelvio, Crosstourer or Super Ten. Anything with a 17-inch front wheel and sports-profile rubber doesn't count.
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Old 02-14-2013, 08:28 PM   #2228
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Sod it, couldn't help myself, ordered a 1190 R the other week, from what i can see i think i will have one of the few ones delivered in Scotland from the first build. Roll on the start of March!!
Hopefully picking mine up next week :)))))
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Old 02-14-2013, 09:49 PM   #2229
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Originally Posted by Moronic View Post
I get it now. MCN is simply parrotting a claim from KTM, which says on one of its web pages for the bike:

"The new 1190 Adventure sets the standard for the whole travel segment: 150 hp with a weight of only 230 kg fully tanked give rise to a power-to-weight ratio previously unheard of in this class and hence to unrivalled ride dynamics."

So, obviously KTM does not consider the Multistrada to be a member of the class.

They are saying that it is a lot more powerful than a GS or an Adventure 990 and a lot lighter than an Explorer, Stelvio, Crosstourer or Super Ten. Anything with a 17-inch front wheel and sports-profile rubber doesn't count.
Well I have the new Multi Strada Promotion Booklet from the dealer. The equivalent Multi to the KTM has a weight of 224 KGs according to the Ducati Material. Consider that the Multi has less fuel , the KTM might beat it ? In any case a very close contest. The lightest Multi is now 196 Kgs empty , so over 200kgs with fuel. If we go to one with a few options ie: KTM spec level then I'd say very close. THe Ducati booklet says power is up 110.3 Kw , this is just so marginal not worth a debate. In reality we need someone to weigh both bikes.
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Old 02-14-2013, 10:23 PM   #2230
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Peak HP is about the same. The Multistrada is about 30 lbs lighter than the 1190 Adventure.
The Ducati wet weight figures weren't exactly realistic. Real-world numbers on a scale put it about 30 pounds heavier with a full tank of fuel than what Ducati claims. Add panniers/mounts and electronic suspension and it goes up even more. It's light for the class, but it's not sub-500 pounds wet, never has been.
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:11 AM   #2231
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It looks like the adventure has shorter wheelbase and longer trail compared to adventure r. How does this affect the bikes in feel and stability?
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Old 02-15-2013, 05:40 AM   #2232
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Originally Posted by surfted View Post
It looks like the adventure has shorter wheelbase and longer trail compared to adventure r. How does this affect the bikes in feel and stability?
Probably the former has a more stable front end and a more forward and lower weight distribution.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:04 AM   #2233
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The Ducati wet weight figures weren't exactly realistic. Real-world numbers on a scale put it about 30 pounds heavier with a full tank of fuel than what Ducati claims. Add panniers/mounts and electronic suspension and it goes up even more. It's light for the class, but it's not sub-500 pounds wet, never has been.
US subscription only mag Motorcycle Consumer News measured the Multi at 503.5lbs wet, or 228.4kg.

Pretty sure they do theirs with full tank. They had the S-Sport model, so no panniers, no centrestand, and bits and pieces in carbon fibre.

KTM claims 230kg (507lbs) tank full for the Adventure 1190. Given the tank holds an extra 3 Litres and a centrestand is standard, that would put the core bike at Multi weight or slightly better.

But that is if KTM's claim can be replicated elsewhere.
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Old 02-15-2013, 07:08 AM   #2234
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I must admit, I was surprised to see that the GS was cheaper. Although the KTM is still cheaper than a Multi, yet Ducati seem to sell a lot of those!

KTM do seem to have got the styling wrong on the base 1190- far too bland. The R looks good though!
Believe it or not it's only paintwork and a short smoked screen

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Old 02-15-2013, 04:17 PM   #2235
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Hopefully picking mine up next week :)))))
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